Flat Season

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utter****2 said:
The jumps bores me ****less so will be glad to see the flat back, hopefully will get a drier summer this year so we get plenty of fast ground which is much easier for punting.
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When is the last time you saw "firm" alone in the going description of a major meeting?..anyone remember "hard" (Yeah,yeah..pack it in!) that used to occur at courses like Brighton etc in the early 80's when some courses didn't have the infrastructure to water...All we get is dead over irrigated top soil.

Oddy's right utter,change your moniker <ok>
 
This could turn out to be a very interesting season on the flat as the mediocrity of last season&#8217;s three year olds means that there is no obvious champion older horse and we may be celebrating an unsung hero by October that was an ordinary handicapper as a three year old.

I expect that Camelot will start his campaign farming the usual Aidan O&#8217;Brien benefit races in Ireland. Whether he progresses from there may be determined by how good the three year olds turn out to be. My early thoughts regarding the season finale at Longchamp surround last year&#8217;s runner-up, Orfevre. There is no doubt in my mind that he was beaten by the ground from his terrible draw in 2012, so I will be looking for a Japanese victory as the reported plan is to return from the Land of the Rising Sun.

This season&#8217;s top three year olds may not be the two Guineas favourites:

Dawn Approach is a paltry 5/2 with Ladbrokes on the back of his clear dominance as a two year old; but his illustrious father lost the Guineas and won the Derby, so I will be looking elsewhere at fancy prices. A number of the principals in the ante post market look like non-stayers so it is not impossible that the 2000 Guineas field will be small this year.

Certify was a high-class two year old filly and can be backed at 9/1 for the 1000 Guineas; however, I felt that she looked like a middle-distanc e filly. I have backed the Rockfel winner Just The Judge at 16/1, having been told by the groom that it was the stable&#8217;s Guineas filly before it won on Future Champions&#8217; Day. Jamie Spencer riding for the owner will put off a few on here!

I am hoping that the weather is better this year as I endured my worst ever losing year thanks to a three or four month bout of seconditis with fancied runners getting stuck in rain softened ground.
 
QuarterMoonII said:
This could turn out to be a very interesting season on the flat as the mediocrity of last season’s three year olds means that there is no obvious champion older horse and we may be celebrating an unsung hero by October that was an ordinary handicapper as a three year old.

I expect that Camelot will start his campaign farming the usual Aidan O’Brien benefit races in Ireland. Whether he progresses from there may be determined by how good the three year olds turn out to be. My early thoughts regarding the season finale at Longchamp surround last year’s runner-up, Orfevre. There is no doubt in my mind that he was beaten by the ground from his terrible draw in 2012, so I will be looking for a Japanese victory as the reported plan is to return from the Land of the Rising Sun.

This season’s top three year olds may not be the two Guineas favourites:

Dawn Approach is a paltry 5/2 with Ladbrokes on the back of his clear dominance as a two year old; but his illustrious father lost the Guineas and won the Derby, so I will be looking elsewhere at fancy prices. A number of the principals in the ante post market look like non-stayers so it is not impossible that the 2000 Guineas field will be small this year.

Certify was a high-class two year old filly and can be backed at 9/1 for the 1000 Guineas; however, I felt that she looked like a middle-distanc e filly. I have backed the Rockfel winner Just The Judge at 16/1, having been told by the groom that it was the stable’s Guineas filly before it won on Future Champions’ Day. Jamie Spencer riding for the owner will put off a few on here!

I am hoping that the weather is better this year as I endured my worst ever losing year thanks to a three or four month bout of seconditis with fancied runners getting stuck in rain softened ground.
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Hi QM.

Good to see you back.

I'm actually staggered that more UK based trainers don't target these races.

It is,however,folly to assume that minimal numbers in Irish races equates to poor form...Cheltenham this week proved that.

Last year on ther flat also corroborated that POV.
 
Dexter said:
When is the last time you saw "firm" alone in the going description of a major meeting?..anyone remember "hard" (Yeah,yeah..pack it in!) that used to occur at courses like Brighton etc in the early 80's when some courses didn't have the infrastructure to water...All we get is dead over irrigated top soil.

Oddy's right utter,change your moniker <ok>
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Bath regularly is firm ground cause they can't water there.

No.
 
Anyhow,off to bed..not much happening in this test...Australia is digging in.

Bank Holiday here tmz.
 
although I think that Cheltenham is the best week of the racing year I think overall I prefer the flat season. Ok the flat horses don't stay in training as long as the jumps horses but usually they now run far more times than the top jumps horses. Bobs Worth won't probably run now again until the autumn. The Guineas winner this summer will probably run 4or 5 times I would think.

the best betting opportunities probably occur at Royal Ascot and Glorious Goodwood but I disagree with those that say the early season races can be a lottery.
Ok I agree that the classics can be, especially the Guineas but if you follow the early season form then the Chester and York May festivals can be very profitable.
My best betting day of last year was actually one of the days at the Craven meeting! (probably a fluke) I reckon that meeting kicks starts the flat season though more than the Lincoln this Saturday which I do think is too early. I always think it is a bit stupid to start the flat season before the Grand National.

I have no idea of a possible Derby winner at the moment but both Dawn Approach and Certify are both worthy ante post Guineas favourites in my opinion. If CERTIFY trains on then she will surely go very close in the 1000 Guineas. I also think that TORONADO could be interesting in the Guineas/Derby. He was an impressive winner on St Leger day but then didn't contest the main 2 year old autumn races.
 
