Brian Lenihan interview

[Plum]

It is difficult for men especially to find the words . How many times we say how's it going mate, you ok? And we expect one answer back , yeah not bad .. I asked my boss the other day , and when I said you alright,? , he said no . It was the first time in 30 odd years and the 20,000 time I have said the words you alright and somebody said no , it completely threw me , I wasn't prepared for that conversation to to go any further . In the end I tried talking to him as I know he's having marital problems , but he shut it down and said it was private . I have tried a few more times and he doesn't want to talk , but my point is, we ask the question are you alright , but for how many of us do we really care? Or is it just something to say , maybe we should actually mean it when we ask , because I know I do for people now

I don't think it's that we don't care but we don't know how to respond. People train a long time to learn how to handle these sort of conversations, it's not an easy thing to do.
Family and friends are often not the best people to deal with these situations. With the best will in the world they will often say the wrong thing or the thing they think the 'sufferer' wants to hear.

 

[Melbournetiger]

I have a lot of respect for the man to be able to seek help and to give up a career many dream of for the sake of his health. I hope he has a happy future.

It doesn’t surprise me that people didn’t notice. I managed to spend an afternoon at work in an open plan office 4 feet away from a colleague with tears running down my face on Friday. Nobody had a clue (or at least didn’t make it known they’d noticed). I also punched myself in the jaw hard enough to give myself a headache (that was out of sight of people though, I’d be worried if that wasn’t noticed at my desk!).

At times fairly recently I’ve thought that maybe the best thing I can give my wife is my life insurance pay out.

I’ve had dark thoughts. Days under a mental storm cloud. Mainly because of work. I think I’m probably autistic. My brain doesn’t work like most people’s. At times I love that and it helps me understand things much quicker than others, other times I ****ing hate my brain. Usually it’s the latter. My brain is a dick and I wish it would stop been ****. It causes me to have pretty bad social anxiety. I can’t handle being around people. I’ve worked in the same place for five years and haven’t had a proper conversation yet. Most days see me speak only a few words and all of them are about work. I’m **** scared of the phone. I recently got a fitbit, after taking a phone call my heart rate had risen 40%. So working in an office is probably the worst thing I could do, but it’s apparently all I can do. I was almost happy being a postman when I was at uni. They won’t take me back though, probably because I have a degree and they assume I wouldn’t stay there. So my days are spent stressed, scared and full of dark thoughts at work. My evenings are spent coming down from that. My weekends are spent dreading Monday. I’ve been waiting 6 months for an appointment for an adult autism diagnosis. I may not bother though because what’s the point really? Yes it my make me feel slightly better. That I’m not just a weird freak, that I have an actual thing that makes me different. What would it change though. I thought that maybe once I have a diagnosis I could take it to work (in reality get my wife to!) and say I have this so can we adjust my work to help me cope. I even made a list of the things I can’t do that I’d need help with. Then I realised the list was basically my job description. If anybody knows of any jobs that require no interaction with people please let me know!

I have a decent job, in a decent place for decent money. I shouldn’t complain, but I really can’t handle it and it scares me that one day it may be the death of me.


I am so lucky that I found my wife. Nobody has ever got me like she does. She is the only person I have ever instantly been able to talk to. Without her I have almost no doubt I wouldn’t be here to write this.

I don’t really know why I wrote this. I should probably get back to work.

I do admire your courage in writing this, in a way you have taken the first step.
If you want to pm feel free to, even though I now live in Melbourne i still have contacts ,and a good mate is a psychotherapist,who sees people privately or he would be able to advice re options available.
Take care

 

[Sir Cheshire Ben]

I have a lot of respect for the man to be able to seek help and to give up a career many dream of for the sake of his health. I hope he has a happy future.

It doesn’t surprise me that people didn’t notice. I managed to spend an afternoon at work in an open plan office 4 feet away from a colleague with tears running down my face on Friday. Nobody had a clue (or at least didn’t make it known they’d noticed). I also punched myself in the jaw hard enough to give myself a headache (that was out of sight of people though, I’d be worried if that wasn’t noticed at my desk!).

At times fairly recently I’ve thought that maybe the best thing I can give my wife is my life insurance pay out.

