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English Football - How can we change it?

Discussion in 'Bristol City' started by smhbcfc, Sep 8, 2013.

  1. BrightredRickster

    BrightredRickster Well-Known Member

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    The last time we had one of the world's best midfield players running our team
     
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  2. BrightredRickster

    BrightredRickster Well-Known Member

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    The reason is that as kids they are taught to regard their expertise with the ball as art, incorporating such qualities as grace, skill and finesse, wit and utter precision, all qualities that a player like Gascoigne for example possessed naturally, but is bred in kids at a young age on the continent. Here they are qualities regarded as feminine at best.
    I watched the South Americans in New York prepare for a game by playing keepy-uppy in a wide circle whilst discussing the game or the TV or whatever. I also watched the british players limbering up, and frankly found it painful to watch.
    In a Euro kiddies game any pass over ten yards is treated with howls of derision. In a Euro kiddies game, the goal is two feet wide, protected by a player who cant use his hands, and the ball cant rise any higher than two feet off the ground. They are invariably 6 aside, very fast, and extremely skillful.
    No wonder the world has moved on. Its the old problem of -we think we are so bloody marvelous and superior because we gave the game to the world that we dont need to work at it, and oh dear! The rest of the world has moved on...
     
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  3. johngalleyfan2

    johngalleyfan2 Well-Known Member

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    Robin Van Persie interestingly runs his own coaching school for children. Start them young is the Dutch mantra.
    been to Holland a bit and they do let the youngsters off the leash a lot earlier, I used to watch a game of football most evenings weekends and school holidays from my shack, the kids used play for a couple of hours at times almost a full side each all ages from 5-6 up to maybe 14-16 year olds the smaller ones were always getting involved with the bigger lads, the mix was don't play for a team or some do school, under 13 14 15 16 etc rubs off on the rest..new headmaster and it all stopped..where to go nowhere....what did they do? mischief or played x box or watched the tele....if only 1 every year made it to a proper league side like forest green or similar!

    I know there are areas around Bristol where kids still do the same but up here they don't. If there was 10 places in Bristol catering for 20 -30 youngsters that's over 200 kids get an opportunity, take away 5 places that's only 100.....

    Maybe Ashton Vale should become a sports academy of pitchs for rugby football hockey netball tennis, bit like the downs but organised with parking refreshments changing rooms and a small cover charge
     
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  4. Cliftonville

    Cliftonville Well-Known Member

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    Those qualities can be taught easily ( with repetition and time) to kids here. Google Simon Clifford, talent that comes from his soccer school franchise is eye catching, but it costs.

    The Germans have taken the British pressing style of football and added technique to it. There is that happy medium England could and can achieve simar.

    How? Take a few % of tv revenue and put on place a nationsl network of free coaching, adhered to regulated standards and start with kids of primary school age. That then increases the pool of talent for academies at nine, and then onto senior football.

    Its a sort of Spanish model, but requires Egland to increase its amount of coaches by 300 %.

    It of course costs money, there are Suarezs to be bought instead.
     
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  5. Cliftonville

    Cliftonville Well-Known Member

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    No need for Ashton Vale use Bristols other parks, Manor Farm, Briz FC. What is needed is to increase coaching coverage massively to make it cheap/free, but also highly accessible.

    All possible in Cities and Towns with a % of tv money. That is what Mr Dyke should have been going after with the Minister for sport at his side.
     
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  6. Cove

    Cove Well-Known Member

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    To you lot who think just having youngsters playing at youth academies is enough to get your national team to a higher level are plain wrong. There is a way bigger factor which weighs a lot heavier on the quality a nation can produce. And that is opportunity. In the Dutch league, most youngsters can start their career at an Eredivisie club at age 18-19, sometimes 20. Clubs like FC Twente, Ajax, PSV and Feyenoord don't instant buy new players, they look to their academy first if a player is sold. It's not just the academy but giving youngster the opportunity to get first team experience when they are 18/19 so they age and develop better and faster.

    In England there is a culture that all clubs have to buy at least 3,4 sometimes 5 or like Newcastle last winter, 10. Liverpool did it a year ago and instantly Sterling popped up. But that is just the one. Imagine a league where all clubs would look to their youth academies first and possible transfers second. You'd see new quality English players every season. This is the underlying problem for England. Not having too many foreign players in the league, but the instant reaction of clubs and fans to buy new players every summer or winter when the transfer market opens.
     
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  7. Three Lions BS3

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    England yet again couldnt keep the ball. Thats a lack of skill not opportunity.
     
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  8. BrightredRickster

    BrightredRickster Well-Known Member

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    A lack of skill, precision, co-ordination and self confidence.
     
