Match Day Thread General Match Thread

[Dier Hard]

What do you think has changed? Both periods had Levy in charge at the top. Why were we more successful when we had less money to spend? There is no doubt that the Pochettino squad was sensational value for money but ENIC/Levy out was already a thing even then.

Because I think we needed to be more thoughtful. Every signing mattered to the budget and it felt like players were genuinely scouted with the intention of fitting Spurs’ “to dare is to do” motto. Now it feels because we have more money we’ll just chuck it at the first name in a hat. Some of the signings we’ve made have just made little to no sense. Many of us as “arm chair specialists” could tell a signing wasn’t going to work, how on earth have people on thousands of pounds a week not seen as such?

Maybe I’m revising history but I rarely remember Spurs making numerous catastrophic signings during the WHL years in quick succession. In the last few years alone we’ve wasted monumental amounts of money on the likes of Richarlison, Simons, Gallagher etc.

 

[Saf]

The only out of the ordinary success was Mourinho winning the CL with Porto. Everything else was pretty normal.

Behave.

Sir Alex Ferguson broke the monopoly on Celtic and Rangers winning the league and then followed up with European success beating Real Madrid in the final.

What’s pretty normal about that?


Klopp went to Dortmund and toppled Bayern. Two seasons in a row. He took them to a Champions league final and broke the league record for number of points in a season.

What’s normal about that?

 

[KingHotspur]

The whole point of the stadium and the training ground is to improve the team. The stadium has enabled us to spend an extra £100m per year on transfers. Do you honestly think we would be better if we hadn't done that?

We’ll never know but in a way I think it’s made them complacent by thinking that extra income means untouchable.

 

[KingHotspur]

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[Citizen Kane.]

We’ll never know but in a way I think it’s made them complacent by thinking that extra income means untouchable.

Agreed.

It's symptomatic of the world we live in.

People constantly confusing cost for value.

Which is how we've ended up with a society of bellends breaking down shop doors to buy bottles of Prime for £20 a pop.

Levy's comments about spending £60m on Richarlison as a measure of ambition were damning. He may have cost £60m but his value is 50p.

 

[Citizen Kane.]

What do you think has changed? Both periods had Levy in charge at the top. Why were we more successful when we had less money to spend? There is no doubt that the Pochettino squad was sensational value for money but ENIC/Levy out was already a thing even then.

It starts with a lack of an overarching philosophy permeating the whole club.

We can point to numerous examples of teams, some smaller than us (Brighton, Brentford, Bmouth) and some larger (City, Arsenal) where there is a clear philosophy, everyone is singing from the same hymn sheet, and the club tries to sign players (and managers) who align with that.

It is for the same reason that those clubs are able to consistently funnel academy players into the first team, because they've been exposed to the philosophy throughout their formative years.

As much as certain members of our forum try to engage in mental acrobatics to argue otherwise, just lining up our last half a dozen managerial appointments screams of a club that is simply making it up as it goes along.

From Poch's high intensity press, to Mourinho's low block with rapid counters, to Nuno's ultra defensive with emphasis on dominating the channels, to Conte's focus on wing play, to Ange's all-out attack, to Frank's supposedly more measured and pragmatic approach, we have flip-flopped from style to style which has left us with a Frankenstein's Monster of a squad and a sterile academy.

There is no joined up thinking anymore and hasn't been since we moved to the fecking stadium.

 

[Citizen Kane.]

What do you think has changed? Both periods had Levy in charge at the top. Why were we more successful when we had less money to spend? There is no doubt that the Pochettino squad was sensational value for money but ENIC/Levy out was already a thing even then.

It starts with a lack of an overarching philosophy permeating the whole club.

We can point to numerous examples of teams, some smaller than us (Brighton, Brentford, Bmouth) and some larger (City, Arsenal) where there is a clear philosophy, everyone is singing from the same hymn sheet, and the club tries to sign players (and managers) who align with that.

It is for the same reason that those clubs are able to consistently funnel academy players into the first team, because they've been exposed to the philosophy throughout their formative years.

As much as certain members of our forum try to engage in mental acrobatics to argue otherwise, just lining up our last half a dozen managerial appointments screams of a club that is simply making it up as it goes along.

From Poch's high intensity press, to Mourinho's low block with rapid counters, to Nuno's ultra defensive with emphasis on dominating the channels, to Conte's focus on wing play, to Ange's all-out attack, to Frank's supposedly more measured and pragmatic approach, we have flip-flopped from style to style which has left us with a Frankenstein's Monster of a squad and a sterile academy.

There is no joined up thinking anymore and hasn't been since we moved to the fecking stadium.

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

It starts with a lack of an overarching philosophy permeating the whole club.

