To be honest I was suspicious that Webber was in equal cars with Vettel from the start of the season but did not see any point in bringing it up because I had no proof or even any real argument. But it seemed like (this is all just a bit of a conspiracy theory and I am not sure how serious it is) Red Bull were trying to create a large gap between Vettel and Webber both performance/points wise and also mentally wise just so there would not be any competition and to raise Vettel's status (I do not think Vettel is privy to any off it). It just that Webber had constant problems every races and was miles off Vettel's pace which I find odd because they were very close last season and even if Vettel had improved due to winning the WDC I do not think it would of been that much and also Webber declining in competitiveness. I also find it suspicious that now Vettel has got his humongous cushion Webber is right back at being competitive again. Red Bull will say it is because Webber had trouble adapting to the tyres but why should he? All the other drivers have had no real problems like Webber allegedly has had, he also has always seemed like a driver who can adapt quickly enough and drive around problems which should lend itself to adapting well to different tyres. I must stress that this is massively theoretical and just musings more than anything else. It is also not a swipe at Vettel in anyway.
Webber sounds like the perfect catch for Renault should Kubica not return next year. I can't see the point in heading to Ferrari where he will only receive the exact same number 2 treatment as he currently does at RBR. People say that at least Ferrari are open about it but surely if he was happy about being an open number 2 driver he would just stay at Red Bull in the first place? Perhaps it's time for him to move on to WTCC or DTM.
'his car is not of the same performance' - I have often wondered if a slight tweak ensures glory to the German! Not exactly the first time in F1 teams.
Of course Red Bull are showing favouritism to Vettel. He is the number one driver. I wouldn't be surprised if Webber was getting a slower car than Vettel, especially as they were a great deal closer last season, although Webber has mentioned the tyres are more difficult for him this season. There is more to this than just a rehash of what most people suspect already.
I completely understand your sentiments here Mifune. So do quite a few others but people are afraid to speak up when there is no proof, which is probably why it has not been a topic for discussion before. Good point Basil. Webber still has an obligation to speak to the press. When questioned about his performance, he has to be diplomatic. Tyres is an easy 'escape' and may be entirely true if his car is such that he sees no alternative other than burning the tyres in an effort to keep pace with a quicker car (for instance).
So what was going on in 2010 then? Vettel getting a worse car with breakdowns, while Mark's was bullet proof and was being praised for his sensitive touches behind the wheel... Maybe the best of "Webber's crew" last year have joined forces with the Sebastians "best crew". Funny how something as small as this can dictate a season.
So when Vettels car was breaking down at the start of last season, giving Webber a very undeserved crack at the title, where were all these "RBR are deliberately sabotaging Vettel" threads? oh, I see, when it happens to the one you don't like it's just one of those things, but when it happens to Whiney Webber it has to be a conspiracy, because of course Webber is the fastest man alive, as proven by the fact he's managed to beat 1 or 2 of his rookie team-mates in the past.
This is a bit of an exhaustive post but I've had these debates a few times with a maddeningly paranoid Webber fan and a couple of mates who bought into Briatore's claims about the Roulette wheel being fixed. The first thing I'd like to point out is the bad luck Webber has had this year (and lets not forget that Kers has been troubling Seb as well as Mark this year), and the fact that it was all Vettel's last year: Bahrain: Spark plug Australia: Wheel nut Spain: Wheel nut and brakes Monaco: Defective chassis Turkey: Anti-roll bar Montreal: Gearbox There was also a bizarre incident in Monza; The race before Webber had built up a forty-something point lead over Vettel and had spent the intervening days imploring Red Bull to prioritise. Vettel found himself ahead of Webber in the race before losing drive. As soon as Webber had gone by and built a small cushion Vettel suddenly recovered power and was untroubled for the rest of the race. Now I'm not saying anything untoward had happened, but if the boot was on the other foot eyebrows certainly would've been raised. In response to the claim that Vettel is suddenly much faster than Webber this year, I don't feel that is the case. In Vettel's rookie season he comfortably outscored Webber (the Toro-Rosso Vettel was driving had the same chassis, better engine, but worse aero. As well as an inferior race team). So the difference in performance was there from the beginning. Fast forward to 2009 when Vettel joined Webber at Red Bull. Vettel joined very much as the Number 2 driver, as was highlighted by the fact that Webber was given the number 1 car (14 to Vettel's 15) despite scoring less points the season before. A similar situation to that at Mercedes where Schumacher gets the lower number ahead of Rosberg. The "emotional support" Webber talked of last season was very much on his side in 2009, he was the senior driver whilst Vettel, as Webber put it, was the young pup. Vettel let his driving do the talking though (in much the same was as Rosberg the last two season), outscoring Webber again and demolishing him 15-2 in qualifying. So the gap hasn't suddenly appeared between the two drivers, it's always been there. 2010 Vettel had all the bad luck and still managed to pip Webber at the end. 2011 and the bad luck has all been Webber's and Vettel's destroyed him. In reality he gap would be somewhere between the two seasons. I'd say over the course of a season, all things being equal, Vettel would be good for at least 50 points over Webber.
