Cash out options

[Ron]

I don't understand the cash outs but have a question for you experts

(a) Suppose someone had a £100 accumulator at 10/1, 3/1, 6/1,14/1

The first 3 win meaning there would be £30,800 going on the 14/1 shot (ie a potential return of
£462,000)

What cash out option would be offered?

(b) Suppose someone had a £10 accumulator at 10/1, 3/1, 6/1,14/1 and £90 treble on the first 3. The treble secures £27,720 and there would be £3080 going on the 14/1 shot (ie a potential further £46,200). What would be the cash out offer on the £10 accumulator?

Apologies if this is a stupid question but I have no idea how it works

 

[Cyclonic]

Jesus Ron, I'm flat out using a bloody ATM.

 

[Ron]

Jesus Ron, I'm flat out using a bloody ATM.

 

[King Shergar]

The bookmakers don't do anything that doesn't benefit them. The cash out feature is no different.

If say you had 4K running onto the last selection, then they'd probably offer you something like 2.5k. Basically they never offer you the true value of your bet.

So I would advise never to use the cash out feature, as it's just yet another way of bookmakers increasing their margin and making more money out of punters.

 

[Archers Road]

The bookmakers don't do anything that doesn't benefit them. The cash out feature is no different.

If say you had 4K running onto the last selection, then they'd probably offer you something like 2.5k. Basically they never offer you the true value of your bet.

So I would advise never to use the cash out feature, as it's just yet another way of bookmakers increasing their margin and making more money out of punters.

This. Never hand value back to the bookie. If you're on at 10/1 and it's looking good, why trade out for a profit, even a guaranteed profit, at 5/1? The fact the price has fallen just shows what a value bet you had in the first place, so why give it up? In the long run, you'll lose out - in theory anyway - even if your bet goes down on this occasion.

 

[Ron]

So would you be better off splitting the bet as above, to guarantee a return on the first 3 with a sporting chance of extra with the smaller accumulator?

One way of looking at it is:
Would you place £30,800 win on a 14/1 shot? I don't think I would have the nerve

 

[Archers Road]

So would you be better off splitting the bet as above, to guarantee a return on the first 3 with a sporting chance of extra with the smaller accumulator?

One way of looking at it is:
Would you place £30,800 win on a 14/1 shot? I don't think I would have the nerve

In those circumstances I'd probably consider opposing the 14/1 shot with a couple of other runners (assuming it's racing we're talking about, and depending on the make up of the race). But the general principle still applies - the bookie is looking to buy you out because he is afraid. So you shouldn't be.

 

[King Shergar]

So would you be better off splitting the bet as above, to guarantee a return on the first 3 with a sporting chance of extra with the smaller accumulator?

Yeah if you know you are going to be tempted to cash out at any stage, then do seperate bets to avoid the temptation.

I know people in my local who are daft enough to bet 3 teams on a Saturday and a 4th team on a Sunday in an acca, and they'll have bets like this every week with the full intention of cashing out if the first 3 go in. I try to explain to them how stupid the bet is, but they are so thick they can't understand what I'm trying to tell them

When they first rolled out the cash out feature in shops, they where having massive incentives on which shops could get the most punters cashing out. So bookmakers know full well how good it is for them.

 

[Archers Road]

Not forgetting, of course, that any acca is a mugs bet in the first place

 

[gazboy]

I'd love to have that option of cashing out @30k ffs £30 going on a 4th leg would be nice

 

[King Shergar]

Not forgetting, of course, that any acca is a mugs bet in the first place

Not entirely true, but I do get your point.

Some multiple betting strategies can be effective, especially bets like Lucky 15s if they are offering the bonus's. The treble the odds 1 winner with Betfred makes you very tough to beat as a punter if your a half decent judge.

In most cases though I do agree that single bets offer better value for punters.

 

[Archers Road]

Not entirely true, but I do get your point.

Some multiple betting strategies can be effective, especially bets like Lucky 15s if they are offering the bonus's. The treble the odds 1 winner with Betfred makes you very tough to beat as a punter if your a half decent judge.

In most cases though I do agree that single bets offer better value for punters.

Don't get me wrong, I love a Lucky 15, and have had some joy with the bet in the past, But when you consider that one of your four horses getting beat means 8 of your 15 bets go down, then it's impossible to justify from a purist's perspective.

3 x the price for one winner is quite attractive though, I didn't think any bookies still did that.

