Carroll

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Chappaz

Chappaz

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Jan 26, 2011
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Well, interesting.

I was talking to a chap who I've started working with, and he used to play lower league football, so he got into the fringe crowd of some Premier League footballers. He knows Smith, Ameobi, Sammy Ameobi, Carroll, but most of all, Carroll's brother. He says that Carroll pretty much blanks him now because, and I quote "he's turned into a dickhead", but he's still in good contact with his brother.

According to him, Carroll didn't actually want to leave. He repeatedly refused, but Llambias wanted him to go and so did his agent. Eventually, his agent said "either you sign the agreement to go, or I'll do it for you". He was pushed right into a corner.

Now this makes sense to me. His agent stood to make millions out of this sale, and in the shady world of football (especially as far as NUFC's cockney mafia are concerned) it's difficult to be held accountable. What could Carroll do short of taking his club and agent to court, in which they can just deny everything?

Carroll said that he was gutted to leave, and still is, but he admitted that the extra money has been great, which has probably softened the blow.

I know Carroll is long gone, but it does make you wonder whether it's right to boo him and assume he's just been a greedy ****. You hear stories that he wanted out, but you also hear stories that he wanted to stay, but ultimately neither of them can be held in higher regard than the other. I trust what this guy said to me, and having seen other pieces of evidence (such as the apparent texts to Steve Wraith, which are either true, or he just completely made it up), I just can't be sure enough to boo the guy or wish him all sorts of bad things.
 
Chappaz said:
Well, interesting.

I was talking to a chap who I've started working with, and he used to play lower league football, so he got into the fringe crowd of some Premier League footballers. He knows Smith, Ameobi, Sammy Ameobi, Carroll, but most of all, Carroll's brother. He says that Carroll pretty much blanks him now because, and I quote "he's turned into a dickhead", but he's still in good contact with his brother.

According to him, Carroll didn't actually want to leave. He repeatedly refused, but Llambias wanted him to go and so did his agent. Eventually, his agent said "either you sign the agreement to go, or I'll do it for you". He was pushed right into a corner.

Now this makes sense to me. His agent stood to make millions out of this sale, and in the shady world of football (especially as far as NUFC's cockney mafia are concerned) it's difficult to be held accountable. What could Carroll do short of taking his club and agent to court, in which they can just deny everything?

Carroll said that he was gutted to leave, and still is, but he admitted that the extra money has been great, which has probably softened the blow.

I know Carroll is long gone, but it does make you wonder whether it's right to boo him and assume he's just been a greedy ****. You hear stories that he wanted out, but you also hear stories that he wanted to stay, but ultimately neither of them can be held in higher regard than the other. I trust what this guy said to me, and having seen other pieces of evidence (such as the apparent texts to Steve Wraith, which are either true, or he just completely made it up), I just can't be sure enough to boo the guy or wish him all sorts of bad things.
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I believe most of that tbh as I have heard that he still comes to toon home games (when not clashing obviously)!
 
Chappaz said:
Well, interesting.

I was talking to a chap who I've started working with, and he used to play lower league football, so he got into the fringe crowd of some Premier League footballers. He knows Smith, Ameobi, Sammy Ameobi, Carroll, but most of all, Carroll's brother. He says that Carroll pretty much blanks him now because, and I quote "he's turned into a dickhead", but he's still in good contact with his brother.

According to him, Carroll didn't actually want to leave. He repeatedly refused, but Llambias wanted him to go and so did his agent. Eventually, his agent said "either you sign the agreement to go, or I'll do it for you". He was pushed right into a corner.

Now this makes sense to me. His agent stood to make millions out of this sale, and in the shady world of football (especially as far as NUFC's cockney mafia are concerned) it's difficult to be held accountable. What could Carroll do short of taking his club and agent to court, in which they can just deny everything?

Carroll said that he was gutted to leave, and still is, but he admitted that the extra money has been great, which has probably softened the blow.

