AVB The Beginning

[Spurf]

good post, 61

I totally agree with your second paragraph and think it's a good way of summing things up.

The bit that baffles me, is the bit about "moving on and progressing". I know that it can't be done overnight, but i'm completely bemused as to why and how "progressing" is selling 2 of our best players and not making SURE that we've got them replaced, as well as other signings we needed. We took care of the King issue by signing Vertonghen a few weeks prior to the end of the window. - what a difference that made! he's been brilliant since signing. With Caulker coing back too, it was like 2 new signings and both have been fantastic for us. - a clear indication that if you've got your players in good time and can work with them, it makes a huge difference.

it was inevitable that Modric was leaving and same for VDV (but came about a bit later on). The rumours over VDV leaving still gave us plenty of time to sort something else out, even if it wasn't official. - you can still bet the club knew he wanted to move back to be with his wife.
RM aren't a club to piss about. they clearly wanted LM and that was obvious for all to see for weeks and weeks. it just amazes me that Dembele was left until 3 days before the end, when the sale of LM was going to happen. And Rafa wasn't replaced at all to be honest. Oh, and we let Kane go out on loan leaving us with 2 strikers.

How is this an organised plan to "progress" and push on from 4/5th place finishes?

IMO, its contradictory to what we're trying to achieve and we completely shot ourselves in the foot. I just don't get it.

I hear this criticism about Levy and transfers over and over again. To me it just shows the complete lack of understanding of the market that football players are in.

It's a very volatile market and one where the seller often does not want to sell. Imagine someone trying to but your house that you did not want to sell. The potential buyer would need to offer you an amount that forced the issue and made you sell. Add to that that you would need to find somewhere else to live so off you go to negotiate with someone who doesn't want to sell but you can offer them more than it's worth because you are being given more than your house is worth. And so on and on. This all becomes very complex add to the mix an agent who want;s his cut then doing any deal is very difficult. Now add to all a deadline! WOW!

Instead of moaning about the failures we should be applauding the success. Look at the squad that has been built and I reckon it's pretty impressive in fact it has to be the most impressive rebuild outside of the two unlimited resource clubs.

We can't just go and pick the players we want from the supermarket it's all a bit more complicated than that.

 

[LockStock]

Well, not exactly, no. He's taking over a club that finished 4th, but the team's been almost entirely changed.
This was Redknapp's first choice XI last season: Friedel; Walker, Kaboul, King, Assou-Ekotto; Lennon, Parker, Modric, Bale; van der Vaart; Adebayor.
King retired, Modric and van der Vaart were sold, Parker and Kaboul have missed the whole season so far and Assou-Ekotto and Adebayor have only played about 3 games.
He's had 3 of last year's outfield players available, the whole spine's been missing or has left and Villas-Boas is expected to match his predecessor's results, anyway.

This

 

[Spurm]

who is AVB? And what is Spurs?

 

[The Tottenham Hotspur Nexus]

Great thread folks. Glad to see there's a few AVB supporters out there.

 

[Roo]

I hear this criticism about Levy and transfers over and over again. To me it just shows the complete lack of understanding of the market that football players are in.

It's a very volatile market and one where the seller often does not want to sell. Imagine someone trying to but your house that you did not want to sell. The potential buyer would need to offer you an amount that forced the issue and made you sell. Add to that that you would need to find somewhere else to live so off you go to negotiate with someone who doesn't want to sell but you can offer them more than it's worth because you are being given more than your house is worth. And so on and on. This all becomes very complex add to the mix an agent who want;s his cut then doing any deal is very difficult. Now add to all a deadline! WOW!

Instead of moaning about the failures we should be applauding the success. Look at the squad that has been built and I reckon it's pretty impressive in fact it has to be the most impressive rebuild outside of the two unlimited resource clubs.