I’ve had dark thoughts. Days under a mental storm cloud. Mainly because of work. I think I’m probably autistic. My brain doesn’t work like most people’s. At times I love that and it helps me understand things much quicker than others, other times I ****ing hate my brain. Usually it’s the latter. My brain is a dick and I wish it would stop been ****. It causes me to have pretty bad social anxiety. I can’t handle being around people. I’ve worked in the same place for five years and haven’t had a proper conversation yet. Most days see me speak only a few words and all of them are about work. I’m **** scared of the phone. I recently got a fitbit, after taking a phone call my heart rate had risen 40%. So working in an office is probably the worst thing I could do, but it’s apparently all I can do. I was almost happy being a postman when I was at uni. They won’t take me back though, probably because I have a degree and they assume I wouldn’t stay there. So my days are spent stressed, scared and full of dark thoughts at work. My evenings are spent coming down from that. My weekends are spent dreading Monday. I’ve been waiting 6 months for an appointment for an adult autism diagnosis. I may not bother though because what’s the point really? Yes it my make me feel slightly better. That I’m not just a weird freak, that I have an actual thing that makes me different. What would it change though. I thought that maybe once I have a diagnosis I could take it to work (in reality get my wife to!) and say I have this so can we adjust my work to help me cope. I even made a list of the things I can’t do that I’d need help with. Then I realised the list was basically my job description. If anybody knows of any jobs that require no interaction with people please let me know!

I have a decent job, in a decent place for decent money. I shouldn’t complain, but I really can’t handle it and it scares me that one day it may be the death of me.


I am so lucky that I found my wife. Nobody has ever got me like she does. She is the only person I have ever instantly been able to talk to. Without her I have almost no doubt I wouldn’t be here to write this.

I don’t really know why I wrote this. I should probably get back to work.

I hope you get sorted. There’s many lads & ladettes on here who have experience either first hand or with those close to them that have suffered with similar issues to those you describe.

I believe the majority on here are also genuine in their offers of advice, direction & help. Don’t suffer alone, reach out to someone & make the move, if you feel you can. The alternative is far too horrible to imagine. Add my name to those who already have if you feel like you’d like to talk & lighten the load you’re carrying.

We’re one big family on here, spend half the time calling each other ****s & trying to beat each other to the “Uncle Knobhead” of the year award but there’s also a genuine network of support. It really is an uncanny place for what is ultimately strangers on the web.

If you feel like you can’t open up to people on here maybe give these, or other support networks a try.

https://www.heymind.org.uk/how-we-can-help/group-support/blokesunited/

Genuinely hope you get yourself diagnosed & on the road to getting & staying well.

 

[robcentral]

I have a lot of respect for the man to be able to seek help and to give up a career many dream of for the sake of his health. I hope he has a happy future.

It doesn’t surprise me that people didn’t notice. I managed to spend an afternoon at work in an open plan office 4 feet away from a colleague with tears running down my face on Friday. Nobody had a clue (or at least didn’t make it known they’d noticed). I also punched myself in the jaw hard enough to give myself a headache (that was out of sight of people though, I’d be worried if that wasn’t noticed at my desk!).

At times fairly recently I’ve thought that maybe the best thing I can give my wife is my life insurance pay out.

I’ve had dark thoughts. Days under a mental storm cloud. Mainly because of work. I think I’m probably autistic. My brain doesn’t work like most people’s. At times I love that and it helps me understand things much quicker than others, other times I ****ing hate my brain. Usually it’s the latter. My brain is a dick and I wish it would stop been ****. It causes me to have pretty bad social anxiety. I can’t handle being around people. I’ve worked in the same place for five years and haven’t had a proper conversation yet. Most days see me speak only a few words and all of them are about work. I’m **** scared of the phone. I recently got a fitbit, after taking a phone call my heart rate had risen 40%. So working in an office is probably the worst thing I could do, but it’s apparently all I can do. I was almost happy being a postman when I was at uni. They won’t take me back though, probably because I have a degree and they assume I wouldn’t stay there. So my days are spent stressed, scared and full of dark thoughts at work. My evenings are spent coming down from that. My weekends are spent dreading Monday. I’ve been waiting 6 months for an appointment for an adult autism diagnosis. I may not bother though because what’s the point really? Yes it my make me feel slightly better. That I’m not just a weird freak, that I have an actual thing that makes me different. What would it change though. I thought that maybe once I have a diagnosis I could take it to work (in reality get my wife to!) and say I have this so can we adjust my work to help me cope. I even made a list of the things I can’t do that I’d need help with. Then I realised the list was basically my job description. If anybody knows of any jobs that require no interaction with people please let me know!

