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Whoops, clearly the squad is not as good as the one which got us promoted. That is why we are where we are. It is disjointed, poorly balanced and other sides have overtaken us in ability, tactics and performance. If you don't see that then you are in a dream world.

I will accept the tactics part is down to the manager (and he needs to look at that) but we have had 8 - 10 players - mostly signed in the last 18 months or so - who are content to pick up their ridiculous wages and sit out games, or on the bench if they are lucky, while doing just enough in training. Cala was the only one with the balls to let his feelings be known - result, a quick exit for him to find a new club and good for us in getting him off the payroll.

If you don't like the phrase about not being able to polish turds then how about can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

2 years ago we had players with great experience at Championship level in Hudson, Taylor, Cowie and Helguson. They know what was needed and applied themselves to it. Those that are left have been worked out - Whitts needs forever and a day on the ball, close him down and he is ineffective, Gunnar will run all day but heart rules head and he gets caught out of position frequently - also not the most skillful. Noone is only now getting back to match fitness.

Who does that leave? Marshie and Turner, both of whom have not been at their best for the last 2 games.

All good reasons why fresh blood is needed and why I won't fully judge Slade until February. Pilkington's return in a week or two will help. It is not hard to see that our downturn started with his injury, just when he was showing the form that justified his fee and why Norwich fans didn't want him to go.

By the way, the pi$$ poor attitude of the crowd doesn't help. It hardly encourages the guys on the park does it?

It's about time we started to pull together as a club in all aspects. Then we might start to move forward again.
 
Blue. Thankyou. We will have to agree to disagree as I believe the defence and midfield are as good or even better than that which got us promoted and the excuses that the players are not Slade's, the squad is unfit and the squad is imbalanced simply don't wash with me. Giving Slade money for new players in January would be a huge mistake in my book.

I shall continue to live in my dreamworld as you see it.
 
Sorry Blue but there's no way the squad is as poor as you make out.

Marshall, Manga, Turner, Brayford, Whitts, Gunnar, Noone, Alf, KWJ, Pilkington

Only a left back away from a better side man for man (or the same man) compared to our championship winning side.

My man Kimbo is the perfect example of what is going wrong though. He's been mismanaged and played out of position the result is a player who looks a shell of the one who took Whitts shirt in the starting 11. We have square pegs in round holes.
The reason the formation changed worked so well despite using the same 11 was players were being used in a way they both understood and were suited to. Poor Gunnar is made to look a dick chasing all over the field trying to make up for Whitts complete lack of energy and movement. Put him in front of the back 4 and he was in back doing what he does best. Whitts also looked completely lost first half, not knowing whether to track midfield runners (who almost certainly have the pace to leave him trailing) or fill in spaces. He spent the first half retreating to a position in front of his centre backs marking fresh air whilst Brentford played down the sides of him. That continually tempted Forrest gump (Fabio) in from his left back position leaving even more space down the flanks for Brentford's front 3 to exploit. Moving Whitts to the left of the diamond simplified his defensive work and he did a much better job. He also found a little pocket of space to influence the game from, I've wondered for a long time how to fit Whitts into a side, that inside left position could be the solution.

I mentioned the crowd's attitude before the weekend, Snlk asked how we can support the current setup? No one is supporting anything! Cheering when a goal goes in is hardly support. Ok the atmosphere was better 2nd half but I think that was mainly based on how surprised we all were they'd turned the performance level around so much <laugh>
 
All some of us are saying is simply that this squad as a whole has not lived up to the tag of "one of the best in the Championship" as was repeatedly stated by the media time and time again at the start of the season.

Having said that, and this is where I'm coming from, the squad is still better than the results it's achieving under Slade.

The marginalisation by Slade of the more skillful but less physical players I mentioned earlier (and I'll include Kimbo in that Stevo <laugh>) is sure evidence of the guy's lack of management skills at this level. By all means start from a sound base, but when that doesn't work, FFS don't repeat it over and over again in some sort of blind faith that one day it will.

