i've watched a few games (5 championship, 1 league one, 3 league two) - not as many as i would normally - its too expensive! obviously i've seen plenty on tv and everything on highlights, snippets like that. i went to the den last night to watch millwall v birmingham. don't be fooled by the scoreline - it was a low quality match but both sides i feel are better equipped than ipswich as it stands, yet both sit just above the drop zone. i totally agree the standard in the championship is low - i'd go as far as saying its the lowest its been for many years. it gives you a chance but as i keep saying, you will only stand a chance if you buy and improve in january, therefore, your current side is not good enough to stay up. much will depend on if you get a new manager 'bounce' - that could be the difference between staying up and going down. even norwich got a 'bounce' under gunn - we won our first game 4-0 under him and won two of our first three! what i will say is i've watched hundreds of championship matches over the years and i have a good grasp of when a team will do well or when one won't. i said you'd finish 16th at best this season before a ball was kicked. i was told at the time i knew nothing but i bet you'd take that right now. my gut feeling is that you'll get a bounce, improve your team in january and finish maybe 19th - 21st.
I'm disappointed that this is the only comment I can argue with! Under current employment regulations, being intoxicated in the workplace is actually a criminal offence. In fact, 'on-licences' (bars, pubs, restaurants, etc) actually prohibit the sale of alcohol to anyone displaying signs of intoxication. Not that anyone takes any notice of this. My point is, that a 'piss-up in a brewery' is, sadly, a thing of the past. As The Beatles sang, money can't buy me love.
I still think in terms of quality we have more this season than we've had for some time. There's no doubt we need to add to the team but interms of who we've got here on permanent dealings, the quality is good. We need a few more experienced/leaders and more variation but we have some good players. And if I recall you yourself said this, you rated our summer signings (we just didn't make enough of them)!! I just think the likes of Chambers, Edwards, Cresswell, JET, Martin, Taylor, Chopra, Hyam, Carson, Scotland, Drury, Hewitt, Smith, Loach are all either good players for this division or potentially good players for this division. We just need more players, more variation like we need a De Vos type player next to Chambers and a target man upfront for Chopra to play off!!! I really would not like to see alot of these players sold off, like I've said the problem has not been who we've got, it's who we didn't get!!
As a team we cant defend, cant score, we have created a few half chances but let other teams go from their own area to our box and then score without us even making a half tackle. Trying to see quality in our squad currently is very difficult currently. Some have talent but are let down by shocking attitude and aptitude. Some are too early to judge and some have potential but currently I cant see 1 player we own which has championship quality on display hence our current position and stats. Some of it may be blamed on bad management, some on lack of confidence but having seen our home displays so far this season I have seen so many individual and avoidable errors its a joke and one that needs to change quickly.
Must've been bad last night Tractorbhoy, there's not much positive in your tone tonight which is unusual!! Though there isn't much to be positive about. So would you say we need to get rid of most of the players we have atm because they're not good enough (excluding loans)? I would say that actually our squad up until the past month, the attitude has been good. I don't think PJ lost the dressing room, I don't think the players ever showed like they weren't willing to fight for the cause. From what I've seen it's a confidence/resilience thing that has been the problem. Perhaps in the past month there have been more attitude problems due to the large influx of loan players coming in!! Certainly aptitude is a problem but I still think we have good players we just need a bit more variation in type of player and players to compliment what we currently have!!
PTC, it wasnt especially bad on Tuesday night, it was identical to most games this season hence why my pre match prediction was not only correct on the score but also on how the game would pan out. Its not so much the attitude off the pitch that worries me but the lack of effort on it. The one telling moment for me on Tuesday was one that I doubt many others even noticed. Derby had two men teaming up on Cresswell on the touchline near where the dugouts are. It took a bollocking from Hutchens for Martin (standing two foot away but not doing anything) to go and help Cresswell out. Same thing happened away from the dugout 5 minutes later and Martin done nothing, probably as he was out of earshot. We have talented players, JET - Martin and especially Chopra, who between them have ability but attitute stinks and probably have 1 decent match in 10 between them (as in decent match not a 5 minute moment during that game) and that is being kind. Most of you love Edwards but his positioning is woeful and soo many times he is caught 5 miles up the pitch when we dont have the ball its a joke. We have others who are steady championship players, which I wont complain about but this talk of quality is one that I am unable to see. To be honest Mate, the fact you have included Hewitt as a comfortable championship player when I assume you have never seen him play, show what kind of straw clutching measure we are currently taking (if you have seen him play I will offer my unreserved apology) I may well be being negative. I honestly didnt feel this way last season about the majority of this squad but we lack fight and the kind of clinical threat, at both ends of the pitch that leaves me very worried. Everyone said Leeds were too strong to face relegation, Sheffield United, West Ham... the list goes on and until I actually SEE us play like a team able to compete over 90+ minutes then I am very wary of using that old adage.