From Poch's high intensity press, to Mourinho's low block with rapid counters, to Nuno's ultra defensive with emphasis on dominating the channels, to Conte's focus on wing play, to Ange's all-out attack, to Frank's supposedly more measured and pragmatic approach, we have flip-flopped from style to style which has left us with a Frankenstein's Monster of a squad and a sterile academy.

There is no joined up thinking anymore and hasn't been since we moved to the fecking stadium.

Except that really isn't the case

Poch's football had been sitting deeper and deeper for his last two seasons entirely because he was adding more of a counterattacking focus (whether by choice or due to the hard pressing taking its toll on players is up for debate) so it wasn't the lurch from one style to another when the ubermensch came in, Nuno was a stopgap for Conte even if there wasn't their player profiles weren't 1:1 as demonstrated by Emerson Royal wasn't such a lurch either, while Conte to Ange was flipping from one side of the coin go the other as both used WBs as the main attacking fulcrum while both used their CMs to recycle out wide rather than create

Obviously there's gaps in there, such as Conte/Ange CMs being less suited to Frank's quick-passing on the counter or the aforementioned Emerson clearly not being suited for Conte's WB-focused system, but the main issue is managers inheriting gaps yet these aren't addressed such as how modern DMs operate like Rhodri/Wharton/Norgaard yet that type of player hasn't been on our shopping list a single time in the past eighteen months in spite both Ange and Frank needing somebody of that profile

 

[remembercolinlee]

What do you think has changed? Both periods had Levy in charge at the top. Why were we more successful when we had less money to spend? There is no doubt that the Pochettino squad was sensational value for money but ENIC/Levy out was already a thing even then.

The thing that has changed is that we have become arrogant as a club.

They behaved arrogantly towards regular staff by threatening to furlough them on 80% of their wages (even though the savings were pityfully low) during Covid while they kept their full salary.

They arrogantly believed we should be part of the European Super League.

They arrogantly believed that we could get a top manager after sacking JM but the search became a farce and we ended up with Nuno.

They have acted arrogantly towards elderly fans by announcing they were getting rid of pensioner ticket discounts.

They have acted arrogantly towards many long term fans (who turned up throughout the dark times of 1992-2005 and who kept turning up at the wembley **** hole week in week out) by pricing many of us out of most league games at the new ground.

They acted arrogantly by deciding not to spend in January when it was obvious we desperately needed new players.

They acted arrogantly believing we could drift through the rest of the season cos we were too big to go down.

They acted arrogantly when sending out an email in February this year saying that they were going to freeze ticket prices next season and lower Newcastle to a catagory B game tp make it cheaper as though we are not in danger of going down.

Arrogance leads directly to incompetence and we have acted incompetently at several points over the past 7 years.

Sacking Pochettino just months after signing four players for £130m and expecting a diametrically opposite type of manager (JM) to get a tune out of them was incompetent.

Everything about the timing of sacking JM and appointing Nuno screams incompetence.

Signing Richarlison, not replacing Son, not replacing Vicario, bringing in Tudor with (no prem experience) to save us, spending well over a hundred million and sacking the manager before the sessons end ... not once but 4 times in 7 yrs :

1. Pochettino 19/20
2. JM 20/21
3. Conte 22/23
4. Frank 25/26

all point to incompetence...no one competentent makes the same mistake over and over again.

It strikes me as extremely incompetent to take a top 4 placed team for 4 straight seasons who made it to the CL final and a team who'd been in European Football for 14 out of 15 years and take them to the brink of relegation within 7 years ...after spending close on £750m and having 7 managers in that time...only one of which who lasted a who season.

 

[Billy The Spur]

Banter FC.

A football club run by Buffoons.

Business first, football second.

A recipe for sporting failure.

ENIC OUT.

 

[Spurlock]

Yup we are arrogant as Colin says

We think we are a club that just needs to turn up because we have money

We are imposters at the top table, we don't belong there. The owners think we do because we have money but the Footballing world doesn't see it like that, the ultimate currency is success on the pitch not off it like our owners are trying to fob us off with year after year

The cockerel is coming home to roost

 

[Spurf]

Colin?Colin? Oh yes RCL.

Never thought of him as Colin

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

The thing that has changed is that we have become arrogant as a club.

They behaved arrogantly towards regular staff by threatening to furlough them on 80% of their wages (even though the savings were pityfully low) during Covid while they kept their full salary.

They arrogantly believed we should be part of the European Super League.

They arrogantly believed that we could get a top manager after sacking JM but the search became a farce and we ended up with Nuno.

They have acted arrogantly towards elderly fans by announcing they were getting rid of pensioner ticket discounts.

They have acted arrogantly towards many long term fans (who turned up throughout the dark times of 1992-2005 and who kept turning up at the wembley **** hole week in week out) by pricing many of us out of most league games at the new ground.