Try something different and utilise the footballing skills of our players in a different system rather than serving up more of the same - that's "management".
 
Kimbo, Macheda, ALF, Fabio, Whitts, all proven at this level at least.

Why are they playing ****??????.....Simple.....poor management.
 
Good exchange of views guys and positive for us that we can do it without falling out. We all have differing opinions but, as far as I can see, most of us on here want what is best for the team/club and do not have personal agendas as on other fan sites.

My belief is that we need to play with more energy and commitment. Harris, while not having the best of games Saturday (he still put in some great crosses that were instrumental in our first goal), has brought some of that in with the enthusiasm of youth. We need more of what he has to help us press the opposition and push them back, not allowing them to dictate as has happened in the last 3 games. The return of Pilkington in the next 2/3 weeks will aid that also - even if it means Noonie has some bench time.

I know I am repeating what I have said elsewhere but we really need high energy midfielders (look at Brentford with Pritchard - who had a brilliant first half - and Judge - and Bournemouth, where you could pick any from 5 plus their 2 full backs) who can hurt the opposition where it counts.

If the 8 to 10 go of course we will need new players but I think 4 tops will do the trick - new left back, 2 midfield and someone who can find the net more often than we do at present. Who, where from and how much I don't know but there have to be changes if we are going to climb out of this mess.

Not to sign anyone who can develop the squad will be a big mistake.
 
I'd like to see us sign a high energy midfielder and an experienced left back.

Pritchard will not have ever had an easier game of professional football than the 1st half at the CCS. We didn't get within 10 yards of him and made him look like the Championships answer to Lionel Messi! How often do you watch a player collect the ball 10 yards from his own box and run totally unopposed to the opposition's!!! 2nd half with his space restricted and put under a little pressure he looked a much more normal class of player (whilst still looking tidy).
 
whiffletree said:
Kimbo, Macheda, ALF, Fabio, Whitts, all proven at this level at least.

Why are they playing s**t??????.....Simple.....poor management.
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I know I'm like a stuck record but do you honestly class Fabio as proven as a defender? He has ability as a footballer for sure, but his decision making is the worst I've seen from any defender ever in a City shirt.
Just a genuine question as he seems to have support from the people around me in the stands who love to see him diving in whilst blissfully ignoring him being taken apart in the next move!
Glad to see you mention Macheda though as I think whilst he's a bit off and on he potentially has a lot to offer.
 
It was not hard to predict how Brentford would set up and play.

I had thought Slade and his hapless no2 would have realised that and played an extra body in the centre of the park to combat, and just go one up top.

It took them 45 minutes to realise that.

That is now 5 goals scored from outside our box in 2 games. The midfield are hopeless at closing down.

Le Flopdre; well words fail me. He is shocking. I said to my son when Gray chipped Marshall for their 2nd, that Le Fondre would have missed that. He had 3 chances. One he unbelievably turned around and poked it wide, then he missed a decent cross from Noone and then finally he tried to chest a tap in when he should have nutted it in.

Macheda. Will he ever put a shift in?

Whittingham. Will he ever tackle? Will he close down? Will he ever score a direct free kick again (2 years in the league and counting)

Gunnarrsson. Jeez, he is so slow and cumbersome.

Fabio and Brayford. Lost the ability to run forward and track back.

Turner. The worse passer of a football in the team.

Why won't they give Daehli, Adeyami or Guerra a chance? Guerra scored 15 goals for a lower La Liga team yet deemed worse than Le Flopdre and Macheda.
Who is to blame? The players or the manager/coach no2?

They are all equally culpable.
 
