I was speaking to one of the RP reporters about it and she was convinced that they have a database of gelding dates. Its amazing really that this sort of information isn't readily available to the public, it would make the sport seem much more open.
Nass I'm sure it would be possible for Weatherbys to run a query on their database based around gelding operations, but they are reliant on trainers notifying them when the operation took place. It takes a few weeks for hem to receover so most flat horses will be gelded over the winter. It's similar to the "in foal" debate. Should these be listed and if so at what point - when the mare is covered, when she has her 12 day scan, when she has her 28 day scan, etc. Ron
Cyc, it may be cheating, but Wikipedia can give you some info on Crisp's European exploits http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crisp_(horse)
Nass, if it finished last in a seller at Catterick on Monday as a colt and then it ran in the novice hurdle at Fakenham on Wednesday as a gelding, you know that the owner backed it at Catterick and you know who gelded it and when! This sort of “privatisation” would not make us run any faster, although perhaps being chased by somebody wanting to perform the act might make us move a bit quicker.
Am I right in saying that Lush Lashes did not get infoal to Sea the Stars? Probably a good thing as she is by Gallileo (STS's half brother).
Janabelle, yes yuo are right. they put her back in training after she lost the pregnancy. However, several of the mares sent to him were by Galileo. Nothing like keeping it in the family, eh?!
I notice from PN's very interesting list that Bjorn Nielsen sent several mares to STS and has a runner in the maiden hurdle at Sligo tonight....what a great owner breeder and supporter of the game!
Personally I don't like to see close in-breeding (can bring up all sorts of faults as well as good points) but that is just me. Will be interesting to see how many stars he gets from his first crop with such an impressive book of mares
Some very good show jumpers have come from a thoroughbred line. Now, AI is not allowed in thoroughbreds but it is in show jumping. So, could AI be used in a mating between a thoroughbred and a show jumper? Either way round.
Yes in theory there is nothing to stop AI being used on non-TB mares, but I would imagine most studs will be reluctant to get involved in the process. The majority of TB stallions being used as Sport Horses are failed racehorses. I do know that some NH stallions are used by eventers to add a bit of quality to their mares, but these are got by natural cover. I know of several people that used Silver Patriarch in this way.
Princess, good morning. Can you please tell me...for how many years at stud does a sire normally remain 'productive' and is there a time after which the quality of his offspring tends to wane? What prompted the question is the success that Cadoudal has had with siring steeplechasers- and he sired Big Bucks and Long Run well into his twenties. Kind regards, Tam.
Thanks for the Wiki link Princess. What a sad end to the wonderful horse. But to have a tree flowering on his grave sight, around National time, is a nice touch.
Tam there are no hard and fast rules as to how long a stallion will remain active and get good progeny. It is often the case that the very good stallions tend to get smaller and smaller books as they age, mainly because their own sons are getting all the good mares. For example, Sadler's Wells book started to fall after Galileo's success became apparant, falling from 124 in 2005 to just 64 by 2007, his final year (he stood in 2008 but failed to get anything in foal and was retired). The same can be said for the wonderful Green Desert, his sons at stud include Invincible Spirit and Cape Cross so it is little wonder that the old man's book has now fallen to less than 20. At the age of 28 he is still active (and looking great by all accounts) but his fertility has been on the wane and, I believe, he failed to get any mares in foal this year.
I'm more than happy to stick up my hand and confess to knowing next to nothing about the racing game, especially breeding, so the following might look a little stupid. I've seen print where some "horse folk" say that it's possible to run the guts out of a mare, so much so that it can be detrimental to her breeding prospects. They throw rubbish. Is this a fallacy? If this is so, can the same be said of an aging sire? Given all things being equal, will a young stallion throw better stock than an aging sire? I'm not talking fertility.
There is certainly a school of thought that top class racemares don't tend to throw good foals. I think the reason behind this is that the top mares generally have a more aggressive attitude (more testosterone) which is great on the racecourse but not so much for breeding. There has been some research to suggest that first foals tend to be smaller and weaker than subsequent foals, but age is certainly not a barrier to a mare producing good foals - New Approach, Ouija Board, Sir Percy and my very own Haafhd were all produced by mares in their late-teens/early 20s.
You're probably right but there are some examples of top stallions having been used way back. Maybe they were owned by the mare's owners.
Firstly great thread, well done PN!! Quick Q if you have time. In your opinion and from your best knowlege of price, what is the best value stud around at the moment?