Something I was told years ago though by a friend in the betting industry was, "avoid any bet you see promoted in a Bookmaker's window".

 

[King Shergar]

Don't get me wrong, I love a Lucky 15, and have had some joy with the bet in the past, But when you consider that one of your four horses getting beat means 8 of your 15 bets go down, then it's impossible to justify from a purist's perspective.

3 x the price for one winner is quite attractive though, I didn't think any bookies still did that.

Something I was told years ago though by a friend in the betting industry was, "avoid any bet you see promoted in a Bookmaker's window".

You'd be suprised at the value you are getting with the treble the odds. I remember quite a few shrewd customers who's bets we had to restrict who where doing lucky 15s, as one of my shops was a treble the odds shop.

These bookmakers don't mind the small stake lucky 15s, but if you go in there trying to have large lucky 15s then all panic sets in.

 

[Ron]

I'm not a fan of L15s. As AR says, one loser and you have 8 losing bets.
I think I only ever did a 4 horse accumulator twice in my life. The first one was at the Cheltenham Festival and I got £500 back for a fiver. The only other time was when I tried my luck with another fiver the next day (it lost of course).

 

[SaveTheHumans]

I'm not a fan of L15s. As AR says, one loser and you have 8 losing bets.
I think I only ever did a 4 horse accumulator twice in my life. The first one was at the Cheltenham Festival and I got £500 back for a fiver. The only other time was when I tried my luck with another fiver the next day (it lost of course).

That doesn't make sense then Ronaldo. You made £490 for an outlay of £10 and gave up on it!

There was mileage there to keep it up.

 

[Ron]

That doesn't make sense then Ronaldo. You made £490 for an outlay of £10 and gave up on it!

There was mileage there to keep it up.

It made sense to me STH. I got very lucky with the accumulator, having to suffer a photo finish and a stewards' enquiry that seemed to last an age. In fact I made £500 from a fiver (it was 100/1 accumulator). I wasn't going to give it all back but was happy to use "the same fiver" to chance my luck once. When that had gone that was it. I'm sure I put the £500 profit to good cause. So long ago I can't remember what

These days I have difficulty picking one winner, let alone 4

 

[King Shergar]

I remember one Cheltenham about 15 years ago I had about 30 lucky 15s. I had a runner in every single race, and permed them up.

My strike rate was terrible, i only had 4 winners the whole week. Luckily they where all on the 1 slip though. You can't get anymore lucky than that

The worst Cheltenham I've ever had in terms of strike rate, yet probably the most profitable.

 

[smokethedeadbadger]

I think if you put a bet on thats a speculative punt and you end up with a decent cash out offer then it can be useful but if its a bet you've put on with confidence and thought through then you should just stick to your guns and see it out. I find with accumulators and i can only speak about paddy power because thats the only bookies i use but they never offer a decent amount until your a leg away anyway and its usually not worth bothering with.

Another way i look at it is for example if i put for arguments sake, £1 accumulator on and they offer me £50 would i take? Well if someone in street offered to buy a pound for fifty i'd sell it wouldn't i? so take it and ignore the potential return. The main thing with cashout is you have to be happy with the amount don't just settle because an offer is there. If you're happy taking £300 take it, if you get offered £100 but think to yourself i'd have liked at least £200, don't take it.

 

[Ron]

Would I be right in thinking that if you have the first 3 winners in a 4 horse accumulator, any cash out offer would be less than the amount you have going onto the 4th leg. If so what % of the amount going onto the 4th leg would be offered. Presumably the shorter the price of the 4th leg selection, the bigger % the cash out option would be?

 

[King Shergar]

Would I be right in thinking that if you have the first 3 winners in a 4 horse accumulator, any cash out offer would be less than the amount you have going onto the 4th leg. If so what % of the amount going onto the 4th leg would be offered. Presumably the shorter the price of the 4th leg selection, the bigger % the cash out option would be?

Yeah ofcourse it will be less than what you actually have running on.

I don't know how they work out what percentage they take out. It probably varys depending on the situation, and probably depending on the customer.

These bookies will know that a customer who's bets started with £1 who has 50k running onto a final selection is far more likely to cash out for a lesser amount, than say a known big player who regularly has big bets, who may also have 50k running onto a last selection.

A computer probably automatically calculates the cash out value for the small offers, but when it's a huge amount I reckon they would have traders making these decisions.