Joe Allen

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23_Carra_Gold said:
I think the reason we paid so much for him was because Rodgers wanted someone he could trust to take up a position which in theory is one of the most important in his ideal system. While we could have got a player of the same ability for much less abroad there's the risk of them not adapting on suiting what Rodgers asked of them. Whether the extra money we paid so Rodgers could have a player he knew and trusted was a good decision remains to be seen.
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Allen was THE one that Rodgers wanted. We also had to pay through the nose considering we weren't supposed to be able to poach their players as part of the compensation agreement for getting Rodgers off Swansea. I think Allen's done alright but he's definitely dropped his performance level from when he first joined. Those first few games he got 90%+ pass success (only misplaced one pass in first game) but I would imagine he is nowhere near that now. I think Sigurdson would have made a difference to our signing had we signed him, possibly Dempsey too but that is more to do with us not having strikers.
 
He's ok, the game goes by him too much at the moment where he doesn't do a lot.

I don't think he has an assist to his name this season and definitely not a goal. The goal i'm not too bothered about, but to not have an assist to this 'passing genius' is really poor.
 
Rubbersoul said:
He's ok, the game goes by him too much at the moment where he doesn't do a lot.

I don't think he has an assist to his name this season and definitely not a goal. The goal i'm not too bothered about, but to not have an assist to this 'passing genius' is really poor.
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That's a little harsh because you can't earn an assist by yourself, you need someone else to help out by putting the ball in the net. Since our biggest problem this season (much like the last two years) is scoring goals. This is the only area that I have consistently defended Stewart Downing, he gets out wide and crosses the ball, he was doing it all last season too but we never have players in the bloody box! It takes two to make an assist!

However, scoring or providing assists isn't part of Allen's game, it is not why he is in the side. He is there to help maintain possession, be an option for everyone else and pass it on to another red shirt. He did this very well in the first half a dozen games at the club but he's not been doing it for a few games now and needs dropping. And I don't mean from the starting line-up to be brought on after sixty minutes, aka - the Fulham games <doh>
 
Crumpet said:
How is this being slated as a wumming article? Some of our fans on here are way to quick to jump the gun.

I like Allen, people forget he's just 22 years old and still learning his trade. People also seem to forget how brilliant he was in our first few games, including being Standard Chartered Player of the Month for August and being MOTM against a City team containing Yaya Touré. People also seem to forget that his form dipped coincedentally with the birth of his first child, which I would say is very understandable. He's a human being. A young man with a young family in a high pressure job still fitting into life in a different part of the country for one of the most famous football clubs in the world. Give the guy a break.

The fans on here just like a scapegoat for everything, at times it's been Skrtel, used to be Lucas; Kuyt even had a few digs given his way on the old 606, Johnson was mocked for his high price tag. I even see Gerrard criticised lately! He's by far one of our most influential players who can cut it with the best in the league, you all take his passing range and passion for the club for granted but mark my words we'll miss him when he's gone.

Fickle. The lot of you. Well most of you.

(Sorry for the rant, some attitudes on this forum wind me up)
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I agree with most of that mate especially the Gerrard part. However remember that sometimes it isn't scapegoating it's just commenting on individuals performances so far and Allen hasn't been good enough. The reasons you give are probably a fair explanation but as fans we are bound to demand higher standards than Joe has delivered so far. I watched Yaya closely at the City game (because he's a beast of a player) and he had an absolute stinker, it didn't have much to do with Allen.

Joes biggest problem is that he was our biggest signing of the summer, a summer where we should have been buying for the here and now as much as for the future. BR spent big on Joe because he thought he would come in and improve us straight awa but the Lucas injury forced him into a decision he got wrong in playing Allen deeper. That was always going to lead to problems for the team as it's such a difficult position to play at this level (ask Lucas).

Will Allen get better? Undoubtedly in my mind. He's got great, solid basics for a young player. Good passing, decent vision and pretty quick feet. He looks ridiculously lightweight at times but that's no different to how Lucas used to be (remember how many free kicks he used to concede after players breezed past him?). I actually think Allens got traditional Liverpool player stamped all over him. He reminds of Ronnie Whelan a bit. The kind of guy who will just do a job almost unnoticed but do it well. He'll be fine given time.
 