I think this will be the season when Sir Michael returns to the &#8216;top table&#8217; big time and granted a clean bill of health I really think that in TELESCOPE and LIBER NAUTICUS he has the ammo to land the Derby/Oaks double. My regular readers will recall that I have been a huge fan of the former from the word go whilst the latter looked very special when winning her maiden under the &#8216;King&#8217; at Goodwood in September.

Meanwhile, one thing that I would love to see is ST NICHOLAS ABBEY stepped up to extreme distances. I really do believe that the Cup races would be at his mercy if this happened and think over trips in excess of 16 furlongs he could be something special.
 
Sir Barney Chuckles said:
I think this will be the season when Sir Michael returns to the &#8216;top table&#8217; big time and granted a clean bill of health I really think that in TELESCOPE and LIBER NAUTICUS he has the ammo to land the Derby/Oaks double. My regular readers will recall that I have been a huge fan of the former from the word go whilst the latter looked very special when winning her maiden under the &#8216;King&#8217; at Goodwood in September.

Meanwhile, one thing that I would love to see is ST NICHOLAS ABBEY stepped up to extreme distances. I really do believe that the Cup races would be at his mercy if this happened and think over trips in excess of 16 furlongs he could be something special.
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Ive already backed Telescope for the Derby. Think this fella has bundles of improvement in him, huge scopey type who could be a star turn this season.
 
Sir Barney Chuckles said:
Meanwhile, one thing that I would love to see is ST NICHOLAS ABBEY stepped up to extreme distances. I really do believe that the Cup races would be at his mercy if this happened and think over trips in excess of 16 furlongs he could be something special.
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Ive been championing this idea for about two years now. I always come back to the ormonde stakes at chester a couple of years ago when he absolutely hosed up over 1m5f and ryan moore had great trouble pulling him up after the line as he wasnt stopping! I dont think there are many races he can win over middle distances anymore and i can see him dominating what is an average long distance division that is around at the moment
 
I used to love the flat, but I'm finding it increasingly difficult to muster any enthusiasm. I dare say that'll change if we finally get a decent summer though.

Royal Ascot is impossible for gambling, I defy any punter to consistently finish in front there. Glorious Goodwood's alright though, and what a backdrop. And there's always Windsor on a Monday night, where you can't go too far wrong following Hughes and Hannon.

The real problem with the flat is that there's too bloody much of it, and with 3 all weather tracks and a fourth in Ireland, it never really goes away.
 
Brough Tiger said:
Sir Barney Chuckles said:
Meanwhile, one thing that I would love to see is ST NICHOLAS ABBEY stepped up to extreme distances. I really do believe that the Cup races would be at his mercy if this happened and think over trips in excess of 16 furlongs he could be something special.
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Ive been championing this idea for about two years now. I always come back to the ormonde stakes at chester a couple of years ago when he absolutely hosed up over 1m5f and ryan moore had great trouble pulling him up after the line as he wasnt stopping! I dont think there are many races he can win over middle distances anymore and i can see him dominating what is an average long distance division that is around at the moment
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Ascot Gold Cup Betting Odds
Colour Vision (8), Mount Athos (8), Rite Of Passage (8), Saddlers Rock (9), High Jinx (10), Opinion Poll (12), Times Up (12), Fame And Glory (14), Royal Diamond (14), Simenon (16), Aiken (20), I Have A Dream (20), Memphis Tennessee (20), Michelangelo (20), Sir Graham Wade (20), Brown Panther (25), Gulf Of Naples (25), Pique Sous (25), Hartani (33), Massiyn (33) , Overturn (33), Steps To Freedom (33)

Doesn't look like there is any intention at this stage
 
Archers Road said:
I used to love the flat, but I'm finding it increasingly difficult to muster any enthusiasm. I dare say that'll change if we finally get a decent summer though.

Royal Ascot is impossible for gambling, I defy any punter to consistently finish in front there. Glorious Goodwood's alright though, and what a backdrop. And there's always Windsor on a Monday night, where you can't go too far wrong following Hughes and Hannon.

The real problem with the flat is that there's too bloody much of it, and with 3 all weather tracks and a fourth in Ireland, it never really goes away.
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There is to much of it il agree, and that's for the benefit of bookmakers. Maybe you could try and just focus your attention on class 4s and above, so you ignore all the crap that's just put on for betting purposes :biggrin:
 
From a betting perspective there are so many races one can just draw a line through. Lots of meetings just means more lines to draw.
 
there is way to many flat races and alot of it is mediocre class 5/6 donkey fests,the flat will always come second best after jumps for me.i think in general most people prefare the jumps.i dont think you get the same buzz and excitement cheltenham brings that you would with ascot or goodwood.then you have the whole 'royal' ascot bullshit with the hats and the english royal family,no thanks.
 
I love the racing at Royal Ascot, but I really hate the rest of the rubbish aswell. If you have no interest in racing then you shouldn't be there.

I recall being there the day SYT won last season, and there was hardly anyone in the paddock to cheer him in. We're talking about an even money favourite that has won the big race of the day, and hardly anyone that was there actually cared.

Why can't these 'non racing' folk just go somewhere else, rather than ruining the atmosphere at the best flat meeting of the year. Couldn't they just hire out a random field for them all, and let them get drunk all dressed up there :biggrin:
 
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