I have a decent job, in a decent place for decent money. I shouldn’t complain, but I really can’t handle it and it scares me that one day it may be the death of me.


I am so lucky that I found my wife. Nobody has ever got me like she does. She is the only person I have ever instantly been able to talk to. Without her I have almost no doubt I wouldn’t be here to write this.

I don’t really know why I wrote this. I should probably get back to work.

I know people keep things bottled up in the hope it will just go away! I am one and could never open up like you have,
I have been on anti depressants for almost 2 years and no one knows, I don't know how I have managed to keep this to myself for this long and wish I could talk to someone properly about it!!

 

[Howden Tigress]

I hope you get sorted. There’s many lads & ladettes on here who have experience either first hand or with those close to them that have suffered with similar issues to those you describe.

I believe the majority on here are also genuine in their offers of advice, direction & help. Don’t suffer alone, reach out to someone & make the move, if you feel you can. The alternative is far too horrible to imagine. Add my name to those who already have if you feel like you’d like to talk & lighten the load you’re carrying.

We’re one big family on here, spend half the time calling each other ****s & trying to beat each other to the “Uncle Knobhead” of the year award but there’s also a genuine network of support. It really is an uncanny place for what is ultimately strangers on the web.

If you feel like you can’t open up to people on here maybe give these, or other support networks a try.

https://www.heymind.org.uk/how-we-can-help/group-support/blokesunited/

Genuinely hope you get yourself diagnosed & on the road to getting & staying well.

Top post, SCB, well said that man.
I feel humbled by TreeHugger's brave, honest post, having the courage to speak out, and supportive replies. Fair play for sharing.

Once again, despite the squabbles and crap that kicks off at times, this thread has seen human nature at its best. People do give a ****.

 

[Ullofaman]

This is the audio link of Brian Lenihan's interview.....unfortunately it seems like he remains in a very fragile state and has become a recluse. Skip to 4 minutes in from the beginning to proper start of the interview. At times I think he is trying to convince himself that he is feeling better than he probably is. Family & friend support are his bedrock. Really hope he can get something decent out of this but at times his descriptions of what has happened and how it just creeps up silently and takes control of you is chillingly frightening.
https://www.secondcaptains.com/2018/10/02/episode-1281-the-players-chair-with-brian-lenihan/

 

[dennisboothstash]

I have a lot of respect for the man to be able to seek help and to give up a career many dream of for the sake of his health. I hope he has a happy future.

It doesn’t surprise me that people didn’t notice. I managed to spend an afternoon at work in an open plan office 4 feet away from a colleague with tears running down my face on Friday. Nobody had a clue (or at least didn’t make it known they’d noticed). I also punched myself in the jaw hard enough to give myself a headache (that was out of sight of people though, I’d be worried if that wasn’t noticed at my desk!).

At times fairly recently I’ve thought that maybe the best thing I can give my wife is my life insurance pay out.

I’ve had dark thoughts. Days under a mental storm cloud. Mainly because of work. I think I’m probably autistic. My brain doesn’t work like most people’s. At times I love that and it helps me understand things much quicker than others, other times I ****ing hate my brain. Usually it’s the latter. My brain is a dick and I wish it would stop been ****. It causes me to have pretty bad social anxiety. I can’t handle being around people. I’ve worked in the same place for five years and haven’t had a proper conversation yet. Most days see me speak only a few words and all of them are about work. I’m **** scared of the phone. I recently got a fitbit, after taking a phone call my heart rate had risen 40%. So working in an office is probably the worst thing I could do, but it’s apparently all I can do. I was almost happy being a postman when I was at uni. They won’t take me back though, probably because I have a degree and they assume I wouldn’t stay there. So my days are spent stressed, scared and full of dark thoughts at work. My evenings are spent coming down from that. My weekends are spent dreading Monday. I’ve been waiting 6 months for an appointment for an adult autism diagnosis. I may not bother though because what’s the point really? Yes it my make me feel slightly better. That I’m not just a weird freak, that I have an actual thing that makes me different. What would it change though. I thought that maybe once I have a diagnosis I could take it to work (in reality get my wife to!) and say I have this so can we adjust my work to help me cope. I even made a list of the things I can’t do that I’d need help with. Then I realised the list was basically my job description. If anybody knows of any jobs that require no interaction with people please let me know!

