Ex-Manager Thread

[ihatemyselfandwanttodie]

VVD has a six year contract so wont be going this summer.

I think the clause was inserted from what has been discussed on here.

Imagine VW and possibly SM will go, but depends who comes in to manage.

Didn't someone suggest we are taking our time to appoint? Maybe this is a red herring as we could be tying things up sooner which would be outstanding by the Board...

 

[I Sorry I Ruined The Party]

Right so how many out of MP, TA RK have we actually resigned when we were led to believe we're likely to sign? If they thought they would and told, but they didn't how is that delusional? Was it spin?
I am not criticising the board completely just wish I could believe them more about key individuals wanting to stay than go. Unfortunately they don't seem to want too.
I generally think everybody at SFC should be very proud of what they have achieved.

MP-- Never said he would sign. I always felt like it was 50/50 at best. I think most of the board's statements in this were more an attempt to put positive spin for the fans, or apply pressure on MP. I can believe the board did what they could but it just wasn't enough.

TA-- He wanted to leave Atletico. And I believe he did like it here. But he never said he would sign, either. I think TA was straightforward in his statements. We had a buyout clause that seemingly limited his options, but he would be happy to sign. Turns out Tottenham came around with a better offer for him. He was on loan and had no particular ties to the club, so there's no betrayal there. As for the board... I don't know. They could have tried to exercise the clause right away and speed things along and maybe stopped Tottenham from getting a bid in. But you still have to sign the player and there was no reason for TA to be in a rush. He had all summer, there was an offer on the table he liked that seemed unlikely to be revoked. So why not wait and see if something better comes around. If not, just play for Saints, which he was perfectly happy to do.

RK-- This is really the only one where I think fans can feel betrayed, or that the board may have made a mistake. Because RK stated many times that he believed in honoring contracts and would not leave. I don't believe the board, the pundits, the fans, or even Everton supporters or RK himself thought that the owner would just overrule everyone and go all-in on RK when there were seemingly perfectly viable alternatives. RK was his guy, and he decided he would stop at nothing. It was NOT just the money IMO. It was everything. But it was still awfully cocky of the club to say they didn't even bother to meet about it. That would kind of annoy me if I were either the Everton owner or RK. Not sure if that had any impact on what happened, probably not. But it still makes the board look awfully stupid.

 

[Archers Road]

Not sure if this has been discussed already but I'm concerned about whether we have (and whether it is possible/legal) a clause that prevents RK / Everton from poaching our players for a period of time. The Mirror (yes I know!) are reporting that we have not managed to make this a condition. This wouldn't surprise me and if I'm honest can see Virgil jumping ship rather quickly....

Not sure how a clause like that would stand up in court anyway tbh - and it's not as if we could expect Everton to honour it out of principle even if they signed it.

Think you can relax about Virgil though. He might be unhappy but he's just signed a new contract.

 

[Le Saint]

Not sure how a clause like that would stand up in court anyway tbh - and it's not as if we could expect Everton to honour it out of principle even if they signed it.

Think you can relax about Virgil though. He might be unhappy but he's just signed a new contract.

A contract! Don't make me laugh

 

[Le Saint]

VVD has a six year contract so wont be going this summer.

I think the clause was inserted from what has been discussed on here.

Imagine VW and possibly SM will go, but depends who comes in to manage.

Didn't someone suggest we are taking our time to appoint? Maybe this is a red herring as we could be tying things up sooner which would be outstanding by the Board...

I don't understand why people are clinging on to contracts. Haven't we learnt the lesson by now? All they mean is that we secure more money when they go at any point during that contract. Virgil signed when he thought all was rosy with Koeman. He's already made comments about being disappointed and "we'll see who's in the group when we return". So unless we appoint a manager of pedigree and don't start haemorrhaging players I can see that 6 year contract being as valuable as Ron's word!

 

[ihatemyselfandwanttodie]

Correct that contracts protect the clubs assets.

VVD being on a six year means we either get huge money within the next 2 years, or we keep for 3 years and his price will likely rise due to him being better.

Not sure what you're saying, any player is always for sale as you point out, I was just saying on a long contract out options are better and more protected, it is just good business practice.

I wasn't exactly clinging to the contract thing, I have that angle fairly well covered thanks...



QUOTE="Fonte of Knowledge, post: 9325929, member: 1028488"]I don't understand why people are clinging on to contracts. Haven't we learnt the lesson by now? All they mean is that we secure more money when they go at any point during that contract. Virgil signed when he thought all was rosy with Koeman. He's already made comments about being disappointed and "we'll see who's in the group when we return". So unless we appoint a manager of pedigree and don't start haemorrhaging players I can see that 6 year contract being as valuable as Ron's word![/QUOTE]

 

[Archers Road]

I don't understand why people are clinging on to contracts. Haven't we learnt the lesson by now? All they mean is that we secure more money when they go at any point during that contract. Virgil signed when he thought all was rosy with Koeman. He's already made comments about being disappointed and "we'll see who's in the group when we return". So unless we appoint a manager of pedigree and don't start haemorrhaging players I can see that 6 year contract being as valuable as Ron's word!