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  9. Supcon72

    Supcon72 Well-Known Member

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    I blame Hodgson tonight, umpteen managers have tried Lampard & Gerrard together, and you can probably count on one hand how many times it has worked. We are dogged in using 4-4-2 at International level, and with 2 such similar layers it just does not work. We are far too predictable in what we are going to do, John Terry hit the nail on the head at the last tournament when saying we needed Joe Cole to 'unlock' defences, currently we have nobody and the wrong formation to allow this to happen. Jack Wiltshire has the ability, but the formation constrains him.

    Go 3-5-2 or 3-5-1-1 and allow players to float and interchange positions so we are not so obvious, on this qualifying showing we will do well to get out the group stages in Brazil as we are very very poor right now.
    My starting 11 if all fit and available

    Hart
    Jagielka Terry Cahill

    Johnson Cole

    Gerrard
    Walcott Wiltshire

    Sturridge Rooney


    Subs:
    Foster
    Dawson
    Baines
    Lampard
    Welbeck
    Young
    Defoe/Lambert (Depending on the opposition)
    Sterling

    Plenty of youth and experience and a formation that allows for movement and disruption to the opposition'stactics. It is time to consign square ball Barry & Milner to the fringes and let some youngsters have a go, after all what have we achieved with those 2 in the team??
     
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  10. Cliftonville

    Cliftonville Well-Known Member

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    Hodgson got a good result, I expected them to lose. He is limping a poor team, and a poor squad to a championship here.

    He cannot play fluid football if the players at his disposal are not comfortable with both feet.

    The standard of England last night was sobering. Players making wrong decisions and going long/ forcing passes. The skill set to play fluid football where players interchange positions exists in maybe one or two, and that is it.
     
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  11. Red Alert

    Red Alert Well-Known Member

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    Suicide. Players in this team cant master one position let alone two or switch around. Hodgson should keep it tight and see what happen. The Germand and spanish are passing machines fluid football needs passing team. That back four to start are hardly passers of football. Midfield there Walcott and passing!!! That team would never have the ball.
     
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  12. johngalleyfan2

    johngalleyfan2 Well-Known Member

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    we played not to lose
    and Ukraine played on the break, both sides played not lose
    pity about Walcott getting "injured"...
     
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  13. WURZEL LOYAL

    WURZEL LOYAL New Member

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    Hodgson is taking a dog of a team to a championship, or appears to be.

    He can use the juicy check he will get to parry the slating he will get when England stink the place out.

    Who there could you tell kids to watch closely?
     
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  14. BrightredRickster

    BrightredRickster Well-Known Member

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    Under the circumstances, this was never going to be a festival of football. There was just too much at stake and nerves were shredded.
    The England team must be judged on how they perform at the tournament itself, and against the best teams.
    In order to flourish in that environment, it will need a brave man indeed to structure the side around youth, and build it around Wilshere.
    There are a number of players in the set up at the moment who are past their sell by date.
    Out goes Young, in comes Barkley, and I like the idea of matching Wilshere with Joe Cole. Sturridge is the future with Rooney linking in the hole
    The players are there, but it needs us to shake free of this boring unimaginative comfort zone. Otherwise we will never match up with the best
     
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  15. smhbcfc

    smhbcfc Well-Known Member

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    We gave the ball away far too much - we need to teach young plyers to love the ball
     
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  16. Supcon72

    Supcon72 Well-Known Member

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    Red Alert

    Your keep it tight and see where we go comments are exactly why English football is so far behind the curve, as that mentality is all to prevelant and has held us back for years. Sven used it and we got nowhere and little has changed since. We need a fresh outlook and if that means we fail to qualify for the next Euros to make us a better proposition at the following World Cup then so be it, as keep it tight and see where we go is;

    A. Terrible to watch
    B. will not see us win a game at any knockout stage in the tournaments
     
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  17. Red Alert

    Red Alert Well-Known Member

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    Open it up and England get their arse handed to them again like Germany did last time.

    This lot are not good ennough to play high temp presssing football, and it is delusional to expect a second tier national team with medocre players to imitate Spain. Last night they couldnt retain possession v the Ukraine. No way can thisot pressike Spain and Germany and play fluid football.
     
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  18. gdknac

    gdknac Well-Known Member

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    I think that the table flatters England somewhat- We have won 4 (2v Moldova and 2 v San Marino) who lets face it, most league 1 or 2 sides would give a game to, and drawn 4. Yes, 3 of those 4 were away. There are 2 games at home which need to be won if we are to stay top. Ukraine and Montenegro are good as assured 3 more points each as they paly San marino and Moldova-

    I can see it coming down to winning at home against the poles- Those old enough to remember that night in 1973??
     
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  19. RedorDead

    RedorDead Well-Known Member

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    Don't know what you lot are whining on, try being Welsh then you will see what being **** is all about <whistle>
     
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  20. smhbcfc

    smhbcfc Well-Known Member

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    It's a British disease - need better coaching, change in attitude (parents and young people), Government to change it's policy on school sport/funding
     
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