I have a decent job, in a decent place for decent money. I shouldn’t complain, but I really can’t handle it and it scares me that one day it may be the death of me.


I am so lucky that I found my wife. Nobody has ever got me like she does. She is the only person I have ever instantly been able to talk to. Without her I have almost no doubt I wouldn’t be here to write this.

I don’t really know why I wrote this. I should probably get back to work.

You’ve taken a big step sharing this, and I’m glad you have
Hopefully it will have helped you in some small way, and it has already definitely helped some people decide to share problems themselves and others to consider how their behaviour unwittingly affects others.
As others have said I’m more than happy to get a PM from anyone on here who wants a chat, or to just unload the days feelings on an anonymous person.
I do hope you get the help you need, including the adjustments needed for your work (you might be surprised what can be done and still allow you work to your job description)
Take care...and shout out whenever you need to and to whoever you want to .

 

[DMD]

I have a lot of respect for the man to be able to seek help and to give up a career many dream of for the sake of his health. I hope he has a happy future.

It doesn’t surprise me that people didn’t notice. I managed to spend an afternoon at work in an open plan office 4 feet away from a colleague with tears running down my face on Friday. Nobody had a clue (or at least didn’t make it known they’d noticed). I also punched myself in the jaw hard enough to give myself a headache (that was out of sight of people though, I’d be worried if that wasn’t noticed at my desk!).

At times fairly recently I’ve thought that maybe the best thing I can give my wife is my life insurance pay out.

I’ve had dark thoughts. Days under a mental storm cloud. Mainly because of work. I think I’m probably autistic. My brain doesn’t work like most people’s. At times I love that and it helps me understand things much quicker than others, other times I ****ing hate my brain. Usually it’s the latter. My brain is a dick and I wish it would stop been ****. It causes me to have pretty bad social anxiety. I can’t handle being around people. I’ve worked in the same place for five years and haven’t had a proper conversation yet. Most days see me speak only a few words and all of them are about work. I’m **** scared of the phone. I recently got a fitbit, after taking a phone call my heart rate had risen 40%. So working in an office is probably the worst thing I could do, but it’s apparently all I can do. I was almost happy being a postman when I was at uni. They won’t take me back though, probably because I have a degree and they assume I wouldn’t stay there. So my days are spent stressed, scared and full of dark thoughts at work. My evenings are spent coming down from that. My weekends are spent dreading Monday. I’ve been waiting 6 months for an appointment for an adult autism diagnosis. I may not bother though because what’s the point really? Yes it my make me feel slightly better. That I’m not just a weird freak, that I have an actual thing that makes me different. What would it change though. I thought that maybe once I have a diagnosis I could take it to work (in reality get my wife to!) and say I have this so can we adjust my work to help me cope. I even made a list of the things I can’t do that I’d need help with. Then I realised the list was basically my job description. If anybody knows of any jobs that require no interaction with people please let me know!

I have a decent job, in a decent place for decent money. I shouldn’t complain, but I really can’t handle it and it scares me that one day it may be the death of me.


I am so lucky that I found my wife. Nobody has ever got me like she does. She is the only person I have ever instantly been able to talk to. Without her I have almost no doubt I wouldn’t be here to write this.

I don’t really know why I wrote this. I should probably get back to work.

I think most people have already said what I'm about to post, but first off, credit and respect to you for posting about what you're going through. I don't know if it's true, but it sounds right when they say you can't solve an issue if you deny having it, so you're already some steps on the way. It sounds like you've the support of a good lady too.

They (whoever they are) also say that talking about it helps, sometimes if only to let you see that others may feel the same way about some of the things too.

Keep talking, and ask for help if and when you need it. You won't always get it, and you may not like some of the help you do get, but you're not alone, no matter how much it feels like it at times.

 

[dennisboothstash]

I know people keep things bottled up in the hope it will just go away! I am one and could never open up like you have,
I have been on anti depressants for almost 2 years and no one knows, I don't know how I have managed to keep this to myself for this long and wish I could talk to someone properly about it!!