We can't just go and pick the players we want from the supermarket it's all a bit more complicated than that.

that's not strictly true though, spurf. There's plenty of sides that conduct their activity without going near deadline day. just look at arsenal. Giroud, Podolski, Cazorla. all wrapped up in good time.

it really can't be compared to moving house and be that complicated if players can be signed within the space of a couple of hours in 1 day.

I'm sorry if I come across as moaning about failures, but I don't actually mean to. My point over the last few days has been to do with a bit of a reality check. The "ripping apart" or moaning (LOL), has been based on the fact that the club have an expectation of finishing 4th (or higher in years to come) and Levy wants us to progress. The only reason I going into one massively, is because the expectation IMO, is too high when we consider all the factors, such as clubs around us with more money, bigger stadiums, higher wages, leaving transfers till so late, not having a full squad together for a pre season etc etc. It's just a recipe for not getting what we want to achieve. - some of it within our control, some of it out of our control. So, for as long as we don't help ourselves with the factors that are within our control and keep making similar mistakes, I can't help but make the point.

If levy conducted his business in the same way, but aiming top 6-7 was our aim, I wouldn't have anything to "moan" about at all, as I think it's more realistic based on our circumstances and how little we actually spend.

 

[Spurf]

hat's not strictly true though, spurf. There's plenty of sides that conduct their activity without going near deadline day. just look at arsenal. Giroud, Podolski, Cazorla. all wrapped up in good time.

Ok Dembele was straight forward because we met the buy out clause, but it's not about the easy ones which we or anybody else achieved it's about the difficult ones that we don't. Like Moutinho or any number of strikers that we have been in for. We are also offering less wages than Arsenal and we hve not had CL football for yonks to raise the club's profile. So I maintain that it is very difficult and the proof of that is that we did not sign Moutinho.

Maybe we will in January.

 

[Roo]

Ok Dembele was straight forward because we met the buy out clause, but it's not about the easy ones which we or anybody else achieved it's about the difficult ones that we don't. Like Moutinho or any number of strikers that we have been in for. We are also offering less wages than Arsenal and we hve not had CL football for yonks to raise the club's profile. So I maintain that it is very difficult and the proof of that is that we did not sign Moutinho.

Maybe we will in January.

so why did we wait until Tdeadline day to make our move? it was rumoured he'd cost a fortune, so where was the back up plan to get someone more realistic that would have been capable of getting? I get the CL requirement, it's always been a problem. one which we could have taken advantage of better, had we done so when we were actually in it.

but the fact remains that there's other good talent out there that we could have got and had plenty of time to do so.

 

[totsfan]

i have been saying since the start of the season we have to back AVB.I wasn't happy he became our Manager ,but because he is and working to build a team,we the fan's want,a team that can win things , he should get our backing.what i don't get is fans saying he's no good etc,after a handful of games,where he has been unable to field,what fans consider our best 11I want him to succeed,because that mean's we are able to win things,but i also recognise,it is'nt an overnight job,so get behind him and give him our support

 

[Spurf]

so why did we wait until Tdeadline day to make our move? it was rumoured he'd cost a fortune, so where was the back up plan to get someone more realistic that would have been capable of getting? I get the CL requirement, it's always been a problem. one which we could have taken advantage of better, had we done so when we were actually in it.

but the fact remains that there's other good talent out there that we could have got and had plenty of time to do so.

Dembele was the back up. We went earlier for Moutinho and the price was off the wall you can't beat them up and force them to sell. Whatever you do it will drag to deadline day because it's there and is used as a lever by seller and buyer.

The better the player the harder to sign.

 

[Roo]

Dembele was the back up. We went earlier for Moutinho and the price was off the wall you can't beat them up and force them to sell. Whatever you do it will drag to deadline day because it's there and is used as a lever by seller and buyer.

The better the player the harder to sign.

so where was the modric replacement? or the VDV replacement?

 

[Spurf]

so where was the modric replacement? or the VDV replacement?

The remorseless Roo Yes I know it's hard, that's what I am trying to say. Selling VDV was a big mistake but we don't what happened at the time do we?

 

[totsfan]

Demble & Dempsey.

