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Bielsa V Marsch

Discussion in 'Leeds United' started by Doc, May 8, 2022.

  1. Doc

    Doc Well-Known Member

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    Its now becoming obvious that our first team are not good enough for Premier League football. Bielsa made a bunch of journeymen into Championship world beaters. He then took the Prem by storm with these same players and added some International quality.

    its fair to say the International quality hasn't really delivered enough and we still haven't had our moneys worth from any signing except Raphinha.

    This season has be been a nightmare with injuries, illness, covid and then repeat injuries. Lack of investment an autistic genius as head coach, a board who refused to challenge the coach on squad size and players offered to him. The whole season has now imploded and the new guy has still to prove himself.

    Marsch took over at a crucial time, was unlucky not to take a win against Leicester in his first match and ended up with no points. He then took a battering against Villa and we were hid behind the settee. He then seemed to get through to the players and picked up 11 points and looked like he had turned the club around and got us well on the way to safety. However we saw Burnley rise from the ashes and Everton and Fat Fwank spawn results against poor Man Utd and Poor Chelsea teams and today they beat a poor Leicester. We drop into the bottom 3 for the first time, but today highlighted much.

    We were poor in the first half, very poor and nobody in our team looked to be Prem quality and indeed nobody looked interested. Marsch has mismanaged Joffy so gives him a go but is taken off because of a poor Ayling tackle. First half written off. Second half mu h better but by the looks of team selection, substitutions we look clueless.
     
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  2. Eireleeds1

    Eireleeds1 Well-Known Member

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    Pretty good summary I’d say of the whole fiasco of a season. To be honest I can handle relegation if that clown orta is gone but if he’s still pulling the strings with his hair brained signings when he does make one, I’m afraid for our prospects next season too whichever level we’re playing at
     
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  3. Doc

    Doc Well-Known Member

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    On the face of it Bielsa is a football club owners dream. Refuses players offered, demands a small squad and that means the football club save a fortune in wages and a fortune in the transfer market. It means the club directors have an out if things go wrong because they can blame the coach. However its the job of a company director to do his fiddicuary best for the company, and Im afraid the Leeds board took the money saving option and refused to order the coach to take players

    New coach scouted because they knew Bielsa was going home. The chosen one was picked because he played fast pressing football that would suit Bielsa’s players. Its now blatantly obvious that the quality of most of the Leeds squad is t good enough to play the football JM demands, or his demands are not communicated well enough for the players to understand.

    There will be a massive inquest when this season is over but for me irrespective of how good Jesse Marsch is or isnt, he isnt a patch on Bielsa because the football played is garbage mostly, the passing garbage mostly, everything is wrong except at the odd time when the players decide to fight back and try and show they care.
     
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  4. Doc

    Doc Well-Known Member

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    Think the 49ers will demand changes, maybe even insisting on taking over?
     
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  5. Doc

    Doc Well-Known Member

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    Oh and by the way the 23s were relegated today because Chelsea fielded first team squad players to make sure they won and didnt get relegated. We were relegated because our first team squad was paper thin and had all our better kids sat on the first team bench. Well done Leeds Utd possibly screwing up so badly that you managed to get your first team and reserves relegated in the same season
     
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  6. Eireleeds1

    Eireleeds1 Well-Known Member

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    As an investment group hopefully they will grasp that this squad May need a radical rebuild and they’ll have to come up with that investment. Their contributions to date don’t seem to have inspired much change. I had hoped a few weeks back that a couple of additions would suffice buts it’s far more serious than that
     
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  7. Gessa

    Gessa Well-Known Member

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    Bielsa/Marsch v Orta/Kinnear
     
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  8. Doc

    Doc Well-Known Member

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    The problem is that the cash needed to even be able to compete in the top 10 is huge. Everton are going to get a points deduction as they are way way over the top of what you can spend. They have a new stadium that may not happen just because they have a Putin mate called Usmanov who has had all his cash frozen and his yachts impounded and now the new stadium is in limbo. They have spent cash they dont have and if they get away with not been relegated they will have done it illegally, just like Frank did at Derby and look what happened to them. Not fair that cheats win, they should have had a points deduction this season but wont.

