People will quote all sorts of contradictory bollocks from their religious texts: 'Love thy Neighbour' and then 'An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth' and use it to condone their actions depending on their own motives, not those that their faith instructs them to do. Most of the Bible was rewritten over and over again to suit the particular status quo of the day and anyway, that book was written in parables, so why people take that **** at face value is beyond me.
The thing I find interesting is how the teachings/role of holy text will be interpreted differently depending on circumstances. As Reza Aslan points out, Jesus might represent love and benevolence to a comfortable living American suburbanite, whereas to a disenfranchised Guatemalan peasant he's a warrior or freedom fighter. People will take certain ideas from their religion that make the most sense in their circumstances rather than believe everything that is written. As for the racism and homophobia in Russia, it's hard to know what this is caused by. I'd wager that past isolationism and current high poverty levels have much to answer for (though I doubt it's the only reason).
Islamists come in all shapes and sizes, some very extreme, some moderate etc (they'd be something like your conservative in the west). For example look in Egypt and Tunis, the mad ones right now aren't the Islamists, but the secularist 'liberals'. The Islamists in both countries are being the democratic ones, who got elected by the people, and FAIRLY. It was then in Egypt where they had a military coup, and with the nation now displaying all the signs of fascism supported by the secular left in that country, and Tunis is heading down the same path, in Tunis the Islamist government has AGREED to step down so another new government can be voted in through the elections. This is practically the opposite of everything that we're told about Islamists. So it's not a black and white issue of Islamist= bad barbarian, it all depends on which Islamist (or Islamist group) you're talking about.
Btw, to the other point of who's more crazy at the moment? The crazy extremist Muslims, or the crazy Christian ones? Well let's ask ourselves, who's ****ed up more ****, Al-Qaeda, or the right wing Christian neocons in the American government, your Bush', Cheney's, and Rumsfelds, and let's include Blair the good Catholic who said GOD TOLD HIM to go to war in Iraq. And the answer is clear. For some reason, having a big beard, and speaking in a foreign language in some cave makes you seem more menacing than nice white guys in suits, when the fact is, those nice white guys in suits, have ****ed up far more **** than Al-Qaeda could ever dream of. So even this argument of well forget what the texts say, you have more crazy Muslims doing bad **** than crazy Christians doing bad **** isn't really true or accurate. Put it this way, your Bin Ladens want to be in Bush' and Blairs position, but they can't right now, they have to settle for caves, Bush and Blair the right wing christian crazies, well they got the power so they set the tone, so it's not ****ed up **** when they're doing it and calling it a CRUSADE, Bush called his wars a CRUSADE.
I would argue that the wars over the last century have been fought because of geopolitical, land grab, strategic influence and clamour to control resources and currencies. Religion and ideology have simply been used as a smokescreen to try and characterise and demonise the 'other' the 'threat'. I would argue that the worlds wars have been capitalist wars .... cue gent
Those right wing neocons (Bush, Blair etc) were fighting for all those things you mention, but they also took inspiration from their faith, for them faith played a role in that too.
I completely agree with you about Islam A87. I was just making the point that what's written in a book or on a scroll does not define men, but their actions do. Personally, if I was given a magic wand and told I could remove one grouping from the world it would not be anyone from Islam. I'd make America, the biggest threat to us all disappear in a heartbeat and and enjoy the prospect of my great great great grandkids having a planet to live on. p.s. Just saw your next post about the neo-cons. Amen to that
If you follow a religion, you're crazy, 'nuff said. Putting your faith in something that's been proven as false is just madness.
This. Faith, by definition, is the belief in something without actual proof of its existence. And I dont do that, because i'm not a ****ing idiot. Bible says Earth was created 6000 years ago for a start.....which is bullshit as we have carbon dated bones which are millions of years old. And when science starts to disprove your bullshit? Just release a New Testament, backtracking or just glossing over the BS from the Old one!
All this logic and reason being used to counter religion yet the same people spew out illogical, gutter press influenced views on huge swathes of humanity. It's gullible hate filled sheeps like these that allow states to commit mass murder as they blindly buy into the "two legs good four legs better" mantra. Any criminal with a Muslim name then it's Islam's fault. Imagine if that guy in Wales who raped, chopped up and then incinerated that sweet toddler had a Muslim name not a Christian one? You can bet your bottom dollar that the "voice of reason" would hate Islam and Muslims more.
Just to play Devil's advocate -pun intended - using your scientific analogy that you cannot believe in something without proof of existence, you also have to use the same scientific paradigm that says - unless something can be disproved, you have to entertain it's existence.
Racism is something that only appears in the Media, when considered newsworthy. In other words it involves some type of connection to people in the public eye, which itself is akin sensationalism. I do not for a second believe ( as reported by some outlets ) or truly care to establish the context of Roy Hodgson's monkey joke. It is a non event at best & trivial at it's worst. When I first heard Arsene Wenger's comments I wasn't sure what he had actually said. Not that it truly mattered, as thus was after all, one man's opinion on the behaviour of a few morons in a Football Stadium. There appeared to be no debate in terms of the chanting directed at Yaya Toure by the CSKA fans. So the statement nothing has been proven made little sense. In their entirety, I believe AW words suffer from English not being his first language. I think he meant UEFA have not carried out an investigation as of yet of that particular incident & nothing could be done until then. As for boycotting the 2018 Tournament, UEFA & Russia should be given a chance to clean house. What hasn't helped are the views of high minded pundits who seem to be Championing England's candidacy for 2018 World Cup rather than addressing the need to tackle racism on the whole. Racist chanting in a Football Stadium is for the recipient a traumatic experience. Yet racism takes on far more damaging forms & is alive & well in ours & other Societies across the globe. It may take a 1000 years or more to have some entertain the possibility of there being nothing wrong with being from another race or ethnic group besides their own. The media must also be held accountable for their role in creating & reinforcing negative stereotypes, that build an expectancy of people from parts of the World you've never previously encountered or the perceptions that one such person somehow speaks for all.
Fair point, but when there is so much evidence in favour of religion being bogus, surely that cancels out the theory of it existing?
Depends if you're talking about religious text or spirituality. I think most of the stuff in the Bible can pretty much be disproved/explained as being parable, not to be taken literally. But can anybody prove/disprove the existence of Soul or divinity ?
The **** did I start??? To clear up @Toledo - I am not calling Muslims or followers of Islam Homophobhic or sexist. I am saying their text and religious doctrine is. People interpret faith in many different ways but the basis is always there in the text. If you are speaking about Racism (rightly so as well) look at all discrimanation. @Arsenal87 - I said Islam is the most - at no point did I say it is the only one. But because the majority of followers of followers live in more repressive regimes or are minorities in others the use of region is far more prevalent which is why societal pressure doesn't play as big a part as it does in say the more developed nations, where society trumps the power of religion many times (it also loses often) but the opportunity for change or a different thought process is far more available. A general qualication I would give is - I envy people with faith as a concept it is brilliant (but I don't have it), I despise organised religion.
Entertain its existence - sure base your entire way of life not so much! Frankly I am not fussed whether there is a god or not ( of any denomination) Its the humans running religion I give a **** about. It was a form of control and a tool to use but is heavily outdated but because of its influence we can't retire it like it should have been done a long time ago and because of the belief system it is also nigh on impossible to alter as we grow as a society.
