Dunno where to start with that lot brb. Firstly, Cody IS there purely as a goalscorer. But he does do other stuff as said above. Funny how some people (not you brb) pick this same argument in reverse to have a pop at Keds ie Keds is there purely to score goals, but I'm not sure he is. You've cherry picked a lot in those stats to try to suggest we are worse with Cody in the team. Weird. I'm glad Alwaysright has made a few points though. Particularly we were winning (mainly due to him) v Mk when Cody went off, then we lost. I agree he doesn't have to be a nailed on certainty. When one of our other strikers (Norris, German) takes their chance and scores at a rate of 1 every 2 games then they should (and will) challenge for his starting spot. I don't see that happening any time soon. I know you were clamouring for Antonio German in particular to play. He has now had between 30 and 60 minutes in 5 games for no goals. Now, I'm not expecting him to pull up any trees just yet (especially after just 5x half games), but if he wants Cody's spot I think he needs to have got a couple of goals in that time to show he's up to it. In the same time Cody has the 2 goals and 2 or 3 pens won as well.
Well this has taken an interesting twist. Putting Cody aside for one second, (some love him, some want to see more yadda, yadda, yadda, never the twain etc) I am interested in peoples peception of players roles. SirKeefy you say that Cody is "purely a goalscorer", in the team to score goals, which is a valid point of view. So pushing that PoV to the next level, Cody should be judge on the goal he scores and nothing else and yet you point out he has won penalties in games and imply this is a good thing, however as a goal scorer should he not be judge by the fact he had the ball within the 18yard box and didn't score, a negative thing? Not trying to be pedantic but it is an interesting subject, can players been reduced to simple statistic like goals scored??
GMAD....a very good post and i love it even more when someone can quantify an argument/debate. Anyway back to my side of the coin if i may...what would i do...swap Cody for Norris...although i hear what some people have said...he's too much like Keds. However, while on the subject of Keds....i note he's topping the Star Player league...while Cody is languishing five games in outside any game of being selected as a top three player with minutes on the pitch.
BSG. I see Cody as a "scorer". By that, he is in the team for his scoring ability. And it is a numbers game. He might miss some (all strikers do, even Ronaldo, Alan Shearer, Messi). That is not a negative. I was always brought up on the adage that you have to miss some to score some. If you dont get into positions to score (or miss) then you aren't doing your job. So a player like Cody (and other 'finishers' like Dennis law, Robbie Fowler, our own Dave Shearer etc) is judged on goals. You can add penalty assists into that I reckon, because if he wasn't fouled he'd likely be scoring anyway. Bottom line to me is that Cody is and should be judged on goal output. He should also do more like covering back, tackling, etc etc. But his primary role is score. End of. At the other side of the scale you have strikers like Keds (and others like maybe Cas, Bayo, Rooney, the target man types). They are there to contribute some goals but also for the 'presence' they provide, being a focal point, assists and setting up attacks. Their game is about a whole lot more than just scoring. So come the end of the season, they might not have scored 15 or 20 goals, but they should have provided a whole lot more to the team in other ways. For Keds it is the harrying, hard work and covering back. With Bayo it was the strength, hold-up play, bringing others into the game. All strikers are different, but basically they are either target men or finishers. Cody is a finisher. The last two strikers I can think of that played both roles for us got sold for good money. Cas & SuperBob. btw - don't take my 'other player' examples to heart. Thinking off the top of my head who to include in what category. Might have them wrong in some peoples eyes.
brb - are you saying that right now you'd have Norris in our starting X1 ahead of Cody? As for the 'star player' table. Cody has yet to play a full 90 minutes. So I reckon its quite remarkable he has polled as many points as he has.
and they are very good reasons posted three years ago!...does that mean though that we should not be looking at other potential?...as i've stated all along, nothing against Cody what so ever but i refuse to believe he is the only option and the foremost selection.
