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Home-Grown Magpies

Discussion in 'Newcastle United' started by Marchy, Apr 18, 2012.

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  1. Warmir Pouchov

    Warmir Pouchov Better than JPF

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    Its not realistic to think the English players who aren't the top class boys have the option of playing abroad. They're not interested in those players. You have to be given the opportunity first. Plenty do go and do the trials abroad in the likes of Netherlands, Scandanavia and Belgium. And guess what? Very few are wanted by the German, Dutch and Belgian clubs. Some get opportunities in the US and Scandanavia but that is mainly to do with a number of english coaches working there. The Germans, Dutch and belgians look and say "well he's alright but no better than this lad I have here who is from Germany (or Holland or Belgium)" That is the reality of the situation and you can't blame them. You should always look locally first. One of the jobs of the clubs in this country if the system was working correctly is to produce national team players for England. Not everyone agrees with that and think only about their own clubs interests. Its understandable because the national team has been poorly cared for in this country and people have lost faith in our archaic system.

    Unfortunately because we have been producing a relatively low number of quality players with high technical levels, they are just not attractive to foreign clubs. Plus the youngsters who come from France, Africa and god knows where else, don't come to England on to further their education in the main, they come for the money!

    I honestly don't know how you can possibly think having a smaller pool at the top level is not harmful. It blatantly is. Why are the Americans the best at athletics for instance? Because they have the largest pool to choose from. The creative tension that creates forces standards up. Its the same in football. The proof is in the pudding with Spain to be honest.

    Its about opportunity too. When Spain set out 15 years ago to right the wrongs in their system to ensure the major tournament disappointments were a thing of the past, one of the key things they identified was getting clubs on board to afford opportunities to Spanish coaches and spanish players. The likes of Barcelona, Real, Athletico etc bought into this and we now have the Barca side and national side we see today as a result. We need that 34% to be a lot higher to help our game. Have a look around the coaches lists for the Spanish clubs, its littered with unknown guys who have simply come off the coaching conveyor belt. The youth squads are packed to the brim not with foreign talent (they do cherry pick the best), they are jam packed with Spanish guys.

    I'm afraid if we continue down the route of "just hire the best regardless of nationality" then you have to accept you can't have a successful national side. That is unacceptable to me. I'm not saying everyone has to agree because not everyone is patriotic or gives two hoots about the national team!
     
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  2. Freddd

    Freddd Well-Known Member

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    I know this point of view is universally acknowledged to be the truth, but I think it's bollocks.

    If the Prem was exclusively composed of English players, that wouldn't mean there were more top class English players. It would simply mean that the Prem was populated by a lot of second rate English players. We could lower the quality of the Prem by insisting on English players only - - we can't improve the quality of English players by insisting on English players only.

    At the moment, every top class English player plays in the Prem. What interest would the national squad have in those players who aren't good enough to make the current Premiership grade ?

    The difference between England and Spain is that, due as you correctly poitn out to their imporvd coaching standards, there are enough good Spanish players to hold down the majority of places in Spanish teams. But that is the way the process works: you start with producing good players and you end up with a lot of your players holding down places in your league. Not the other way around
     
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  3. Warmir Pouchov

    Warmir Pouchov Better than JPF

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    As I said at the start the quality must come first. Our head burying exercise has put us back a long way coaching wise. The old "we invented the game mentality" "we're as good as them anyway" attitudes just held us back. We are now producing a better quality of player hopefully in a more abundant manner. There is a danger though. Its no good producing all these quality young players, but not giving the environment to develop. The cream of the players you produce need opportunity to play and develop their understanding of top level football. The problem this country has is that the league is very much money driven. Clubs don't want to take the risk on some young English player because the risk attached to putting faith in them as opposed to an already established foreign counterpart is obvious. I don't mind the very best foreign players who come to this country. They add value. But the also rans who we pick because it is easier than developing your own talent, need weeded out over the next few years. I have faith that the current system put in place by Brooking will will us start to produce more quality young English players. Those boys should get first chance by the club above any foreign short cut.

    We haven't been producing the quality players so the problem has developed. As I say it wouldn't happen in Germany, Spain, Holland because they have all been through it and reacted by investing in youth systems and coaching before it got anywhere needing 66% foreign talent to prop up their league. But Spain have been the shrewest by getting the clubs to buy in before the process starts to ensure that opportunity is there.

    My point is this country should be moving towards getting the number of English players playing in the top division above 50% asap. I'm not saying pick 2nd rate players over foreign players. I'm saying create a situation where the English players are equally as good if not better choice and give them preference. This will help the national team massively. The England manager will then have more English players competing for each position in his squad and they'll be right on his door stop bar the top guys who have decided to develop further abroad. The bigger the pool you create, the higher the standards will be pushed. Obviously you think this is bollocks which is fair enough, but history strongly suggests its the case across just about all sports.
     
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  4. It's_all_Greek_to_me

    It's_all_Greek_to_me Well-Known Member

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    Perfect example of a homegrown system - Athletic Bilbao. Only Basque players and they've produced some gems over the years. Would be great if one day if we could field a side full of Geordies. Won't happen though. The problem with this country is that the coaching and whole football philosophy is messed up. Under 12's shouldn't be playing on full size 11 a side pitches or for that matter playing in 'competitive' competitions. They should be out there working on their basic core technique. I laugh when people say they're kids are going to be amazing players. No they're not. They'll be average at best. This country will never produce a national side full of world class internationals. Amongst the current crop I would only say maybe Rooney and Ashley Cole come into that category. Change the way kids are coached. Bring in foreign coaches to work with kids. Teach kids how to pass a football, use both feet, work on control, dribbling.
     
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