In the last couple of seasons we have held several players to their contracts. The problems come when the contract only has a year or two to run, and the player's transfer value starts to evaporate.

 

[Shepherd's Clearing]

I don't understand why people are clinging on to contracts. Haven't we learnt the lesson by now? All they mean is that we secure more money when they go at any point during that contract. Virgil signed when he thought all was rosy with Koeman. He's already made comments about being disappointed and "we'll see who's in the group when we return". So unless we appoint a manager of pedigree and don't start haemorrhaging players I can see that 6 year contract being as valuable as Ron's word!

Whilst I generally agree with this [having posted a similar sentiment about 2000 posts back in the past] on the other hand having a contract with Saints stymied Sadio, Victor and Morgan when they definitely wanted out didn't it?

So it can work to the club's advantage, I guess it is a case of who blinks first but every player has price a club is prepared to let them go for and every player has to play to showcase their talents so it is a fine line they all walk.

We shall see....

 

[Le Saint]

Correct that contracts protect the clubs assets.

VVD being on a six year means we either get huge money within the next 2 years, or we keep for 3 years and his price will likely rise due to him being better.

Not sure what you're saying, any player is always for sale as you point out, I was just saying on a long contract out options are better and more protected, it is just good business practice.

I wasn't exactly clinging to the contract thing, I have that angle fairly well covered thanks...



QUOTE="Fonte of Knowledge, post: 9325929, member: 1028488"]I don't understand why people are clinging on to contracts. Haven't we learnt the lesson by now? All they mean is that we secure more money when they go at any point during that contract. Virgil signed when he thought all was rosy with Koeman. He's already made comments about being disappointed and "we'll see who's in the group when we return". So unless we appoint a manager of pedigree and don't start haemorrhaging players I can see that 6 year contract being as valuable as Ron's word!

[/QUOTE]
All I'm saying is that I don't want to lose Virgil and happen to think we will. The fact that we will get more money is of little compensation when it's so hard to get a decent CB.

 

[ihatemyselfandwanttodie]

All I'm saying is that I don't want to lose Virgil and happen to think we will. The fact that we will get more money is of little compensation when it's so hard to get a decent CB.[/QUOTE]


Oh.

I think we will lose him too. Just maybe we think at different times, maybe 2 years from now and he may be sold, but don't think that will happen just now.

Who cares if he likes RK, he signed a contract, is handsomely rewarded for that and will go when our Board agree.

I like to publically back our Board on each occasion.

 

[Beddy]

Dear oh Dear...........We are in a tangle aren't we.......Arguing amongst ourselves as to who is to blame, suggesting the board told us porkies about various people going or staying. Even arguing about who said what...........not to mention the contract situation......
Guys..........I'm as disappointed as the next guy (or Gal come to that) Proportioning blame is not going to change the situation.
Surely when the board is upbeat when in negotiations that has to be right?
You argue they should keep us more informed...about what exactly when it comes to the business side of things? If they keep us up to date and let the opposition know how things are really going, by doing so they would be opening the door for the opposition as to the state of play.
None of us can possibly be kept totally up to date in the manor we would prefer...it would not make business sense.
As a lot have suggested, yes,the board have made mistakes. They will always make them, as the benefit of hind site alludes us all.
We as fans can only trust their judgement........and hope they get it right more often than they get it wrong...............

 

[fatletiss]

Not sure if this has been discussed already but I'm concerned about whether we have (and whether it is possible/legal) a clause that prevents RK / Everton from poaching our players for a period of time. The Mirror (yes I know!) are reporting that we have not managed to make this a condition. This wouldn't surprise me and if I'm honest can see Virgil jumping ship rather quickly....

Give us some reasoning to why you see Virgil jumping quickly then.

 

[Archers Road]

All I'm saying is that I don't want to lose Virgil and happen to think we will. The fact that we will get more money is of little compensation when it's so hard to get a decent CB.[/QUOTE]


We won't lose Virgil.

 

[fatletiss]

I don't understand why people are clinging on to contracts. Haven't we learnt the lesson by now? All they mean is that we secure more money when they go at any point during that contract. Virgil signed when he thought all was rosy with Koeman. He's already made comments about being disappointed and "we'll see who's in the group when we return". So unless we appoint a manager of pedigree and don't start haemorrhaging players I can see that 6 year contract being as valuable as Ron's word!

Oh for goodness sake man show some steel. Stop blubbering and just wait and see.

I am sorry to come across so aggressive but in all honesty it sounds as if you think our club is run by a bunch of amateurs. Our manager has gone, just have a bit of patience and see what they do. They've successfully managed every situation thrown at them todate.