Gerrez said:
That's a little harsh because you can't earn an assist by yourself, you need someone else to help out by putting the ball in the net. Since our biggest problem this season (much like the last two years) is scoring goals. This is the only area that I have consistently defended Stewart Downing, he gets out wide and crosses the ball, he was doing it all last season too but we never have players in the bloody box! It takes two to make an assist!

However, scoring or providing assists isn't part of Allen's game, it is not why he is in the side. He is there to help maintain possession, be an option for everyone else and pass it on to another red shirt. He did this very well in the first half a dozen games at the club but he's not been doing it for a few games now and needs dropping. And I don't mean from the starting line-up to be brought on after sixty minutes, aka - the Fulham games <doh>
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I agree it takes two to make the assist, but can you remember a time where he has actually created a goal scoring opportunity for somebody? Maybe one or two but i can't honestly think of one.

Lucas does what you labelled plus much more, for me he is a player who let's the game go past him.
 
Rubbersoul said:
I agree it takes two to make the assist, but can you remember a time where he has actually created a goal scoring opportunity for somebody? Maybe one or two but i can't honestly think of one.

Lucas does what you labelled plus much more, for me he is a player who let's the game go past him.
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Can't argue with that, Lucas is by far superior IMO and is clearly our best option in the middle. Gerrard is next purely based on the lack of competition for his place. One of Sahin, Henderson, Allen or Shelvey for the third spot, I'd probably opt for Henderson allowing him and Gerrard to get forward <ok>
 
Gerrez said:
Allen was THE one that Rodgers wanted. We also had to pay through the nose considering we weren't supposed to be able to poach their players as part of the compensation agreement for getting Rodgers off Swansea. I think Allen's done alright but he's definitely dropped his performance level from when he first joined. Those first few games he got 90%+ pass success (only misplaced one pass in first game) but I would imagine he is nowhere near that now. I think Sigurdson would have made a difference to our signing had we signed him, possibly Dempsey too but that is more to do with us not having strikers.
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correct me if i'm wrong but the only way you could've bid for him was that if another club put a bid in for him.
 
the artist known as Billy El Pistolero said:
I agree with most of that mate especially the Gerrard part. However remember that sometimes it isn't scapegoating it's just commenting on individuals performances so far and Allen hasn't been good enough. The reasons you give are probably a fair explanation but as fans we are bound to demand higher standards than Joe has delivered so far. I watched Yaya closely at the City game (because he's a beast of a player) and he had an absolute stinker, it didn't have much to do with Allen.

Joes biggest problem is that he was our biggest signing of the summer, a summer where we should have been buying for the here and now as much as for the future. BR spent big on Joe because he thought he would come in and improve us straight awa but the Lucas injury forced him into a decision he got wrong in playing Allen deeper. That was always going to lead to problems for the team as it's such a difficult position to play at this level (ask Lucas).

Will Allen get better? Undoubtedly in my mind. He's got great, solid basics for a young player. Good passing, decent vision and pretty quick feet. He looks ridiculously lightweight at times but that's no different to how Lucas used to be (remember how many free kicks he used to concede after players breezed past him?). I actually think Allens got traditional Liverpool player stamped all over him. He reminds of Ronnie Whelan a bit. The kind of guy who will just do a job almost unnoticed but do it well. He'll be fine given time.
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Fair points all round there. I'm looking forward to seeing Joe grow into a Liverpool shirt.
 
Crumpet said:
How is this being slated as a wumming article? Some of our fans on here are way to quick to jump the gun.

I like Allen, people forget he's just 22 years old and still learning his trade. People also seem to forget how brilliant he was in our first few games, including being Standard Chartered Player of the Month for August and being MOTM against a City team containing Yaya Touré. People also seem to forget that his form dipped coincedentally with the birth of his first child, which I would say is very understandable. He's a human being. A young man with a young family in a high pressure job still fitting into life in a different part of the country for one of the most famous football clubs in the world. Give the guy a break.

The fans on here just like a scapegoat for everything, at times it's been Skrtel, used to be Lucas; Kuyt even had a few digs given his way on the old 606, Johnson was mocked for his high price tag. I even see Gerrard criticised lately! He's by far one of our most influential players who can cut it with the best in the league, you all take his passing range and passion for the club for granted but mark my words we'll miss him when he's gone.

Fickle. The lot of you. Well most of you.

(Sorry for the rant, some attitudes on this forum wind me up)
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Good post that.

Hendo and Allen with Gerrard playing as a quarter-back behind them seemed to work v QPR. Saying that, it was v QPR.
 
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