Off Topic CONDOLENCES AND PRAYERS for Grenfell house

any disaster big or small is a sad occasion especially when it is one the like of Grenfell house. and my/our thoughts and prayers go with the residents and families of those affected.

hopefully it will not be turned into a "points for votes" political scoring board by the opposition. "
blame = all due to cuts/austerity etc etc or any other thing that might fit.
I have a private bet that at some point in few weeks DH ( or for ROD , JC ) will somehow link it to the tories /TM and suggest they turn it in and give over to THEM

 

Amen to that

I notice how quickly Corbyn started pointing fingers.

What a sad old man. Came second in the election and now wont shut up.

 

I'm a landlord with 2 rented properties in Swindon. They are both 3 bedroomed terraced 'one family' homes and I am held to account (quite correctly) for the fire safety of those houses - including working fire alarms and gas safety (although I can't do anything about any appliances that they choose to buy and use themselves). The Swindon council crawl all over me, as a private landlord, to ensure that this is in order and there is very little grace afforded in the event of a shortfall.

There were 500 people living in that complex - with NO fire alarms and NO sprinklers. How could that be? Someone has f@@ked up big time.

The politicians will blame each other - that's just what they do - but Health and Safety was certainly lacking in this case with deadly results.Either the landlord didn't adhere to standards, in which case he should go down for it, or the Local Authority's standards were inadequate - in which case THEY should be prosecuted for this tragedy.

Without making any political point whatsoever; I suspect that a cost-cutting drive lies at the heart of this.

 

I think there was fire alarms, as a comment was that it was one thing they were going to have to look into..why they did not function as expected. The building is quite close to the westfield centre, ( sort od cribs causeway) been past that loads and there is as can be seen quite a few other similar blocks closeby, the one thing I did notice about most of the blocks in London is that the balconies are the "washing lines" and storage for all sorts of stuff! a breeze and a few balcony doors or windows would certainly help the fire to jump from floor to floor ? It was a warm breezy night!!!!

 

A tragedy of massive proportions, and like you bcfcred, I suspect there are some dodgy findings that will come out of the inevitable public inquiry. In Vancouver they have just evicted hundreds of tenants from a building owned and operated by an offshore manager who has a history of violations when it comes to safety and proper care of his tenants. The bottom line is their only concern and bypassing safety standards and refusing to fix the building issues as required is their way of improving their own lot.

Scum landlords of any nationality should have their deficient properties seized and lengthy prison terms meted out in order to show others of their ilk that the country will never accept sub-standard living spaces and any variation from the accepted norm will be heavily handled.

My thoughts are with all those affected by this disaster - stay strong.

 

I think the authorities are playing this down. It wouldn't surprise me to find the final death toll exceeds 100 and possibly a lot more than thatl

A truly horrible way to die and many remains may never be identified.

May all of those innocent victims rest in peace

 

A truly horrific tragedy, that could of been minimised by ensuring safety regulations and emergency procedures were in place. It's been well reported now that a tenants meeting it was stated that things were not working or tested.

The one thing that is not mentioned so far on this thread, is top kudos to the real hero's of this world who have possibly had one of the hardest job this past month and paid a fraction of the MP's.
Our emergency services have really done this country proud.

 

yep agree the firemen who entered, possible to modern day technologly, and saved lives, although in specialised kit it still needs the will and the mental fortitude to walk into a blazing building not knowing what to expect.
the top floors look totally gutted as does one side, stairs in these buildings tend to go up the centre, a real chimney of death if fire feeds into them....
the final toll it could be very very high!

 

When Ann and I travelled to Wembley for City's appearance a few years ago I was shocked at the conditions surrounding the high rise apartments. It almost seemed that we had entered an unwelcoming environment in some third world country, rather than the England that we had left some 40+ years ago. I can remember asking my wife if she would like to live in some of these obviously neglected buildings, and you can imagine her response, and it left me with an scary feeling of despair for those housed in those cement blocks.

I think we will hear the usual rhetoric from those with culpability in this tragedy followed by the usual comments that it must never happen again, as indeed it shouldn't, and things will just return to whatever normalcy can happen after the fact. Are there too many people spending their time looking the other way rather than doing the right thing first time out?

 

I think one of the concerns was that the building collapsed like the twin towers.
@invermeremike it was built in 72. They are all over the country, there are some by Ashton Gate (where only Fools and Horses was filmed).
They was built by councils due the ever expanding council homing demand.

 

I can only speak for what I have seen since about 2002... I have spent the last 17 years as self employed working for solicitors and design companies not only ensuring the tender got to the relevant destination, but follow up work with design changes or up dated "stuff" going to site. On a prestige council block I had to take a package needed for the grand opening the following fortnight ... it was probably the 7th or visit since the project started .. it was council, and I was shown around it was immaculate, lawns flower beds lined parking slots bushs shrubs fantastic kitchens, balconies with views over all compass points depending on flat, massive laundry room community lounge area.....
I happened to ask one of the architects he must feel proud of the achievement .. his reply was a terse NO next time you are up there take a look... I did 3 months later, been open 7 months ... balconies were storage sheds and washing was draped over, some even had a line between flats { next door on same floor ]to utilise the space... no grass just a muddy area with part assembled or dismantled cars, no bushes flower beds or shrubs, security gate into premises was gone, graffittii on front porch area and doors and walls... a fire hose reel inside the entrance was devoid of hose and hanging off wall.... and you were shocked at what they were like ....that was about 2008-2009! these flats are mainly designed with a couple bedrooms, kitchen diner ,lounge, bathroom family of 4 just about!

 

It's been a difficult few weeks for our country

However what shines through is the human spirit being shown - from people turning up to offer people lifts home in Manchester - taking on attackers in Borough Market - to fireman running into that burning building.

Heard a great quote from a MP friend of Jo Cox - went something like this - "for every moment of evil that we have seen in the last few weeks, there have been hundreds of moments of love". It brought a tear to my eye.

 

its my opinion but I do not condone the mini riot that stemmed from a demonstration yesterday at Kensington ..it was blatantly obvious there were "non attached " individuals intent upon making points gains at the expense of the poor victims and families of Grenfell house.
there was a group there who I suspect were known to the police as "activists" there message seemed to be totally political on behalf of the socialist party with scant or no regard to the sobriety of the moment.
the evening demo was afar more memory invoking one... it simply covered the tragedy and will likely be remembered more ... whist the afternoon riot will go down as that demonstration highjacked by a group of moron activists ..

 

The true scum of this world always surface when the opportunity arises and so I always look between the lines and all I see are trouble makers rather than real demonstrators trying to highlight their issues. This tragedy unfortunately will bring out the worst in people but even scarier it will bring out how many possible corners were cut, and I heard yesterday that the cost difference between the full fire proof version of the cladding used, and the cheap one installed, was about 2 pounds/sq ft.

 

Drove past the flats on Saturday evening, absolutely grim looking at it, seeing the devastation and knowing there are still 50 odd dead people in there.