Off Topic General Election

superhorns said:
Nobody is challenging the referendum figures have changed. There has clearly been no Brexit remorse.

What The PM was referring to was the pragmatic attitude of most of the 'remainers'. They have joined the 'leave' contingent to form a large group, 69%, who want the government to negotiate Brexit a.s.a.p. There is a very small percentage 21% who disagree with this action. The PM was fully justified to claim the country was coming together.

There does seem to be additional support from all around the UK for the government's position.
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I could suggest that your figures were gathered before anything had happened after nine months of dithering. However since then people are equally split on leaving and remaining, something you admit in your first sentence. Why try and defend the PM when she is only trying to gain an advantage with the opposition in total disarray. There is no evidence whatsoever in any recent poll of public opinion to say otherwise. I suggest that things will move however when the government publish their manifesto, and some of the people who get a pension find out that any increase is doubtful, and tax increases on top of price rises are all coming the way of the general public.
 
colognehornet said:
The reason why Labour is suffering in the opinion polls is because of unclarity as to their position on Brexit - how can they take it over under the present circumstances ? The reason why they lost the last election was also because the Tories were the only party offering a referendum, and because of the xenophobia which was whipped up over Scotland, which raised the spectre, in many people's eyes, of a Labour/SNP coalition. Neither of these themes have anything to do with Corbyn's left wing ideas, most of which come over well with the electorate.
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The reason the Labour Party is losing support is the UK's political base has moved firmly to the right. The current Labour leadership is not only unrepresentative of the country, it is unrepresentative of the traditional Labour voter base. I hope your views are replicated in the National Executive and a far left cabinet is maintained. This will ensure a Conservative government for the next 20 years at least.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
I could suggest that your figures were gathered before anything had happened after nine months of dithering. However since then people are equally split on leaving and remaining, something you admit in your first sentence. Why try and defend the PM when she is only trying to gain an advantage with the opposition in total disarray. There is no evidence whatsoever in any recent poll of public opinion to say otherwise. I suggest that things will move however when the government publish their manifesto, and some of the people who get a pension find out that any increase is doubtful, and tax increases on top of price rises are all coming the way of the general public.
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My figures are current, please kindly update them if possible. 69% of those polled want Brexit a.s.a.p. The Tories are set to be the new government for another five years, with hopefully scores of extra seats. The Tories believe in low taxation but the Cameron / Osborne promise of no tax rise was inadvisable. The PM does not need my assistance, she is the most popular PM for a very long time.

It was not very long ago that you predicted Tory losses, seems a bit way off at present.
 
I could join you in slagging off the PM if she goes too far to the centre ground and further attacks dividends and entrepreneurs relief, dreadful woman!!.
 
Please give some figures that are less than a month old.

Please also stop giving you own views as facts, as so far all we are seeing is a government trying to side step the issues that they know will be unpopular and being dishonest about what they know will be required when there is a worse deal than we have at present being dressed up as the best "possible" deal.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
Please give some figures that are less than a month old.

Please also stop giving you own views as facts, as so far all we are seeing is a government trying to side step the issues that they know will be unpopular and being dishonest about what they know will be required when there is a worse deal than we have at present being dressed up as the best "possible" deal.
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Can you supply the latest on the 69% of those polled that want Brexit a.s.a.p. I very much doubt the 69% has been reduced. The government increasingly have the backing of the electorate who clearly disagree with your pessimistic view.
 
No I cannot find them, which is why I was asking you to supply them. Clearly you cannot back up your claims if you are just doubting the figures.
 
superhorns said:
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YouGov information that clearly states that 69% of the sample poll want Brexit a.s.a.p. This fortifies the PM's claim that the country is coming together in a policy to move on from the referendum. Only a sad small minority, 21%, want to halt any progress.
 
No look at the date. That is old news when people were fed up with the whole issue and couldn't believe that the government hadn't done anything. I asked you to supply current figures which you cannot. I gave you figures from today. Sorry, but your opinions are not actual news anymore than out of date polls. 44% agree that we should leave, 44% say we should not. Today's news, not out of date material.
 
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oldfrenchhorn said:
No look at the date. That is old news when people were fed up with the whole issue and couldn't believe that the government hadn't done anything. I asked you to supply current figures which you cannot. I gave you figures from today. Sorry, but your opinions are not actual news anymore than out of date polls. 44% agree that we should leave, 44% say we should not. Today's news, not out of date material.
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The referendum figures for remain and leave have remained constant since the referendum. The recent YouGov poll that gave 69% of the sample as wanting Brexit a.s.a.p. is still current unless they have updated since. If you cannot produce any different figures they stand. What it does highlight is that most 'remainers' have respected the will of the people therefore accept the result. and want Brexit to continue.
 
colognehornet said:
What these figures show is that there are 44% real Brexiters left, whereas 46% either did not want it, or do not want it - which appears to suggest that opinion on the subject has shifted.
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What these figures show is 69% of UK electorate want Brexit a.s.a.p.
 
Clutching at straws comes to mind. For the last time I repeat that today's results show something different. The country is still as split as it has ever been.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
Clutching at straws comes to mind. For the last time I repeat that today's results show something different. The country is still as split as it has ever been.
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So there are no updated figures or you daren't show them.

You seem to be in the small minority of 21% that do not accept the will of the British people.
 
superhorns said:
What these figures show is 69% of UK electorate want Brexit a.s.a.p.
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What they show is that there are 3 groups (discounting the don't knows) - people who always wanted it, people who are against it at all costs, and people who say they were against it but think that the horse has bolted and nothing can stop it. Add the last 2 groups together and you have a clear picture ie. the people do not really want to leave = if there were a referendum tomorrow then remain would win. However, we are only talking maths here - and it is irrelevant at this stage. What is important is what the mood of the country will be after a year, or so, of fruitless negotiations - when it starts to become clear to people (however much it is dressed up) that any new deal cannot be an improvement on what already exists.
 
colognehornet said:
What they show is that there are 3 groups (discounting the don't knows) - people who always wanted it, people who are against it at all costs, and people who say they were against it but think that the horse has bolted and nothing can stop it. Add the last 2 groups together and you have a clear picture ie. the people do not really want to leave = if there were a referendum tomorrow then remain would win. However, we are only talking maths here - and it is irrelevant at this stage. What is important is what the mood of the country will be after a year, or so, of fruitless negotiations - when it starts to become clear to people (however much it is dressed up) that any new deal cannot be an improvement on what already exists.
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Whatever the reason the vast majority of the UK public want Brexit to continue a.s.a.p. The saboteurs are a small minority.
 
It is a real shame that there are still some who cannot see what the wider world has to offer because they are so caught up in narrow party politics. As you look around other countries you see people who have taken a hard look at where their traditional party has been taking them, and they have rejected it. The world is moving on at an increasing speed, yet some seem to think that going back is the answer, rather than finding new ways of cooperation with their neighbours, and creating new solutions to new problems. As someone who has been around for a fair time maybe I should hanker after the good old days, but I know that what worked 50 years ago will not work today. The politics of both left and right in England in my opinion is way out of date, and something different is needed to break the mold.
 
superhorns said:
Whatever the reason the vast majority of the UK public want Brexit to continue a.s.a.p. The saboteurs are a small minority.
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No answer then to the second part of my text, namely that it is irrelevant - what matters is the mood in a years time (or maybe longer) when it becomes clear exactly what conditions Britain will get.
 
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