 

[Spurf]

Demble & Dempsey.

No doubt the plan totsfan but yet to work out with Dempsey. More of a last minute panic boy IMO

 

[Roo]

The remorseless Roo Yes I know it's hard, that's what I am trying to say. Selling VDV was a big mistake but we don't what happened at the time do we?

haha, I'm just being a C*** on purpose, Spurf!

I get what your saying, but I just believe that there's options we could have explored that would have probably been more suitable based on what we can afford. To go into deadline day, knowing that moutinho was going to be expensive was one thing, but to not have had a back up plan wasn't good enough.

Even if you like you say, dembele was the moutinho backup, it makes things even worse that we didn't replace 2 of our best players in Modric and VDV.

A player like Marin is an example. Yes chelsea got him, but someone like him is exactly what I mean. we would have got him if chelsea hadn't have come along with their CL victory and CL football next season on their CV. he said that he was interested in playing for us and hiswages were affordable. 6mill. what a steal. Can't wait to see him. Infact no, I hope he's a complete failure and we take him off their hands. Fat chance!

 

[totsfan]

No doubt the plan totsfan but yet to work out with Dempsey. More of a last minute panic boy IMO

you are probaby right about Dempsey,i think we panicked when VDV left,as it looked like a last minute decision to sell him.Hopefully Dempsey will start playing like we know he can do soon,but i hope we buy a real Modric replacement in January

 

[Spurlock]

Roo is just playing devil's advocate lol.

I'm surprised nobody has come on to stretch the debate.

So it seems like there's about 5 of us that are backing AVB

 

[Spurf]

Roo is just playing devil's advocate lol.

I'm surprised nobody has come on to stretch the debate.

So it seems like there's about 5 of us that are backing AVB

We will overcome Spurlock!

 

[O.Spurcat]

Something worth mentioning which I don't think has been mentioned so far in this thread, is that our chairman was understandably commited to family matters for much of this summer. Not only did he have to cope with his mother passing away, but then later his wife has since had a health issue, both of which have kept the guy out of this country for a long time.

Of course the club has contingency plans for such events, but sometimes contingency plans do not always pan out as they should. Another thing to bear in mind, is that a large proportion of earmarked summer transfer funds were used in compensation payments to Messrs Redknapp, Bond and Jordan. Clive Allen didn't get compensation because his contract was up.

Spurf is right to point out earlier that there are many factors which come into play before a signing/transfer takes place. Hopefully I have highlighted a couple more.

 

[paultheplug]

We have some very good players in our youth teamover the last ten years We always have had them. Up until now only two of them had made it into the first team, Ledley King and, less frequently. Jake Livermore. Since AVB has been in charge Tom Carroll, Andros Townsend, Ryan Mason and Adam Smith have all played first team games. Carroll in particular ought to get a Premier League start very soon. This on its own Convinces me AVB is the right choice. If we can get players who are good enough from our juniors the transfer budget can be spent on buying a few really top quality players instead instead of those only really suited as back up.

 

[District Line]

AVB's not put a foot wrong so far, IMO. - A few tactical errors and subs, but we could be saying that about any manager after any game!! It's the rest of it that he get's tarnished with that does my head in. - totally out of his control. People just aren't prepared to give him a fair chance, because their ego gets in the way.

The majority of chelsea fans want to see him fail. The thought of him succeeding with us makes them look stupid for sacking him, so that's a big fear for them deep down. (2 of my chelsea mates admitted that)

Disagree on both counts.

The reason many Chelsea fans want to see him fail is mainly because of his arrogance and continued obsession with talking about us and having digs at the club, players, fans and owner.

Had AVB just gone away quietly, taken the Spurs job and said "I'm here, at THFC and this is a new chapter for me. I made some mistakes at Chelsea but want to move on" many would have been less vindictive/more sympathetic towards him. I also think his unwillingness to acknowledge mistakes and hanging certain senior players out to dry speaks volumes of him as a manager/person.