I think one good reason is Cody has scored 2 goals (and 2 pen assists?) in 5 part games. Keeping up his 1in2 goal ratio. This is on the back of 17 goals last season. And 25 goals the previous season he played for us. I don't think you pick a player who has one goal for us ahead of those stats. You seem to want to get someone in the team other than Cody regardless. Maybe if Cody goes the next 5 or 6 games without a goal (AND Norris or German score a few when they come on in that period), then maybe, just maybe, I'd be looking to drop him for a spell. Until such time I reckon 99% of managers would keep their goal scorer in the side. I'm with them. It is good that we can talk of Luke Norris in terms of being a contender. But then German was bandied about as a starter after his good pre-season form. But he has really not gone on with it, in either goals or performances. As an aside, I wonder how much we'd have to pay for a player that scored 17 in Div1 last season, and started this season with a couple more early on? Try and think of the sort of names in this category and how much they'd be worth.
The problem I have with that arguement Keefy is that Cody is always in the driving seat regardless of how he plays, as you suggest if Cody goes 5 odd games without scoring he should ONLY be replaced with Noris or German if they have scored in limited subs appearances they have. Take the Crewe game as an example, Norris came on looked sharp but was never going to score as the game was already won and the team sat back not really supporting the forward, so he wasn't going to fufill your criteria
I can't believe this thread is still running! We have scored 9 league goals this season putting us joint top scorers, we have conceded 10 league goals this season putting us 2nd worse. Why are we discussing strikers?
Yeah, fully agree. Not Cody's problem that he has a record of 50 goals in 100 games for us so is the front-runner. He has the runs on the board so to speak, and is entitled to be the starter. If/when he has a dry spell, or runs out of form then those other guys need to step up and prove they can do it. I will add the rider that I think if Cody did have a 'shocker' or a couple of ordinary games, PT would probably put a rocket up his rear and maybe drop him for a game to show that we do have competition. But is Cody currently scoring? Yes. Is he out of form? No. Why change? And when you say Norris hasn't had the opportunity much, that's not exactly true. He's had about the same minutes on the pitch as Cody. So far this season each of Cody, Luke & Antonio have had 5 or 6 'part games'. Only Norris has completed a full 90mins. I think in total minutes on the pitch Cody & Luke have about 260mins and Antonio 210mins (soccerbase). So its not as if all 3 haven't had chances. It still remains that Cody has scored 2, Luke 1pen and Antonio yet to score. I don't mind sticking with the statement that Cody deserves to be starting and all the time he's scoring he stays there. IF he has a lean spell of goals and form then by all means give one of those others a go. But seeing as they aren't scoring I wouldn't jump into it. I'm still a bit confused as to why people are suggesting Cody shouldn't be starting. He is playing ok. He is scoring. And there is no-one else scoring to put him 'under the pump' (Keds apart). Norris has had a couple of decent games. German has done nothing since pre-season as far as I can see. You'd a thought we'd lost all 5, Cody had no goals and our back-ups had 4 goals each. edit> Also, I will say again, I love the fact that we can talk about Luke Norris as a contender for Cody's spot. I hope he does keep the pressure up on Cody to keep scoring to keep his starting place.
HA!! Grumpy what a great post, that should be the finishing line of this thread! I may now start a new one on my new love John Egan and how he needs support around him!
Sorry Keefy, I wasn't suggesing that Cody should be dropped currently, merely a hypethetical situation. I am happy with Cody being in the starting XI at the moment as he has earnt it PS Grumpy, I understand you point of view, but I think a debate about the defence would be quite short.. we are rubbish... yup agreed... end of discussion ;-)
Great We are agreed then. A decent encumbent player keeps his spot unless and until he drops off in form/output, or someone else becomes so good they demand inclusion. That's my view anyway. Agree with you all about the defence. Funnily, we seem to have decent players across the back line now and it is changed from last season. But we are travelling just as bad/worse, than last year! Although I think a lot of it is down to the injuries and changes that have had to be made each week. We have not had a settled side at all which doesn't help 'team defence'.
No fighting here GPL. Just good robust discussion amongst Gills fans with the best interests of GFC at heart
I agree with you there Keefy, once again the members here have shown that it is possible to have a discussion and differences of opinions without resorting to petty name calling and abuse of other members. Well done all.
IF.......we had a defence we could have a discussion about it. As we haven't...................end of.
