Sounds like you Dad was a man's man that done his bit. Its the aftermath that remains. My Great grandad was there, made it home in 45 but died a few months later, i don't know details, but his lungsweren't the same when he came home.
Mr B lived a few doors down from us... he had been held prisoner by the Japanese. He and his children (and g'children) have had his stories passed down.
I would have loved to have heard war stories passed down but had no heroes in my family. WW1, my paternal grandad, army refused him because of his shocking eyesight, so he worked in the stores........lucky him! He didnt have kids until his late 50's so was dead before I was even born anyway. My maternal grandad was a miner, so managed to avoid WW2. I managed to locate the records of 1 distant relative who fought in WW1. Royal Naval Division so saw action on Western Front, Galipoli etc. Was injured a few times. His records show he went AWOL for a couple of weeks while recovering, they found him in London. He also managed to pick up a venereal disease whilst in France. My hero.
It just doesn't dissappear as quickly as that I'm afraid. And I'd say that's good. WWII was an existential struggle for civilisation, and that is by no means a melodramatic statement. Had the NAZIs for instance developed an atomic bomb, which they were on the way to doing, the horrors inflicted on the Jews, would have been repeated far more widely. There is no need for rancour to exist in those of us who were born well after 1945, but for those who endured the privations and struggles of that time, it is understandable.
I'm afraid it absolutely does. While there's still people alive you fought it's at the forefront. When they go their children are the prominent generation it's significant but it can't be more than an echo, because they weren't there. And then an echo becomes an echo of an echo and so on and so on. If you wiped everyone over the age of 30 off the planet (myself included) do you think people would be talking about the war their great great granddad fought it. I doubt it and to be honest I don't even blame them. It's so far removed from them it might as well be the war if the ****ing roses.
While I agree that with every passing generation the prominence of the Second World War in the collective consciousness diminishes slightly, the global significance of the war is still with us. It redrew the world map, caused huge social changes, numerous inventions that we still use were created as part of the war effort (RADAR, the first computers, tupperware, duct tape etc), we're still using scientific research that was conducted for or during the war, it led to the creation of the UN and the WHO, and, because of its depiction on film and TV and in computer games as well as in fiction and non-fiction writing, it remains a huge cultural reference point. I don't think it will lose its significance until something else comes along to cause a similar level of global change. People won't talk about it in the same way in a couple of generation's time but it will still affect their lives. That's not to say that we should allow prejudices or animosity caused by it to continue, more that we shouldn't allow such things to lead us down a similar path.
If my local cenotaph remembrance service is anything to go by the younger generation have forgotten/ have no interest in past wars. A few very young if with parents or representing boys football club or girl guides, but no teenagers or 20+ year olds
History, like everything else, has been politicized. It's easier to call someone a Nazi when you're sure nobody actually understands what the Nazis were any more. WWII created the modern world and very little has changed since then.
Lest We Forget. Far too many lives were lost from all nations in the fight against tyranny. We should never ever forget the sacrifices made by those brave souls. My grandad was a warm loving man who sacrificed his early adult life to preserve our way of life and ensured we all enjoy the privileges we enjoy today, he won’t become an echo, I tell my kids and grandkids about him all the time, his photos are hung in every family household, he will never ever be forgotten. My son was 8 months when my grandad died but he could tell you everything about him, that’s the way it should be.
Total opposite in my hometown of Washington, there are more and more attending each year, I’ve never seen as many as last Remembrance Sunday, all ages, all nationalities, lots with kids in prams.
I wouldn't argue that it didn't change the world on a cataclysmic level and that those changes are absolutely permanent. Thay would be madness. Just that it's no longer on most people's minds as something other than that war that Tom Hanks died in.
The way people think about it has definitely changed and will continue to, I imagine. I'd imagine that for those that took part in it, the fact that some people now spend their leisure time playing computer games that recreate the D-Day landings is quite tricky to get your head around. That's a pretty major shift in attitudes towards it.
Maybe. But that is an ideal world, where everything is forgiven and forgotten. And it just isn't. Resentments really are passed down, prejudices linger and old scores never settled are held close to heart in some cases. For instance, The American Civil War ended over 150 years ago. In The South particularly, grievances are still held by people who were born maybe a hundred years after the Confederates were forced to surrender. Look at Ireland. Look at Poland. Look all over the place. It is the human condition. Imperfect, irrational at times, unpredictable. But you can't have a " year zero" where everyone starts again, as much as it seems that some of the less tolerant fanatics around these dayswould like.
There are dates throughout the calendar year that celebrate bygone dates in history, Christmas, Easter etc have been celebrated for thousands of years as are other relevant religious dates. They have never been forgotten, it’s why we have Christian, Muslim, Seik, Protestant, Jewish faiths still celebrated. Dates may have become twisted or tweaked over the years but the the birth of Jesus is still celebrated wether you believe in it or not over 2 thousand years later. Current estimates place military deaths between 21 million and 25.5 million people. By comparison, civilian deaths include 29 million to 30.5 million from military and war crimes, plus another 19 million to 28 million due to war-related famine and/or disease. We dont have the right to “ forget “ as there are still many lessons to be learned from these dark periods of our history
Funnily enough, I read recently that "Jesus' birthday" was conveniently and wrongly placed on that date to coincide with Yule, making the conversion more palatable for pagans from Scandinavia and central Europe. Agree with everything you write there mind.
That's all very interesting that stuff surrounding the birth of Christ and the synods that were convened to decide what went into the bible. For example, there's historical evidence to show he was a real person, there was a strange astronomical event (the star that the wise men followed), and there was definitely a census. None of them happened at the same time though; they just got shoved together to make a better story. Even the virgin birth has an interesting explanation- I once read that in the relevant cultures, a woman was considered a virgin until she gave birth for the first time. So the original implication was that he was her first child, rather than what we believe now.
I've read something a lot darker about the virginity thing. In paganism her counterpart was said to be Freyja. A woman who did all the things women did, tended the land, fought, loved, had sex and basically enjoyed life. Then her memory, her legacy, and the reverence for her and women who lived independently and liberally like her was all but wiped out to fit Mary in. "All chaste and innocent. As a good woman should be." To my mind it's a crime against women that is still ****ing felt on threads where it is suggested women need to do more not to get raped. I don't know how much of it is true. But it's why I called my first born Freyja.
Ah, yes. I'm vaguely aware that in some Scandinavian countries early Christian attitudes sought to equate what they saw as the positive aspects of the Goddess Freya (mothering, assistance in childbirth etc) to Mary the Mother of Jesus. They changed the names of things that were named after Freya to Mary etc. The other aspects of her weren't transposed on to Mary but some comparisons were made with Mary Magdalene. I believe, although could be wrong, that the notion of the virgin birth came very early in the development of Christianity and was intended to denote Jesus' divinity (myths of miraculous birth and impregnation by deities were fairly common in some of the cultures that would have influenced the early Christians, although not in Judaism. This rather contradicts the other thing I read about Jesus being Mary's first child) rather than the chasteness of his mother. The obsession with chastity appears to be a later development. Almost as if the slightly later Christians were focusing on the wrong bit of the story.