Stevoldinho said:
I know I'm like a stuck record but do you honestly class Fabio as proven as a defender? He has ability as a footballer for sure, but his decision making is the worst I've seen from any defender ever in a City shirt.
Just a genuine question as he seems to have support from the people around me in the stands who love to see him diving in whilst blissfully ignoring him being taken apart in the next move!
Glad to see you mention Macheda though as I think whilst he's a bit off and on he potentially has a lot to offer.
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<laugh><laugh>.......understatement of the bloody century.....<laugh>

Blinkers off Stevo - he's been absolutely crass in his role up front this season. He's brought very little to the party for a 6' 2" striker. We need a lot better from him to justify Slade's obsession with picking him. Why was he given the nod over Jones on Saturday with two out and out wingers to service a combative frontman?

Slade struck out again. All speculation I know, but if Jones had been on from the start, Brenford would have been far more wary of going forward like they did.
 
I know I'm like a stuck record but do you honestly class Fabio as proven as a defender?
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I know where your coming from, but he was Man of the Match in consecutive games a couple of weeks ago....maybe he needs someone like Pilkington or Ralls in front of him as cover??? My point, though is that Slade is dismally failing to make the most of the talent at his disposal....either by playing them out of position, or plain bad man management.
 
Jones isn't much better than Macheda imo. He can be and was on Saturday when he came on and put a shift in. He drives me insane in most games though, walking back onside not getting back when the team needs his help. If Jones played the way he did Saturday week in week out he would be the first name on that team sheet each week.

Midfield is a shambles at the moment and until that is sorted out and the possession stats improve we are going to see much of the same I'm afraid. Whitts isn't playing in his best position he isn't and will never be a defensive midfielder, he should be allowed to get forward and much higher up the pitch.

Marshall should never of been made captain, no offence to him but don't believe goal keepers ever should be. We need someone out on the pitch, a leader, shouting orders at everyone.

Not sure what the answer is at the moment, Slade doesn't seem to know what to do, the fans are divided and the players don't look like they want to be here. It's really hard to watch everything that is going on at the club and its defiantly not enjoyable.
 
I'll be honest with you Nat, I'm not a fan of Kenwyne either but it horses for courses and he was the right man when playing two true widemen. Macheda was pants.....again!

Agree about the captaincy. Goalkeeper is the wrong position - how can he communicate properly with the midfield let alone the front men?

For me the midfield was, is, and will be the major problem for the side. We have either got the wrong men at the club (possibly) or are playing the wrong system (probably) to accommodate what we do have. We desperately need a midfield general.

I've mentioned Bryson and Hoolihan a few times recently as being in the right mould. Can't Slade and the club in general see that's where we are seriously lacking?
 
bluebird_nat said:
Jones isn't much better than Macheda imo. He can be and was on Saturday when he came on and put a shift in. He drives me insane in most games though, walking back onside not getting back when the team needs his help. If Jones played the way he did Saturday week in week out he would be the first name on that team sheet each week.

Midfield is a shambles at the moment and until that is sorted out and the possession stats improve we are going to see much of the same I'm afraid. Whitts isn't playing in his best position he isn't and will never be a defensive midfielder, he should be allowed to get forward and much higher up the pitch.
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Exactly. KWJ is turning into some kind of cult figure with his name being sung whilst Macheda is demonised. I don't get it. If they're **** they're both as **** as each other except Macheda is much younger. Goals to games ratio is very similar, games where they absolutely haven't shown up, very similar too. To suggest a different lazy striker would have changed that first half is optimistic at best Sparks.

To blame Slade for not picking one or other is kind of like saying slating him because he called heads or tails wrong whilst you flipped a coin.

I'm in total agreement on the keepers as captains issue.
 
I've already said that Kenwyne is not my cup of tea, but he's a far better option as a target man than Macheda is right now. The fact that Macheda's "much younger" has got fck all to do with it - this is today not a few years time.

To say that if Kenwyne played like he did Saturday week in week out, he'd be first name on the sheet is fair enough. That offers up the question then that when Macheda is playing such s**t stuff all the time, why has he apparently been favoured? Double standards being applied here to suit an argument.