    spending £30m on one player is nothing and if you want to impact this division you need a striker in the £40m-£50m bracket, a couple of top midfielders in the £30m bracket a top CB and a couple of full backs in the £20m bracket. We spent less than £30m on Rodrigo, we spent £25m on a winger we didnt need, nothing in midfield, nothing up front and cash on CB and a full back who have struggled. When we had a squad who were mainly fit we were were able to play good football without injuries/ill players last season but this season too many injuries too many players out of position, too many kids drafted in and in fact a season I wish I had been in a coma for.

    investment required, big big investment or a top top coach required otherwise forget it we are Stoke or Sheff Utd Norwich Swansea Huddersfield WBA. If you dont believe me look at Newcastle who spent £100m in January and from odds on favs for relegation now super safe and will invest big in the summer to get them to compete near the top. WHU spent fairly big and had a great time playing in Europe.

    For me Bielsa was the difference and hid the huge faults in this club. Wakey, Norway and more slag Bielsa and can get damp about Marsch but now obvious Marsch is not able to rescue this lot or improve them. Plus how the hell can any team play a whole season really with no striker who is an England player, no captain, no England DM and backfill with kids
     
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    Last edited: May 8, 2022
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  9. Emu

    Emu Firpo is Shit

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    It doesn't matter who is the coach this season.

    The players have been terrible.

    We wouldn't have got out of the Championship with the performances that they have put in. Same mistakes every game.
     
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  10. Eireleeds1

    Eireleeds1 Well-Known Member

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    Had we added two quality signing each January and the same in the summer in positions we needed them, we could already be comfortably with the likes of Wolves. But no, the usual excuse was rolled out for inactivity. We won’t sign someone unless they are better than what we have. How the hell could they not find anyone to improve this squad in the last 18 months. I don’t know who’s that down to but suspect a combination of the owner who has no football knowledge, hopeless orta and a stubborn coach who underestimated what was required in the worlds strongest league. Still think we can survive but the current business model must be torn up in the summer
     
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  11. Gessa

    Gessa Well-Known Member

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    Marsch has got to be given a season imo, he was left with a squad low on confidence, many showing they're not up to the rigours of PL football. He should be given a chance to get his own players in, that he knows will suit his style of play
     
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  12. Eireleeds1

    Eireleeds1 Well-Known Member

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    Of course he should. That’s common sense. A good example from Scotland, the new Celtic manager made some signings from countries he’s managed in. Couple of great Japanese signings only he would have known about. Marsch could be the same. Maybe he might know if a few gems at decent money
     
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  13. Emu

    Emu Firpo is Shit

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    I questioned the club in January. They gambled. At the moment they are losing that gamble.

    5 million on Kieffer Moore (target man up top) and 6 million on John Swift (playmaker midfield player) would have given the team far more structure.

    Instead, they gambled on Phillips and Bamford coming back in March. Shocking from the club.
     
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  14. ristac

    ristac Well-Known Member
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    We have to all be honest, at the end of last season, if Orta had went out and signed us 2-3 players like Nahitan and Noa Lang who we were linked with and Bielsa had walked because he’d been ignored we’d have all went ape ****.

    Bielsa was backed fully 100% for three seasons and we were all happy. The board didn’t and couldn’t go out and sign just anyone this season, we really couldn’t have seen such a collapse coming.

    Then the question arises Kiko, Harrison, James, Rodrigo, Firpo and ignoring other positions, was that Orta or Bielsa, I blame both. Nketiah looked a bit crappy for us, today I wished we’d signed him, that one is down to Bielsa.

    We’ve witnessed with Phillips how crucial he is in a Bielsa team and how ordinary in a Marsch one. I’m not happy with Orta but at this moment he is an easy target.

