This would make no difference to any views of the anti-bates brigade. They are not interested in what he does and whether its right or wrong. They hate the 'chelsea scum' (which is exactly why people hate, because he's chelsea). They say bullshit the second he opens his mouth before he has even finished his sentence, no one cares what he say because its already wrong before he has finished when in actual fact most of the time its a sensible thing to say. Get this right though, I am not a defender of bates, its just appears that way because I am not so blindly guided by other peoples views. I have my own opinion and thats not changed because of someone else's opinion is different or I am pressured to thinking differently which it appears is the way the anti-bates brigade was started.
With respect mate, **** off. I had an absolutely splitting headache on Saturday from shouting my tits off in support of the team, and I was let down once again. What did you do, say 'come on' in the direction of the radio a couple of times? Supporting the CLUB requires you not to support those who are destroying it.
1. Took me a while to figure out who you were, almost wrote a different kind of response. 2. I ****ing hate not being at elland road every game. ****ing kills me and you don't understand how much that gets to me 3. Saying with respect before any sentence does not give you the licence to say anything after it. 4. I feel you are more interested in anti-bates than how the team are performing 5. I agree with your final argument however your perception of that is different to mine. I respect people who genuinely feel that bates is destroying the club (i.e. you) because they are doing what they feel is necessarry to make the club great but that doesn't mean that they are right, it just means they think they are right
Fair enough, but I think your claim to be supporting the team more than people who are actually... supporting the team... is pretty laughable and a bit insulting. My ideal situations for Leeds United: 1. Bates leaves now and we get new owners who take us to the Premiership. 2. Bates stays but we still somehow get promoted. 3. We get new owners but stay in Div 2. 4. Bates stays and we get in Div 2. There's no prioritizing between 'Bates out' and 'support team'; the two are intrinsically and inseparably linked. Well it's your task to tell me why my thoughts are wrong then, I suppose. Fact of the matter is, Leeds United have millions of fans around the globe and only 24,000 of them filter through the turnstiles every other week. There's obviously something in that fact that tells you people are unwilling to watch the team at the moment due to whatever reason.
I don't claim that and if I implied it then I immediately take it back, I don't feel that I support the team more than any other leeds supporter, In fact I support them less because of my position globally They are also my same priorites believe it or not but i see nothing wrong with having No. 2 because its quite easy to see No. 3 happen if the club does get taken over As much as it sounds silly more than anything, I think bates was hated when he first took over because he is chelsea and leeds fans didn't like that. I think its a combination or errors from Bates and errors that Grayson made which the blame was passed onto Bates. It then got made out to be bigger than what it was and has spirraled from there
He was indeed hated when he first came for that reason, although I don't see how that undermines the very valid arguments against him. You could even argue that it's because of his Chelsea links that he's adopted such an aggressive manner with Leeds fans and is making such a mockery of our club in the press - turning us into a national laughing stock, in other words. Even if you ignore the tactical playing side of things which is obviously not his fault (although the standard of players is), he's got us operating at 35% turnover to wages ratio (lower midtable wage budget, the lowest wage ratio in England and absolutely nothing to get promoted with), he's lied to the fans week after week, he's failed to rebuy our stadium and training ground which he promised to do, he's failed to get investment which he promised to do, he's sold among our best players and lost many others by failing to negotiate sanely with them, he's wasted millions on pointless **** which we don't care about and his PR has been a disgrace. Keep ignoring what he's done to the playing side of the club if you want, but the rest can't be disputed and can't be excused. For those reasons alone, anyone should still see that he's having a cancerous influence on the club's progress.
And you can't see that something doesn't add up? We're paying some of the highest ticket and merchandise prices in the country, everything is an absolute rip off yet we're no where near competing in terms of wage budgets in a league where we have the largest fan base by a margin so large it doesn't even need mentioning. On top of that players are getting sold and the money is magically disappearing. It cost £7 million to develop the ground. What happened to the rest of it? Where did that magically go off to? Why are we developing a ground we don't own? Why do you keep sidestepping these issues that make it blatantly obvious that the club isn't being run properly? If it's the right way to do things and it's the fans fault and the fans are holding us back, why don't we own Elland Road? Why don't we own Thorpe Arch? Where has all the money gone? There's been millions of pounds, more than enough to fulfil these basic objectives that should have been above all else, that has gone missing to places we don't even know about. Bates has spent club money on his personal legal bills. What more do you need to see that he is not running the club the way it should be run? What will it take for you to see that the majority of any money we're supplying (considering we're paying well over the odds for little to no return) is getting spent on anything but Leeds United? Howson left because he didn't feel the clubs ambition matched his own, simple as that. He was waiting to sign a contract to see what the clubs ambition was, and the club showed **** all, bringing in ****ty loan signings to paper over the cracks. Blame Grayson all you want but I guarantee he was told it's all he can have. I don't believe a single word out of that piss ant bates mouth and I've no reason to. He's lied time and time again yet you still find reason to believe anything he says? I'd love to have you as a mate, I could get you to do anything and promise you the world and never deliver and you'd continue to blindly trust me.
Because he is a lying bastard who hasn't delivered on a single promise he's made in years. We don't trust him because he's consistently and repeatedly given us more than enough reason to not trust a word he says. He hasn't said a sensible thing and his arguments towards anything are so flimsy. He's not even Chelsea, he just owned Chelsea for a while. If you put any research in you'll find he's actually a QPR fan.