They acted arrogantly by deciding not to spend in January when it was obvious we desperately needed new players.

They acted arrogantly believing we could drift through the rest of the season cos we were too big to go down.

They acted arrogantly when sending out an email in February this year saying that they were going to freeze ticket prices next season and lower Newcastle to a catagory B game tp make it cheaper as though we are not in danger of going down.

Arrogance leads directly to incompetence and we have acted incompetently at several points over the past 7 years.

Sacking Pochettino just months after signing four players for £130m and expecting a diametrically opposite type of manager (JM) to get a tune out of them was incompetent.

Everything about the timing of sacking JM and appointing Nuno screams incompetence.

Signing Richarlison, not replacing Son, not replacing Vicario, bringing in Tudor with (no prem experience) to save us, spending well over a hundred million and sacking the manager before the sessons end ... not once but 4 times in 7 yrs :

1. Pochettino 19/20
2. JM 20/21
3. Conte 22/23
4. Frank 25/26

all point to incompetence...no one competentent makes the same mistake over and over again.

It strikes me as extremely incompetent to take a top 4 placed team for 4 straight seasons who made it to the CL final and a team who'd been in European Football for 14 out of 15 years and take them to the brink of relegation within 7 years ...after spending close on £750m and having 7 managers in that time...only one of which who lasted a who season.

This.

 

[SpursDisciple]

Colin?Colin? Oh yes RCL.

Never thought of him as Colin

Or one match wonder?

 

[Citizen Kane.]

Except that really isn't the case

Poch's football had been sitting deeper and deeper for his last two seasons entirely because he was adding more of a counterattacking focus (whether by choice or due to the hard pressing taking its toll on players is up for debate) so it wasn't the lurch from one style to another when the ubermensch came in, Nuno was a stopgap for Conte even if there wasn't their player profiles weren't 1:1 as demonstrated by Emerson Royal wasn't such a lurch either, while Conte to Ange was flipping from one side of the coin go the other as both used WBs as the main attacking fulcrum while both used their CMs to recycle out wide rather than create

Obviously there's gaps in there, such as Conte/Ange CMs being less suited to Frank's quick-passing on the counter or the aforementioned Emerson clearly not being suited for Conte's WB-focused system, but the main issue is managers inheriting gaps yet these aren't addressed such as how modern DMs operate like Rhodri/Wharton/Norgaard yet that type of player hasn't been on our shopping list a single time in the past eighteen months in spite both Ange and Frank needing somebody of that profile

It really is the case.

And a look at who we were weighing up to replace Mourinho before we ended up with Nuno confirms what would have been yet another u-turn in philosophy and style.

Nagelsmann, Flick and Fonseca all cut from completely different cloth.

Paratici was the only one pushing Conte but that only came two months after sacking Mourinho and considering the managers mentioned above.

 

[The RDBD]

What do you think has changed? Both periods had Levy in charge at the top. Why were we more successful when we had less money to spend? There is no doubt that the Pochettino squad was sensational value for money but ENIC/Levy out was already a thing even then.

Nah, it has always been Levy out until very recently
(say the past 4 yrs max) .

 

[Citizen Kane.]

The thing that has changed is that we have become arrogant as a club.

They behaved arrogantly towards regular staff by threatening to furlough them on 80% of their wages (even though the savings were pityfully low) during Covid while they kept their full salary.

They arrogantly believed we should be part of the European Super League.

They arrogantly believed that we could get a top manager after sacking JM but the search became a farce and we ended up with Nuno.

They have acted arrogantly towards elderly fans by announcing they were getting rid of pensioner ticket discounts.

They have acted arrogantly towards many long term fans (who turned up throughout the dark times of 1992-2005 and who kept turning up at the wembley **** hole week in week out) by pricing many of us out of most league games at the new ground.

They acted arrogantly by deciding not to spend in January when it was obvious we desperately needed new players.

They acted arrogantly believing we could drift through the rest of the season cos we were too big to go down.

They acted arrogantly when sending out an email in February this year saying that they were going to freeze ticket prices next season and lower Newcastle to a catagory B game tp make it cheaper as though we are not in danger of going down.

Arrogance leads directly to incompetence and we have acted incompetently at several points over the past 7 years.

Sacking Pochettino just months after signing four players for £130m and expecting a diametrically opposite type of manager (JM) to get a tune out of them was incompetent.

Everything about the timing of sacking JM and appointing Nuno screams incompetence.

Signing Richarlison, not replacing Son, not replacing Vicario, bringing in Tudor with (no prem experience) to save us, spending well over a hundred million and sacking the manager before the sessons end ... not once but 4 times in 7 yrs :

1. Pochettino 19/20
2. JM 20/21
3. Conte 22/23
4. Frank 25/26

all point to incompetence...no one competentent makes the same mistake over and over again.