You have claimed that you work for Red Bull, but you don't know whether this has happened or not. Are you employed in the overworked Red Bull Rule Circumnavigation Department, and consequently don't get out much
Bang on, I say, bang on. The hypocrisy of Webber and his fans is apalling. I can remember all the calls on 606 last year saying RBR should give team orders for Webber, they're probably the same voices decrying those alledged (and ignored) 'team orders' now. total and utter hypocrisy. I think they've been treated as equally as they can be, Webber played wing-gate perfectly, and Vettel having a German accent doesn't help the blatant favoritsm shown to webber on british forums. Webber is nothing but a 2-faced whiney hypocrite, about to sign YET ANOTHER contract extension, his 2nd since he started complaining vocally to the media about how RBR were playing favorites. He's a complete and utter tosser, if he really thinks that they've been playing favorites he would've been a man and left at the end of last season when his stock was pretty high.
Oh dear. I am wondering if Red Bull's entry into F1 will be roughly analogous to Red Bull's effects on the human body i.e. when will F1 crash down and ask itself why did it ever let that disgusting brand anywhere near it. The regulation wavering we see at the moment I interpret as the heart palpitations that regular Red Bull users report.
Reminded me of something David Croft said on a Friday practice a couple of months back: "It was Dietrich's birthday party last night, I wonder if many of them were drinking his product..."
Miggins, your post are getting a little repetitve and to be fair, just blatantly pointless! I think some of your comments are quite frankly stupid and seem to be just personal hatred for a driver with very little acurate and factual information to support the allegations you make! Unless you know the man and can vouch for his charachter (or lack of in your HUMBLE opinion) I think neither you or anybody else on here are in a position to slander him or anybody else to the extent you are! I agree that Vettle doesn't naturally lend himself to the heart of the british public but I think we can all acknowledge his talent and the tough task Webber has in competeing with one of the fastest drivers. In addition I dont recall too many people calling out for team orders in his favour, even though Red Bull were obviously slightly worried that Webber might in actual fact win the WDC that year and I never recall Horner every instructing Vettle to hold station and not challenge Webber even though that was on the lead in to the final few races! That is the way it should be and the best driver won in 2010! However, you support the team that would "never use team orders and were here to race fairly for the sake of the sport" who now issues team orders when the driver has an unasailable lead with half of the championship remaining - Bizzare! Why dont you go and stick your head in some cold water, calm down and be more constructive in you vocal assault on the sport!
unassailable lead? if they'd come together, Alonso, in his newly flexi-winged Ferrari, would be 75 points, 3 wins, behind Vettel with 10 races to go, that is no where near unassailable, and issueing a 'hold station' with less than 5% of the race left with nothing to gain and everything to lose from a team perspective is by no means unusual or unprecedented, even when team orders were illegal, the furore now is simply because of the 2 personalities involved and the perceived and completely unproven 'favouritism' shown to Vettel, which is no-where near the completely obvious favouritism Williams showed to Webber over Pizzonia which Pizzonia, who never got the upgrades Webber did, whined about and was told by Webber to stop crying and man up about it
It should be obvious to anyone who looks at the contradictory stance from Red Bull management, that things are somewhat easier for one driver. This is in no way a criticism of Vettel. Any favoured driver would be foolish not to take what's given. Vettel's goal is to re-write records. Red Bull's management is thoroughly supportive of such an ambition, since by proxy, such an achievement would leave them (and the perception of their product) standing on top of the world indefinitely. Red Bull has a marketing strategy which is wholly focussed on the realisation of this ideal.