I would say that from what I can gather up until the past few weeks there hasn't been a lack of effort, it's been more, heads drop players become dillusioned etc, the players appear to have a sense of inevitability about them. Edwards certainly has defensive frailties, especially on crosses, I don't think he's the long term answer to RB, but going forward he is probably one of the best in the division and once Hewitt is ready perhaps move him onto the wing!!! I did say potentially good player at this level and no I haven't seen him play, I'm going by the fact he seemed to be highly rated and what alot of people in the game have said about him. I agree we certainly lack fight, for me at the start of the season this was because we lacked leadership and experience but now I think it's because we've got so many loans!! And we are certainly not too good to go down, we are far to relyant on loan players and if the majority of those were to leave we have a very threadbare squad. But I think we do have a fair amount of quality in the players that are actually ours, IMO there's no need to completely overhaul our squad and perhaps a new manager can get more out of these players such as JET, Martin and Chopra!! Martin and JET were fairly consistent (for the typical inconsistant players) toward the end of last season and Chopra if he gets his head right or more importantly IMO has a partner upfront who compliments him would be good players at this level!!
you are right to say i commented on your summer signings, but you are wrong to say i rated them. this is how i called them: loach - poor signing, can't dominate his area (i think that one is bearing fruit), chambers - good player two years ago and would be a good signing if he recaptures that form, albeit that is the only decent season he's had, hewitt - potential for the future, probably not ready yet, murphy on loan - one of the most average footballers of his generation, luongo - never seen him play, couldn't comment at time, taylor - talented footballer, major off-field issues have always held him back, 50/50 signing. forgive me if i've missed any, but hardly a glowing assessment at the time and i doubt you'd adjust many of those appraisals even now. i wasn't trying to cause a scene with what i said about your playeras being overrated, its just how i view it and so far this season, they have done nothing to disprove any of those statements. you often speak about how good 'jet' is - would i be wrong to say that 80% of the time you wouldn't even know he's on the pitch? its no good having talent if you don't apply yourself. chopra in my opinion was overrated when you signed him (he's only once been a 20 goal a season player) - good for 12+ a season but offers little else other than off-field issues. cresswell obviously had a worldy season (as merson would say) last year but he's young and you often get '2nd season syndrome' in youngsters, where their form takes a major dip. he'll probably get better with time. edwards was your stand out player in both games i've seen this season and he's a 34 year old who is playing out of position. actually, nathan ellington did quite well against charlton - that says a lot, so i think i'm correct in saying you don't have many good players at the moment. and when the loanees leave, assuming they do, you'll have a threadbare squad. major work in the transfer market will be required in january, i don't care what you say!
I don't care what you say either, na na na!! Because you're wrong (me trying to act like Supers!!) Yes I do remember you saying about Loach and I agreed but actually I think he's been decent enough this season apart from 2 mistakes against Cardiff!! As for Chambers, Hewitt and Taylor, I remember you said they would be very good signings for us, a bit of a coup on our part really, so I think you're being a bit a bit harsh to back up your current argument!! You're of course right to say that they have done nothing to disprove your 'current' assessement but 'our' players are certainly good enough for this level. Perhaps I can use England as an example everytime I watch England Rooney and Gerrard look rubbish, especially Rooney, he wouldn't look out of place in a League 2 game but I think he's a quality player, you wouldn't not call him up to the England squad would you?? I agree with you on JET also but he's only young and IMO has not been used in his best position. Players like him are always going to be anominous alot of the time but you've just got to work with him and also play through him because he's got the talent to make something happen, I''d be unhappy if we sold him, a good manager should be able to get the best out of him and if not fair enough, he definitely needs a kick up the a**e every now and again. Again I agree that Chopra was overrated I would've been annoyed if we'd paid alot of money for him like the £4+ million which was being banded around when Keane was here but I still think he's a very good player for this division and there aren't many better finishers in this division, he's either not been right in the head or not had a suitable partner playing with him in his time here. I still think you're wrong in saying we don't have many good players, the players that we do have (are ours) are good players, infact some of the better players we've had for some time, we just don't have the depth, the leadership or competition which is a concern. I agree we need a few signings in January but adding to and complimenting what we've already got. We don't need to do what happened under Keane who came in and changed everything, we need to use what we've already got and evolve as a team!!
Personally the jury is out for me, I know who I particularly don't want or are not too (keane) on, Which include: McCarthy, Davies, Curbs, Robinson, Ince, Adams, Shearer, Worthington, Roeder coppell, Mclaren and Cotterill The ones I would like to see more than those would be: Coyle, Hill, Freedman (not gonna happen) Holloway (also not gonna happen) Mowbray (Not gonna happen) Butcher, Burley and some other names that I can't currently think of...
trust me, i did NOT say they were 'very good signings!' i said exactly what i've said above. you can go back and check if you like we'll see what happens over the coming months but i fully expect your new manager will struggle with your current players and need to work hard to change things. its far from impossible - you've only played a few games - but it'll be interesting to see how it all unfolds - more so for me than you i should imagine!