It strikes me as extremely incompetent to take a top 4 placed team for 4 straight seasons who made it to the CL final and a team who'd been in European Football for 14 out of 15 years and take them to the brink of relegation within 7 years ...after spending close on £750m and having 7 managers in that time...only one of which who lasted a who season.

 

[Left on the Shelf]

The thing that has changed is that we have become arrogant as a club.

They behaved arrogantly towards regular staff by threatening to furlough them on 80% of their wages (even though the savings were pityfully low) during Covid while they kept their full salary.

They arrogantly believed we should be part of the European Super League.

They arrogantly believed that we could get a top manager after sacking JM but the search became a farce and we ended up with Nuno.

They have acted arrogantly towards elderly fans by announcing they were getting rid of pensioner ticket discounts.

They have acted arrogantly towards many long term fans (who turned up throughout the dark times of 1992-2005 and who kept turning up at the wembley **** hole week in week out) by pricing many of us out of most league games at the new ground.

They acted arrogantly by deciding not to spend in January when it was obvious we desperately needed new players.

They acted arrogantly believing we could drift through the rest of the season cos we were too big to go down.

They acted arrogantly when sending out an email in February this year saying that they were going to freeze ticket prices next season and lower Newcastle to a catagory B game tp make it cheaper as though we are not in danger of going down.

Arrogance leads directly to incompetence and we have acted incompetently at several points over the past 7 years.

Sacking Pochettino just months after signing four players for £130m and expecting a diametrically opposite type of manager (JM) to get a tune out of them was incompetent.

Everything about the timing of sacking JM and appointing Nuno screams incompetence.

Signing Richarlison, not replacing Son, not replacing Vicario, bringing in Tudor with (no prem experience) to save us, spending well over a hundred million and sacking the manager before the sessons end ... not once but 4 times in 7 yrs :

1. Pochettino 19/20
2. JM 20/21
3. Conte 22/23
4. Frank 25/26

all point to incompetence...no one competentent makes the same mistake over and over again.

It strikes me as extremely incompetent to take a top 4 placed team for 4 straight seasons who made it to the CL final and a team who'd been in European Football for 14 out of 15 years and take them to the brink of relegation within 7 years ...after spending close on £750m and having 7 managers in that time...only one of which who lasted a who season.

Well said, Sir!!

 

[PowerSpurs]

The thing that has changed is that we have become arrogant as a club.

They behaved arrogantly towards regular staff by threatening to furlough them on 80% of their wages (even though the savings were pityfully low) during Covid while they kept their full salary.

They arrogantly believed we should be part of the European Super League.

They arrogantly believed that we could get a top manager after sacking JM but the search became a farce and we ended up with Nuno.

They have acted arrogantly towards elderly fans by announcing they were getting rid of pensioner ticket discounts.

They have acted arrogantly towards many long term fans (who turned up throughout the dark times of 1992-2005 and who kept turning up at the wembley **** hole week in week out) by pricing many of us out of most league games at the new ground.

They acted arrogantly by deciding not to spend in January when it was obvious we desperately needed new players.

They acted arrogantly believing we could drift through the rest of the season cos we were too big to go down.

They acted arrogantly when sending out an email in February this year saying that they were going to freeze ticket prices next season and lower Newcastle to a catagory B game tp make it cheaper as though we are not in danger of going down.

Arrogance leads directly to incompetence and we have acted incompetently at several points over the past 7 years.

Sacking Pochettino just months after signing four players for £130m and expecting a diametrically opposite type of manager (JM) to get a tune out of them was incompetent.

Everything about the timing of sacking JM and appointing Nuno screams incompetence.

Signing Richarlison, not replacing Son, not replacing Vicario, bringing in Tudor with (no prem experience) to save us, spending well over a hundred million and sacking the manager before the sessons end ... not once but 4 times in 7 yrs :

1. Pochettino 19/20
2. JM 20/21
3. Conte 22/23
4. Frank 25/26

all point to incompetence...no one competentent makes the same mistake over and over again.

It strikes me as extremely incompetent to take a top 4 placed team for 4 straight seasons who made it to the CL final and a team who'd been in European Football for 14 out of 15 years and take them to the brink of relegation within 7 years ...after spending close on £750m and having 7 managers in that time...only one of which who lasted a who season.

Very well argued. I disagree about management sackings though. There is no recipe for appointing a good manager....so you have to sack them as soon as they prove themselves not to be a good one. All clubs do that not just us.

 

[KingHotspur]

Very well argued. I disagree about management sackings though. There is no recipe for appointing a good manager....so you have to sack them as soon as they prove themselves not to be a good one. All clubs do that not just us.

True but Spurs keep appointing the wrong one. You can get 1 or 2 wrong in a row but when it’s 3/4/5 then you’re gonna be in big trouble.