IT NEEDS TO STOP

[Mckechnie Orange]

I would say the occasional roll out to the wing is okay. But if it has to go back to the GK, then the idea hasn’t worked and at this moment, it should be cleared.

If you think that then you're missing the point of the tactic. It goes along the back to draw their press and create gaps behind it. If the midfield is already marked up then the space is already behind so the ball needs to go there and not to a marked player already under pressure. It was the wrong decision from Ingram to try and find Woods, not the tactic per se that led to Blackpool goal.

If we just hit it long with all our forwards marked up then it just comes straight back when we're already committed forward with gaps in our own midfield and defence.

That's why we were averaging 3 conceded in the latter days of Shota and Daws and why it's only 1 or so conceded on average under Rosenior - just it's more obvious when it's a mistake in our back line leads more directly to a goal than it was when we were making more mistakes gifting posession further up the pitch.

The end result is fewer conceded under Rosenior, and though some fans feel its more kamikaze defensively, it isn't as is backed up by the improved defensive record and the fact we're not dead and buried by half time in every game and having only lost just once whilst we've been playing that way.

 

[Drew]

If you think that then you're missing the point of the tactic. It goes along the back to draw their press and create gaps behind it. If the midfield is already marked up then the space is already behind so it needs to go there.

If we just hit it long with all our forwards marked up then it just comes straight back when we're already committed forward 2ith gaps in our own defence. That's why we were averaging 3 conceded in the latter days of Shota and Daws and why it's only 1 or so conceded on average under Rosenior - just it's more obvious when it's a mistake in our back line leads more directly to a goal than it was when we were making more mistakes further up the pitch.

The result is fewer conceded under Rosenior though some fans feel its more kamikaze defensively. It isn't as is backed up by the improved defensive record and the fact we're not dead and buried by half time in every game having just once whilst we've been playing that way.

Can we make every fan read this before the next game?

I appreciate some may still not want to play the tactic but at least there’ll be more understanding of what they are trying to do.

 

[DuaneDarby18]

If you think that then you're missing the point of the tactic. It goes along the back to draw their press and create gaps behind it. If the midfield is already marked up then the space is already behind so it needs to go there.

If we just hit it long with all our forwards marked up then it just comes straight back when we're already committed forward 2ith gaps in our own defence. That's why we were averaging 3 conceded in the latter days of Shota and Daws and why it's only 1 or so conceded on average under Rosenior - just it's more obvious when it's a mistake in our back line leads more directly to a goal than it was when we were making more mistakes further up the pitch.

The result is fewer conceded under Rosenior though some fans feel its more kamikaze defensively. It isn't as is backed up by the improved defensive record and the fact we're not dead and buried by half time in every game having just once whilst we've been playing that way.

I’d like to agree. But we should have had more wins under Rosenior considering the opponents we’ve faced IMO. We certainly need at least one win in the next two. After that, there are tougher teams to play.

 

[rovertiger]

**** me, we've only lost one since Rosie arrived and some want him out. **** me

 

[TIGERSCAVE]

Can we make every fan read this before the next game?

I appreciate some may still not want to play the tactic but at least there’ll be more understanding of what they are trying to do.

The problem is Drew, is that we are telegraphing what we are 'attempting' to do... they know it wont be hit long, so they can press the back line and the midfield... as we are playing a lone striker in Oscar, their defence is under no pressure.. their full backs can compress the midfield so therefore there is no out ball. We do NOT have someone who spots a pass a mile off. In this league, there are far more savvy coaches than LR at this stage of his career...

 

[Walter Sobchak]

What an embarrassing thread.

 

[Mckechnie Orange]

I’d like to agree. But we should have had more wins under Rosenior considering the opponents we’ve faced IMO. We certainly need at least one win in the next two. After that, there are tougher teams to play.

We have Wigan and Huddersfield before the end of the month don't we? TBH if we reproduce that Watford performance then Brum are beatable also.

You can look at the table, see us in 21st and **** the bed as some are, but you can also say that we're 6 points off top 10 the league is so tight and whilst we do need to start turning the draws into wins, we're level on points with 4 other sides and showing a bit more promise.

 

[dennisboothstash]

I like it

 

[Mckechnie Orange]

The problem is Drew, is that we are telegraphing what we are 'attempting' to do... they know it wont be hit long, so they can press the back line and the midfield... as we are playing a lone striker in Oscar, their defence is under no pressure.. their full backs can compress the midfield so therefore there is no out ball. We do NOT have someone who spots a pass a mile off. In this league, there are far more savvy coaches than LR at this stage of his career...

Rosie come out and said it needs to go long when their press is already high. That's how he's telling them to play, not to play it out every time. I think once we have a bit more pace available then balls into the channels will become more of a proposition. Certainly quicker movement will give the keeper or deep lying players more long options going forward.

 

[TIGERSCAVE]

Rosie come out and said it needs to go long when their press is already high. That's how he's telling them to play, not to play it out every time. I think once we have a bit more pace available then balls into the channels will become more of a proposition. Certainly quicker movement will give the keeper or deep lying players more long options going forward.

The sending off today was a perfect example then. Allahyar likely scores, Oscar as I said at the time didnt have the pace.

 

[Mckechnie Orange]

The sending off today was a perfect example then. Allahyar likely scores, Oscar as I said at the time didnt have the pace.

Oscar scored, hit the bar and was denied a clear goalscoring opportunity leading to the red. I don't think he's the best example of something that wasn't working, as it clearly was in his case.

