Cest - I don't disagree with you necessarily but the previous Labour Government are just as responsible for the carrier debacle ! Let's not forget that when Gordon "Don't ask me to understand Defence" Brown was Chancellor and PM he was keen for the ships to be built - in Rosyth, which just happens to be either in or adjacent to his constituency ! The politicians of all parties and the MOD are responsible for a shocking catalogue of expensive programmes which have been late, massively overbudget and that have failed to deliver the equipment needed to the forces. And it's been going on for years............................
But who do you replace them with one shower of ****e is much the same as the other shower of ****e conservative ,labour or the libs all just toffs taking good care of them selfs whilst pretending they care about us
We have just seen this shower of ****e waste £250m of yours and my money, stopping the decision of the last labour govt, calling it worse than ****e in the process btw, only to realise that it was in fact the best deal after all. ****ing amateurs. I don't disagree that they all tend to be ****e but its the level of ****ness we are debating here. The last labour govt had to bail out the banks to save a complete financial meltdown (agreed by both the Tories and the liars/Libs) and deal with the biggest global recession for 80 years and thus over saw a massive public borrowing increase. However, at least they were using the money to build and renovate hospitals and schools that had been left to rack and ruin under 18 Tory years; rebuild a depleted police force and recruit more nurses and doctors than had ever been seen. They also presided over, with Tony Blair as PM, the biggest period of growth, prosperity and jobs increase since the McMillan era. Low interest rates and inflation and year on year growth that everyone was a part of. This lot are only interested in lowering taxes for their rich pals and themselves and cutting back on welfare, public investment, pensions and raising VAT on everyone to pay for it. They may not be perfect but at least the labour party are fairer. I know which one I would prefer in govt.
Can somebody please explain why we need aircraft carriers in the first place. We don't have an empire to protect anymore. Why exactly do we need the capability to project military power thousands of miles away, we don't have any enemeys anymore apart from the ones we make up. Iraq, Afganistan, that worked out well didn't it. (Before anyone mentions the Argies we have an airbase now and our military have moved on 30 years while the argies have stood still, they simply don't have the capability to invade anymore) We need to accept the fact we are no longer a global power and if it kicks off in a major way let NATO sort it out and make the French and Germans hold up their end of the bargain which they have so spectaculary failed to do in Afganistan.
Sorry mate but they did that on the never never, we as a country simply could not afford it which is why we are in this mess. Governments wether red or blue over the last 30 years have spent way over our means so now our children will have to pay for it. Its a 100% fact that every Labour government that has left power has left a financial crisis behind it. I believe in personal responsibility and that I can spend my own money better than any government can, its a pillar of socilist ideology that the state knows best and its just obvious they don't.
It's a way of transporting troops and machinery around the world... We have a duty to protect ourselves, and also to be able to help our great allies in times of need.... We owe it to ourselves and the great nations of Australia and Canada and the likes....... Plus in the eventuality that someone like Iran kick-off, we need to be able to do our part........ Plus you mentioned the Falklands, so if the Columbians etc help them, you are pre-pared to let the force we have down there, be left to fend for themselves, if they get over-run.
Wease - you can argue about the need for aircraft carriers, which is fair enough but at the end of the day we are an Island nation with a large maritime presence around the world's oceans. Add that to our overseas dependencies - yes like the Falklands - which is a prime example, and our national interests in certain areas and the case is there for not only aircraft carriers but a larger navy. Thnk of the forces like an insurance policy you hope not to have to claim on ! My argument is the type and design of the carriers was flawed from the off - something the Labour Party are responsible for IIRC. This is another example of poor decision making and financial mis-management - and it doesn't matter which party you support they're all culpable ! Had you offered the Navy a couple of medium carriers with conventional cats and traps and equipped with F-18 Hornets to be in service by now they would have snapped your hands off and we wouldn't have wasted anything like the billions that have wasted so far. Oh and as far as the French are concerned - they already operate carriers themselves which have had nothing like the protracted process we've had to suffer !