Perhaps that should at least allow you to take a deep breath and give them a little time to take some actions.

If we lose half our best players again and appoint Ian Branfoot, then I'll be right there with you moaning and worrying. Until then, chill.

 

[Missing Lambo]

Personally, I think Koeman thought that money was nice, but not the master, and found that when sufficient was dangled in front of him that he leaned towards it being so.

However, someone did come up with a decent footballing reason. Koeman was at the end of 3 years and had either signed, or was about to sign an improved extension to that. He already was the best paid manager Saints had ever had. But his spectacular footballing gains were harder to achieve. Despite reaching Europe, there was a decent risk of having a poor season, with the extra heavy load. With Everton, there was a huge transfer fund and a whole lot of leeway to be had. A much easier prospect to make improvements, on the face of it. But we'll see how brilliant he is at getting the right players in, after saying goodbye to the best recruitment system in the Premier League. It isn't going to be as easy as he thinks. Still, there's always £6M per year to make him feel better. And the quick prospect of putting himself in line for his dreamed Barcelona job after a couple of years. He obviously reckons he's that good. There are several who think he's not upto it.

It might be argued that Ron has just increased that risk! But you're right, there have been several posters noting that we might slip a little next season. Most of those making this comment were the calm and savvy ones. He may not have fancied being at the helm as we were knocked out of Europe late in the season, and realised we were about to finish a few points above the drop zone (cf Everton a couple of years back).

Money aside (and no, I'm not naive. It will have played a huge part) this is the behaviour of a man with a huge ego and very cold feet, in my view.

Ron says, "Hmmm. We could stay at Southampton, and despite brilliant player recruitment on my part (black box? Pah!) we suffer from too many games and end the season with nothing OR face the challenge of improving an under-performing team with lots of money."

Erwin looks up from his chips. "No brainer, brother. And I can get that place in The Maldives (ed - acceptable substitutes allowed).

 

[fran-MLs little camera]

People are assuming that the players are all desperate to play for Ronald, don't want to play for Saints and that they are not pissed off with the Lying Dutchman. Most will be happy and were looking forward to next season playing alongside their team mates. JWP, VVD and Forster did not sign longer contracts purely because of Koeman....it was the whole vibe around the place. And they would have to get passed Les....I think they will find the shutters are down....door closed.

Player: Les, can I have a word.
Les: Yes (accompanied by a basilisk stare).

Player: Nice day, isn't it? (exit stage left).

 

[Le Saint]

Oh for goodness sake man show some steel. Stop blubbering and just wait and see.

I am sorry to come across so aggressive but in all honesty it sounds as if you think our club is run by a bunch of amateurs. Our manager has gone, just have a bit of patience and see what they do. They've successfully managed every situation thrown at them todate.

Perhaps that should at least allow you to take a deep breath and give them a little time to take some actions.

If we lose half our best players again and appoint Ian Branfoot, then I'll be right there with you moaning and worrying. Until then, chill.

Just to set the record straight. The only thing I am "moaning and blubbering about" (you are so passive aggressive) is the total lack of loyalty from players and managers. I totally back our board and do not blame them for anything (maybe apart from slight naivety) and trust them to steer us through yet more choppy waters. To repeat, I think Virgil will up sticks - he has already come out with negative looking comments which surely you would agree are a tad negative having just penned a 6 year contract? I honestly hope I'm wrong and you are all right.

 

[thereisonlyoneno7]

We care about literacy on here.

Yep we care about literacy nothing [emoji6]

 

[Missing Lambo]

Oh for goodness sake man show some steel. Stop blubbering and just wait and see.

I am sorry to come across so aggressive but in all honesty it sounds as if you think our club is run by a bunch of amateurs. Our manager has gone, just have a bit of patience and see what they do. They've successfully managed every situation thrown at them todate.

Perhaps that should at least allow you to take a deep breath and give them a little time to take some actions.

If we lose half our best players again and appoint Ian Branfoot, then I'll be right there with you moaning and worrying. Until then, chill.

You mentioned Branfoot. Isn't that as great a sin as mentioning a member of that team that won the Cup in '84?

I feel I may need to report that last post, despite my agreeing with it. Branfoot. Wash your mouth out now.

 

[fatletiss]

People are assuming that the players are all desperate to play for Ronald, don't want to play for Saints and that they are not pissed off. Most will be happy and were looking forward to next season playing alongside their team mates. JWP, VVD and Forster did not sign longer contracts purely because of Koeman....it was the whole vibe around the place. And they would have to get passed Les....I think they will find the shutters are down....door closed.

Player: Les, can I have a word.
Les: Yes (accompanied by a basilisk stare).

Player: Nice day, isn't it? (exit left).

Just a very important part to consider. How do those worried about people like vvd leaving, think they view Ronald now? You don't think he was part of the discussion for them to sign a long term deal? They probably feel equally as let down by him as we do. They may just be thinking "snake" and not likely to rich to join him.