    The only thing we could possibly hit the board with was timing, Bielsa should have been let go when the transfer window was still open or left to continue.

    Today I was mad, I slagged off Marsch in frustration but I agree, he needs to bring in his own players. I still don’t believe he will be up for the job but he needs to be given that transfer window and preseason.

    Radz has invested we can’t knock him for that but he should have cashed out last season, he got greedy and hung in this one and it’s bitten him.

    We have so many issues at the moment, Radz hasn’t the funds to take us to the next level, I’m sure the 49ers will be poor custodians, I really don’t want them either. If I’m being totally honest I’m not sure what I want right now. Orta in or out? Marsch or not? Radz or the 49ers?

    It just feels a huge mess
     
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  15. Eireleeds1

    Eireleeds1 Well-Known Member

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    Definitely orta out for a start. Not arsed if radz or 49ers pack up. If they can’t produce the required levels of investment then they can go too
     
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  16. SIDDAS

    SIDDAS Well-Known Member

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    January 1st is where it all went wrong because we all knew a relegation battle was in sight. we basically did nothing about it. We had no First team striker and thought Roberts,Rodrigo,Gelhardt would pull us through big mistake. Two aren't good enough with no pedigree to score Premier League goals and one who is raw as fook. This is the Premier League. The League that's probably the best in Europe with top top international's you can't just fill holes sorry. It's been a massive clanger by the club. Not just that we have players past there sell by date players anyone can see that they can't do it out there anymore but again we overlooked and didn't change them in Jan Christ they are still playing.
    The best of our under 23's have warmed the first team bench to cover our small depleted first team which ballsed up the under 23 season and relegated us.
    Not going into managers as its not fair. Marsch does not have any of his own players and has only played with a injury hit small Bielsa squad. I honestly don't think Bielsa would of been in a much better position come today.
    We have massively under estimated this season and tried our best to plug holes something you can't do at this level. We had a chance to fix it in Jan bulk up the midfield add a striker who can hit the bloody goal and score goals but we did neither. we crossed our fingers and hoped. Our u23's have talent yes but they are not prem players as of yet and some will never will be.
    Who's to blame only the club will know. did Bielsa block all Orta's recommended players in Jan and stubbornly think what he had was enough. Or did the club not have the balls to splash the cash. whatever it was it was the wrong decision because we are on the brink of relegation.
    Some awful decisions in the Jan window like thinking Forshaw was going to be our saviour in midfield and play every game to the end of the season. expecting Tyler Roberts to lead our line??? he wasn't good enough for us in the Championship but somehow we thought he was the dog's bollicks.

    You can't blame Marsch he's only got what's Infront of him which to be fair isn't good enough to start with. but his Football is terrible to watch don't know if it's cause we were blessed with bielsaball or he just doesn't have his sort of players. so far I see no idea's in his methods.
    We have 3 games to save our season which is now out of our hands, but I just don't see were we are scoring goals I just pray to god something can help us through because after today if i was a neutral fan I's be saying Leeds are going down. That first half was as bad as it gets it was like we were playing with blindfolds on and chasing a ball with a bell on.
     
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  17. xbpod

    xbpod Well-Known Member

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    Interesting pre match interview with KP on sky earlier, he blames his injury this season on his body being overloaded over the last 3 years.
     
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  18. Old Git

    Old Git Well-Known Member

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    Exactly , like I said a week ago.
    All of them pushed past their mental and physical limits.
     
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  19. Doc

    Doc Well-Known Member

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    Ineos owner Jim Ratcliffe tried to buy Chelsea last week offering £42 billion which was the biggest bid, but an American bank disqualified him un favour of an American baseball club owner. Bet he would love to take Leeds off the 49ers? Serious cash from an English owner
     
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  20. Eric Le Merde

    Eric Le Merde Well-Known Member

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    Wouldn't it be nice :emoticon-0148-yes:

    I think it was £4.2 billion but I'm sure Radz would take quite a bit less.
     
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