I know Carroll is long gone, but it does make you wonder whether it's right to boo him and assume he's just been a greedy ****. You hear stories that he wanted out, but you also hear stories that he wanted to stay, but ultimately neither of them can be held in higher regard than the other. I trust what this guy said to me, and having seen other pieces of evidence (such as the apparent texts to Steve Wraith, which are either true, or he just completely made it up), I just can't be sure enough to boo the guy or wish him all sorts of bad things.
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Nah, he wasn't pushed into any corner. If you don't want to go then you just don't go; if you're actually going to be 'gutted' about doing something you completely do not have to do, then you don't do it. It's pretty simple. There was no corner he was being pushed into at all, he had a contract keeping him with us for years.
 
If a player has a contract at a club he absolutely cannot be forced out short of doing an Adrian Mutu and getting fired. The likelihood is that he didn't want to go but his agent convinced him that it was worth it for the money and better for his career progression.
 
Smudger said:
That's still looks very dodgy to me, your agent cant sign the contract for you.
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Can you really be so sure? Can any of us be so sure as to what goes on behind those closed doors with people like Ashley, Llambias and dodgy as **** agents? Honestly, nothing would surprise me.

skalpel said:
Nah, he wasn't pushed into any corner. If you don't want to go then you just don't go; if you're actually going to be 'gutted' about doing something you completely do not have to do, then you don't do it. It's pretty simple. There was no corner he was being pushed into at all, he had a contract keeping him with us for years.
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Let's look at this from the perspective of Carroll. He was a 22 year old young lad, and on deadline day (with only hours remaining) he was in a room with Llambias, Ashley and his agent, who was set to make MILLIONS if the deal went through. I wouldn't be surprised if the whole thing was not only manipulative, but borderline threatening. Llambias didn't want him, and the agent said either sign the deal or I'll do it as your representative.

So no, it isn't as simple as that. Nothing is ever as simple as that in real life and you know it. There are a number of things both Llambias and his agent could say to the young lad (completely off the record) which would force his hand. He's just a young footballer who had never been a part of a football transfer in his life - he's not an agent.

Smudger said:
I keep saying this, if it's so easy to force a player out then why is Alan Smith still at the club?
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Because nobody wants the guy. If someone comes in with a massive offer of far more than he's worth, then we'll see.
 
How would the agent do the deal for him? Would there be a photo on Liverpool's website of some bloke in a suit holding a picture of Carroll? Forges Carroll's signature on the contract? Does the medical for him? If Carroll was stupid enough to fall for such underhand and ridiculous threats from an agent who clearly didnt give a **** about him then I have no sympathy.
 
Chappaz said:
Let's look at this from the perspective of Carroll. He was a 22 year old young lad, and on deadline day (with only hours remaining) he was in a room with Llambias, Ashley and his agent, who was set to make MILLIONS if the deal went through. I wouldn't be surprised if the whole thing was not only manipulative, but borderline threatening. Llambias didn't want him, and the agent said either sign the deal or I'll do it as your representative.

So no, it isn't as simple as that. Nothing is ever as simple as that in real life and you know it. There are a number of things both Llambias and his agent could say to the young lad (completely off the record) which would force his hand. He's just a young footballer who had never been a part of a football transfer in his life - he's not an agent.
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What sort of things? Threats? Some things are simple. I work with contracts daily, and if somebody tried telling me that I had to sign one that I completely did not want to sign, a contract I would be 'gutted' about if I did sign, and had no reason to sign it whatsoever; there is nothing they could say other than threaten me with something that could do it. 22 year old young lad maybe, but that doesn't mean he has the brain of a 3 year old.
We already know that he wasn't gutted about the move at all because he was seen via fly on the wall coverage on Liverpool TV arriving and wandering round the place practically hopping with excitement, he was unmistakably happy.
 
Does not really seem like he was gutted about leaving.

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Also, if Carroll did want to leave he would want to look good on both sides, what's to stop him just telling his friends he didnt want to leave to try to save face with supporters, which is exactly what Barton did (admittedly he was far more public and clever with his PR).
 
Didn't we reject an initial offer of £30m from Liverpool? I still think that if Ashley and Llambias wanted Carroll to go they would have accepted that bid straight away.
 
Tomski said:
Didn't we reject an initial offer of £30m from Liverpool? I still think that if Ashley and Llambias wanted Carroll to go they would have accepted that bid straight away.
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We did. Before that we rejected £20m from Tottenham and that was the only bid we expected that month, if they were so desperate for the money would they not have accepted that bid?
 
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