 

[TIGERSCAVE]

Oscar scored, hit the bar and was denied a clear goalscoring opportunity leading to the red. I don't think he's the best example of something that wasn't working, as it clearly was in his case.

MO we are never going to agree, so we'll agree to disagree...

 

[DuaneDarby18]

What an embarrassing thread.

Or a good talking point? Clearly there’s a good debate going on here which has some interesting opinions.

Can only see one person embarrassing themselves when that’s all they have to say and nothing constructive to offer.

 

[Amin Arrears]

The sending off today was a perfect example then. Allahyar likely scores, Oscar as I said at the time didnt have the pace.

Oscar had done him for pace, that’s why the defender resorted to taking his legs whilst still outside the box. If he hadn’t done that, he gets the 1 v 1.

 

[Mckechnie Orange]

Oscar had done him for pace, that’s why the defender resorted to taking his legs whilst still outside the box. If he hadn’t done that, he gets the 1 v 1.

It's also notable there was no one else in the picture because all our pace is out injured or just coming back.

 

[DuaneDarby18]

We have Wigan and Huddersfield before the end of the month don't we? TBH if we reproduce that Watford performance then Brum are beatable also.

You can look at the table, see us in 21st and **** the bed as some are, but you can also say that we're 6 points off top 10 the league is so tight and whilst we do need to start turning the draws into wins, we're level on points with 4 other sides and showing a bit more promise.

I agree there. I am of the opinion that we should be a top half side, given the players we have. We definitely look better under Rosenior than Shota. I just think we need to stop this dangerous play and we will see better results. We were much the better team before Blackpool scored that goal and should have gone on to win the game.

 

[HCAFCHangout]

Whilst I get the passing round the back can be stressful. You know what else needs to stop? The berating of our players while in the phase of play. Opposition can sense it and smell blood I have no doubt and our lot may panic into a mistake.

Haven't had a home atmosphere in a while that feels like its supporting the players and this crap aint helping

 

[Drew]

The problem is Drew, is that we are telegraphing what we are 'attempting' to do... they know it wont be hit long, so they can press the back line and the midfield... as we are playing a lone striker in Oscar, their defence is under no pressure.. their full backs can compress the midfield so therefore there is no out ball. We do NOT have someone who spots a pass a mile off. In this league, there are far more savvy coaches than LR at this stage of his career...

I don’t fully disagree, but Rome wasn’t built in a day and the players and the coach are learning. The more they do it, the better it gets and the more the players know when it’s a good idea and when it’s not.

I also think the pace of the passing needs to pick up at times and the tempo needs to be changed when appropriate, but all that can come.

What’s certainly not helpful is when the crowd is getting on the teams back because they aren’t playing it long.

As has been said, results are better so clearly this is conceding fewer goals than Shota’s alternative, so I’m not sure why there’s so much panic. We need to give it more time and let Rosie work within the transfer window to tweak the squad.

 

[Mckechnie Orange]

I don’t fully disagree, but Rome wasn’t built in a day and the players and the coach are learning. The more they do it, the better it gets and the more the players know when it’s a good idea and when it’s not.

I also think the pace of the passing needs to pick up at times and the tempo needs to be changed when appropriate, but all that can come.

What’s certainly not helpful is when the crowd is getting on the teams back because they aren’t playing it long.

As has been said, results are better so clearly this is conceding fewer goals than Shota’s alternative, so I’m not sure why there’s so much panic. We need to give it more time and let Rosie work within the transfer window to tweak the squad.

There have been periods in all Rosies games which have been promising - we just need to get that win and the confidence that brings and we'll be fine.

 

[Gone For A Walk]

I left the ground thinking just what you've posted Kempton.
A(nother) gifting of a goal from an(other) horrendous piece of decision making doesn't help. But 'IT' goes far beyond that.
The reality is, we have problems & shortcomings all over the place. Answers and better quality reinforcements have to be found or we really are in danger of going back down
Another 'IT' that has to stop, is Rosenior playing Greaves as a LB. It's ridiculous. I understand why he initially did it, but a) he's not a LB, which means we are badly missing out on what even a half decent LB would contribute, and b) he's the only CB who can bring the ball forward from CB with any quality, so playing him at LB means we are missing out on that too.
Seri and Tufan are quality. Maybe include Oscar, and also Sinik when he gets given a chance. The rest really aren't that good, have little consistency, and some just aren't good enough at all. As well as the missing quality and consistency of those players, they also don't offer the needed physicality, pace, nous - that much was once again so blatantly obvious today. There's effort but most just aren't that good ... as Kempton is rightly saying. This isn't some knee jerk reaction; it's been building for a while. We think it's going to somehow click, when the players get the hang of Rosenior's master plan, when we get Oscar back, if only we start with Tufan, if Jones moves to CM, etc etc. It doesn't click, because most are just not good enough. How many of these would be snapped up by and be made starters in a top half Championship side - the keepers, Coyle, Christie, Jones, McL, Fig, Woods, Longman, Smith, Slater, Doc? The honest answer is probably none. Without a strong foundation and spine to our team, the quality of Seri and Tufan is nowhere near enough.
One final question. What the heck is Rosenior's 'unique' method that he talked about? I see nothing unique, just a team like many others trying to build from the back, but maybe a little bit more obsessively than most, and a little less capable of it than most, with glaring deficiencies all over the place.
We desperately need Allayhar & Tetteh back, hitting the ground running, at least a small handful of quality additions in January, a LB playing LB, and for the keeper & defence to know when to build from the back v's when it's not the right time to **** about.