I think you might have just started talking properly about it, and well done for that
As many others I’m more than happy to get a PM if you want to unload to someone anonymously, and more than happy to discuss things on an open thread if you’d rather
There will be literally no one on here that hasn’t been affected by mental health issues in some way, either themselves, family or friends
Keep talking, it’s good to talk

 

[DMD]

I know people keep things bottled up in the hope it will just go away! I am one and could never open up like you have,
I have been on anti depressants for almost 2 years and no one knows, I don't know how I have managed to keep this to myself for this long and wish I could talk to someone properly about it!!

Rob, what Dennis says is good advice. Have a read through the replies on here, as they seem to apply to you too. You don't have to suffer alone or in silence.

 

[look_back_in_amber]

That’s a courageous post treehugger, if you ever need it you’ll always have my ear.

I’m a self confessed gobshite at work but quite the opposite in social situations, we all have our own natural baselines, those are mine. My three adults kids are all different with their own baselines, I work with such a variation of personalities, different baselines, but always, always take the time to have a chat with one young fella in accounts who is quite obviously very introverted, he normally just sits at his desk with his head down working, I don’t think I’ve once seen him converse with anyone at work, it doesn’t make him any less of a person to me, it just means that his baseline is different, his personality is different, to those of others around him, and because of the personality that he is I will always go out of my way to have a chat.

As I said I’m here if you need me.

 

[Timatkirkwall]

Really pleased you could share that Treehugger, it must have been hard to write. The most important step often with mental health problems is usually the admission that there is a problem. Only then can you make the changes needed to make your life a positive place again. It sounds as though you are doing the right things. I have some experience in this area and have found that the diagnosis of Autistic Spectrum Disorder (ASD) in an adult can be very useful, but incredibly slow to get. Whilst there is no specific treatment (CBT doesn’t tend to help much in this case) you can be helped to understand why you feel the way you do and how your brain works. This means that you and those around you can adapt to this and make your life so much more comfortable. Whilst people with ASD struggle with interpersonal relationships and changing environments they can be brilliant (far better than those without it) at other things like working with fine details, complicated protocols and repetitive routines. This can make you invaluable in the workplace. Even if you do not get the full diagnosis of ASD it will be useful to discuss your difficulties with a sympathetic line manager who should help adapt your work to make you feel comfortable and get the best from you. It sounds as though you have support from a wonderful wife and have much to give, indeed your post has made a number of people think about their colleagues. Stick in there and in time things will get better for you. Best of luck!

 

[over18and legal]

Thanks for sharing with us Treehugger.
I can relate to your words by what my daughter has and is going through over the last 7 years.
She has just started a animal course at college and after 4 lessons given it up cause she can't cope.
She gave a good job (she hated it though) to do the course.
She struggles to be a people person and is very cutting when talking to me. It kills me it really does.

Anyway, cut to the chase, i would love it if a few on here would like to meet up over a beer and just chat. This would be the cheapest therapy (I'm not poo-pooing real therapy).
Best wishes to all.

 

[askewshair]

I admire the size of your balls Treehugger, I hope the positive responses do encourage you to open up to others if able. Again add me to the list who would be happy to receive a pm.
Have you tried Mindfulness? I've described on this forum an issue I experienced a couple of years ago. I couldn't switch off from work, so would wake up in the middle of the night. Insomnia (and probably drinking too much as it was the only way I could actually switch off and get a good nights sleep) just raised anxiety levels. I had 5 or 6 weeks off work. They suggested a Mindfulness course. I was cynical but thought I ought to show willing. Actually I would advise it to anyone now. I find it helps unscramble the brain and reminds me to just slow down. When I can't get work out of my head, it teaches to actually acknowledge the thoughts while at the sme time just steering away. I am much more able to manage work.

Posts around mental health do seem a regular feature on this forum. Great that posters feel comfortable posting these. Someone suggested having a sticky around mental health. Admins what are your thoughts?

 

[FILEYseadog]

I hope things improve for you Mr Tree Hugger..

Think you need to have some help and support ( which is obvious ) I am so ignorant of medical stuff so no idea what would help you...Though I am sure others on here will have some advice that I hope will help..
I wish you lots of good times ahead and what I do know is sometimes when you think things wont improve the do big style.

All the best .

 

[Kempton]

I have a lot of respect for the man to be able to seek help and to give up a career many dream of for the sake of his health. I hope he has a happy future.