And it's taken seven years to get to that point. Wow well done, you've got rid of the debt and got us back to square one over the course of THREE QUARTERS OF A DECADE. Genius, Bates. Name me one person who actually thinks like that. Either you wanted Grayson in or Grayson out, no-one used Grayson staying as a stick to beat Bates with except Clivetime, and his views were entirely consistent. Could have been kept and made to want to stay. Obviously the Villa move hasn't worked out or he wouldn't be with us now. We could have persuaded him of that beforehand and kept him regardless if necessary like we did with Beckford. And even if you ignore that, you can't ignore the fact that his fee hasn't been reinvested whatsoever. Would have signed a new contract with us if we hadn't ****ed up. No-one knows how much he wanted. I agree there was no need to keep him, but Grayson wanted him and Bates failed to back his manager. That's a mistake regardless of what the fans think about the particular player. It's not for the Chairman to make footballing decisions unless he's also a scout or something. Wanted equality. See above. Nope, he wanted to stay before we ****ed up with negotiations. It was only then that he got a sudden desire to leave - according to the ever-reliable club anyway. We should have tied him down ages ago. Once again, a short-sighted view is being taken. Don't tell me we couldn't have got Jonny Howson to stay if we'd had the right ambition. The place is completely devoid of it with Bates at the helm. Howson was his favourite player. Don't tell me Grayson wanted to lose him. They have to be hurt in the short-term in order to get Bates out. What's more important to you, us getting loads through the gates in the short-term and Bates getting to build the hotel with the proceeds, or Leeds United getting new ownership and having a secure future? Unless you can provide evidence for that, I won't believe you. There are dozens of clubs in the world whose fans are actively protesting, and none of them suffer from not being able to sign players. It's just that for the most part, their Chairmen and boards are incompetent and can't/won't do so. Misplaced sarcasm there. We know there has been interest from investors, it's just that Bates' insults and brash manner put them off. See: Frank Lowy. We've already tried ploughing millions in the club and we saw it thrown away in a disgraceful way by Bates. Why should we be blindly optimistic that the situation will suddenly change and we'll get a promotion?
In fact, he is Chelsea and has been known to sing their chants at Leeds events when pissed. It comes as no surprise that he now supports the major rivals of his own boyhood club, such is his lack of loyalty and moral fibre. Anyway your overall point is right, he's a lying **** and I'd like Josh to point out all these places where people have accused him of lying and not been 100% bang on correct. When so much **** comes out of his mouth, it's hard to imagine he's going to chuck up roses in his next outburst.
That is the most ridiculous, clueless and insulting comment ive ever read on the matter!. How the **** can you blame the fans!. You really are blind to the whole situation. Bates has brainwashed you like he tried to do with everyone with his constant bullshit Just wait till he spends £80 million on the hotels and it go's tits up. Then your view will change.
Yes it will and Im pissed off that he is planning on doing that and I do point back to where I said a lot of fans are more interesting in getting rid of bates than they are supporting the team. you do not realise that by not going to the games you are not giving leeds united any money just as much as bates, bates isn't going to stop so this means it takes longer for the money to come in and sets back leeds united years. All I see is that Leeds United are not in debt, we are spending money on the overall club not just the team (although I would like it if money was spent on the team but I don't think grayson helped his cause in anyway whatsoever) and we are moving forward year by year over the last few years, the first time in so very long. We are going to be set up beautifully well when we reach the premier league and will keep moving forward because of it. People who say Bates doesn't have the ambition to get into the prem, he wouldn't have sacked Grayson otherwise
I believe there is a fair chance josh lufc , is not a Leeds fan but merely a talented WUM.. That or he is actually Ken Bates. Which if true, backs my argument up that he is a none Leeds fan!..
I gave up trying to make Josh see sense long ago. I found myself going round in circles with him and anyone who can't see the obvious doesn't deserve my time. Point out to him an unarguable fact and he vanishes from the thread. He is another Clivetime, okay not the same opinions but one who sees things though blinkered vision. For the record I had no opinion on Bates when he joined the club, he went down in my opinion when he allowed us to go into receivership and when he LIED about the Delph money and he hit rock bottom when his lack of ambition became apparent with the lack of funding. So I was not a bates hater from the start, I was open minded. Josh some of these Leeds players you moan about as being Grayson wasting valuable money you were sticking up for at the start saying how they are prolific goal scorers, how we need xyz etc, you change your opinion like the wind and I agree you are becoming well know on this forum for being more of a WUM than a supporter.
The problem here is that you've eaten up all the bullshit that bates has been spouting for years. You genuinely believe that the money going into things that aren't the team is going to help the club in the long run, it's not. You've been told it's for the good of the club, it's to make Elland Road into a 365 day money spinner to fund the club, but it's not. The fact that the ground isn't owned by the club sets of alarm bells all over the place. The fact that it's owned by an offshore business with anonymous owners basically tells us that ken bates or one of his crook mates owns it. Even if someone buys the club, bates will refuse to sell us the ground back and then suddenly all these developments that have cost the club money will be bringing in money that the club sees nothing of. On top of the extortionate rental rates the club is paying. You've been fed lies Josh. I'm astonished you can still believe the corporate line that anything that's being done is for the good of the club, because it's just not. If it was for the good of the club, then these crappy developments wouldn't eat into transfer funds. The "warchest" plus the 7 million for development of the east stand is a sum of less than £19 million, no where near what we're expecting our turnover is. Where's the rest of it going? Ground rental, bates legal fees, anything that isn't the goddamn playing staff. The fact that club money is being spent developing a ground that the club doesn't own should be enough to show you that bates is not doing anything for the good of the club, he's just setting us further back and into a deeper hole with each pointless hate-filled move.