Kenwyne comes across as a lazy indifferent player on times and he riles me for it, but I'll take that every time over an under achieving useless lump that's much younger.

I did say it would be impossible to ever know, but I still maintain that Jones would have put the Brentford defence under more pressure that first half than Macheda achieved. For Christ sake man, Kenwyne could have stood still up there and achieved that....<laugh>
 
Oldsparkey said:
I've already said that Kenwyne is not my cup of tea, but he's a far better option as a target man than Macheda is right now. The fact that Macheda's "much younger" has got fck all to do with it - this is today not a few years time.

To say that if Kenwyne played like he did Saturday week in week out, he'd be first name on the sheet is fair enough. That offers up the question then that when Macheda is playing such s**t stuff all the time, why has he apparently been favoured? Double standards being applied here to suit an argument.

Kenwyne comes across as a lazy indifferent player on times and he riles me for it, but I'll take that every time over an under achieving useless lump that's much younger.

I did say it would be impossible to ever know, but I still maintain that Jones would have put the Brentford defence under more pressure that first half than Macheda achieved. For Christ sake man, Kenwyne could have stood still up there and achieved that....<laugh>
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He's tried that before Sparks <laugh>
 
Trouble is when KWJ starts we do little more than lump the ball up to him. If he wants to work at it as when he came on second half Saturday then we don't look too bad but contrast that with his first half. lethargic lack of effort v. Bournemouth. Was he actually playing???? He only scored there because their full back fell over and ALF had the presence of mind to square the ball to Jones who was in a much better position to score. Mind you I think he mish!t that as he did for Saturday's goal. <doh>

In fact, both of them seem to perform better when used as subs when they have something to prove. If KWJ could start a game and perform as he did when he came on Saturday he would get my vote but he seems to have something of a split personality.

However, I really dislike the route one stuff we play at KWJ. Over the years we seem to sign big forwards who can win air ball (Macheda being the exception) but never seem able to find the more mobile partner striker so the whole concept becomes a waste. The only partnership I can recall in the last 10 years which had some success with this tactic was Steve Thompson and Chopra. Unfortunately Thompson became a bit shy in finding the back of the net himself.

We know Macheda is crap in the air so we seem to pass it around more when he is in the side and occasionally it works - first half v. Norwich (he was knackered by then) and also v. Forest. He is not as lazy as Jones and can make an effort to close down defenders. However, his control is poor and Noonie is better in the air than him.
 
The reason for the young comment is that Macheda can develop, KWJ is what he is.

The reason I back Macheda is that he moves. He runs channels and is quite intelligent in the way he moves around the field. I think we have the potential to play better football with him rather than the lazy direct football we slump into when KWJ is an option up front, like the Rotherham game (in which KWJ was absolute ****ing rubbish).

To be fair and repeat Nat's point (about the midfield), we could have had RVP and Falcao up front Saturday but the complete failure of our midfield would have rendered them useless 1st half. Ninian is right that Alf seems to be escaping the criticism despite the fact he's still missing chances and costing points. It's strange we're arguing about Macheda and KWJ who've each scored a few whilst totally ignoring a 'striker' who's ratio is horrendous. He does run around a lot like Fabio though.........
 
Steve - I think ALF will come good. And I know I've said that for weeks but his track record tells me it will happen for him.

Like any striker not scoring regularly he then has a lack of confidence, e.g. that first half miss when he could have passed it in with his left but wasn't sure in his ability so turned to take it on his right and either the keeper or defender deflected it wide.

Yes, he runs around a lot but that work is valuable in closing down defenders and running channels to make space for others. Trouble is there is no one smart enough to take advantage of it.

If we didn't have ALF what are our options in that role? KWJ and Macheda together <yikes>, Maynard, a slower version of ALF or Guerra who has obviously pi$$ed off Slade so much that he will never darken CCS's doors ever again.
 
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