It doesn’t surprise me that people didn’t notice. I managed to spend an afternoon at work in an open plan office 4 feet away from a colleague with tears running down my face on Friday. Nobody had a clue (or at least didn’t make it known they’d noticed). I also punched myself in the jaw hard enough to give myself a headache (that was out of sight of people though, I’d be worried if that wasn’t noticed at my desk!).

At times fairly recently I’ve thought that maybe the best thing I can give my wife is my life insurance pay out.

I’ve had dark thoughts. Days under a mental storm cloud. Mainly because of work. I think I’m probably autistic. My brain doesn’t work like most people’s. At times I love that and it helps me understand things much quicker than others, other times I ****ing hate my brain. Usually it’s the latter. My brain is a dick and I wish it would stop been ****. It causes me to have pretty bad social anxiety. I can’t handle being around people. I’ve worked in the same place for five years and haven’t had a proper conversation yet. Most days see me speak only a few words and all of them are about work. I’m **** scared of the phone. I recently got a fitbit, after taking a phone call my heart rate had risen 40%. So working in an office is probably the worst thing I could do, but it’s apparently all I can do. I was almost happy being a postman when I was at uni. They won’t take me back though, probably because I have a degree and they assume I wouldn’t stay there. So my days are spent stressed, scared and full of dark thoughts at work. My evenings are spent coming down from that. My weekends are spent dreading Monday. I’ve been waiting 6 months for an appointment for an adult autism diagnosis. I may not bother though because what’s the point really? Yes it my make me feel slightly better. That I’m not just a weird freak, that I have an actual thing that makes me different. What would it change though. I thought that maybe once I have a diagnosis I could take it to work (in reality get my wife to!) and say I have this so can we adjust my work to help me cope. I even made a list of the things I can’t do that I’d need help with. Then I realised the list was basically my job description. If anybody knows of any jobs that require no interaction with people please let me know!

I have a decent job, in a decent place for decent money. I shouldn’t complain, but I really can’t handle it and it scares me that one day it may be the death of me.


I am so lucky that I found my wife. Nobody has ever got me like she does. She is the only person I have ever instantly been able to talk to. Without her I have almost no doubt I wouldn’t be here to write this.

I don’t really know why I wrote this. I should probably get back to work.

I understand a lot of what you said here mate. I've had panic disorder for years now. In the early days l actually thought I was going insane and took four weeks off work.

My GP prescribed an anti depressant, but that didn't help in slightest. I was lucky that my employers and importantly my work colleagues were very understanding, because I was worried I might be seen as seen as some sort of weirdo.

I thought I might become agoraphobic and I just couldn't let my life go that way.

I went back to work and just stood there shaking for the first hour, my stomach in knots and my heart pounding, but I stuck at it because I just love my friends and family, really.

I still have the anxiety to this day, but that's ok, them demons can get to ****. I'll take them on, one by one, the ****s them.

I ****ing love life.

This board is ****ing brilliant and that's because of people like you.

Up the Tigers

 

[TreeHugger]

Thank you to everybody who has offered support and advise. It really does mean a lot.

We should have a pinned thread where anybody can go at any time with their problems. As much as there are arguments constantly on here, it does seem that most will be supportive to their fellow City fans/humans when they need it.

Thank you everyone, i'm not often keen on people but you all seem like a bloody good bunch.

 

[Asterix]

Thank you to everybody who has offered support and advise. It really does mean a lot.

We should have a pinned thread where anybody can go at any time with their problems. As much as there are arguments constantly on here, it does seem that most will be supportive to their fellow City fans/humans when they need it.

Thank you everyone, i'm not often keen on people but you all seem like a bloody good bunch.

But we are not people. We are usernames typing our words. Like you though, I agree the written answers to your written post, have been given by a bloody good bunch.

Trust that such people are there in the real world. I wish you well in that quest.

 

[over18and legal]

You lot are great

 

[askewshair]

We should have a pinned thread where anybody can go at any time with their problems. As much as there are arguments constantly on here, it does seem that most will be supportive to their fellow City fans/humans when they need it.
.

I do think this is a brilliant idea. It's clear that members (including myself) have felt able to post things about their mental health on this forum which they wouldn't feel so comfortable sharing elsewhere.
To disclose this sort of stuff requires trust that you will be taken seriously. To quote treehugger, 'we are a pretty good bunch'
Admin, we need to do this.