Supers Loach hard to say really - I personally think he was unfairly dropped and Henderson looks worse Chambers - does ok but lacks that physical pressence and is hardly a battler so far Hewitt - no idea Luongo - showed promise but probably a bit too nieve for our current position Murphy - agree 100% taylor - can only comment on his on field activity where he looked livelier than the other players put together JET - agree 99% - He is missing for 95% of time on the pitch - not the 80 you suggested!! Chopra - woeful and if I was in charge would currently not be in consideration for both on field and off field activities Cresswell - Dont think he has reached the heights but has done well enough. Not helped by the lack of support from midfield or in front of him Edwards - Dont see the fuss. When played as a winger he doesnt look good enough, when played at full back out of position 100% of the time. I think its telling that the best cross from a full back all season has come from Ainsley when Edwards was out for 1 game yet everyone see crossing as his strength. On players not mention. I have already touched on Martin (skill yet poor workrate) PTC points out his spell of consistency for a period last season, which he did but this is now his forth year here. Its hardly a promising report is it. Hyam & Carson - great potential Smith & Drury - decent squad players. Showed there worth for a period last season but question mark remain over how near the first team they should be Scotland. Does well but is coming towards the end and lacks the fitness to play on a regular basis. Not blaming Jewell entirely - its the sad fact of having your budget decimated so badly but I have to say I tend to agree with Supers that our current squad needs work. We may not get relegated, although Im not ruling it out (actually Im worried) but I cant see any way that we are going to finish higher than we have in any of the previous 3 seasons.
shearer?? bloody hell - how does he keep getting linked to jobs? he's about as charismatic as a piece of lead. you only need to see how little understanding he has on match of the day to realise he'd be a mistake, so i don't blame you for not wanting him! coyle is the obvious 'middle-ground' between experience, up and coming and highly rated, even if i don't personally think he's all that. i think he'd be a reasonable appointment and get you safe initially. whether he'd be able to build on it i'm not so sure. mowbray was the obvious choice years ago but you've missed the boat on him. when you look at the results of your poll on a different thread, the huge array of options and the huge difference of opinion form your fans shows just what a difficult appointment this will be for your club. you can never make everyone happy but because there is not really one outstanding contender, you're going to have many disappointed fans, no matter who gets the gig. keith hill is a good shout though - i think he;d do a good job for you but is he a big enough name for your owner?
Supers, this is very sad on my part but: You on thread about Hewitt: You on a thread about Chambers: And a conversation me and you had: my reply: your reply: Sorry Supers but I had a lot of time on my hands today and was pretty confident you had said those signings were good players!!!!
PTC, hate to say it but what you've just dug out from the records goes to show what Supers has already said Loach you havent put up but I remember him saying he was poor, not that Im convinced by this yet. Chambers - could be decent but struggled last year and needs to recapture form on both Taylor - decent player on orginal post - decent player with off the field issues on this topic Hewitt - heard decent things about on your post - Has potential on this. basically the same. Not saying he is correct but I cant see that Supers view has changed much at all. I think the biggest changes are our view on how good we consider our squad is on paper with what its like on the pitch.
If that's the case then we are all arguing about nothing, because we all agree!! But Tractorbhoy, you're being guilty of something you hate, I don't think you're reading my posts properly!! I know he said Loach wasn't great, I remember that, because I agreed. I said we have good players at the club which we need to build upon, I don't want a new manager to come in and overhaul the squad but today yourself and supers has basically said no we haven't got good players at the club!! Going on what we are currently playing like and results no we're not good enough but that's a pretty simplistic view, one which I wouldn't expect you to take!! So do you think the next manager who comes in should have a complete overhaul of our squad and sell players like Cresswell, Hewitt, Chambers, Edwards, Hyam, Drury, Martin, JET, Taylor, Chopra etc or do you think they're good enough to work with and we just need adding too?? Supers is arguing against me saying that he didn't say they were very good signings, which he didn't as he didn't use the word very but that's being padantic he clearly said they were good signings or alluded to that!!!
erm, none of those conversations say anything other than what i said initially! hewitt - a rated youngster, not ready for the first team, chambers - a good season two years ago when prem clubs wanted him - could do well if he recaptures his form, and taylor - good player, improves your team - but as i say, 50/50 as to whether he's actually a very good player. you are clutching at straws big time! they are not great players. surely you can see that from just watching them!! *edit. sorry, just noticed that tractorbhoy has already pointed this out
