A take no retrospective action on McMananaman tackles

Discussion in 'Wigan' started by HP Sauce, Mar 19, 2013.

  1. HP Sauce

    HP Sauce Active Member

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    To be honest, I wish they had banned him for three or five matches. At least then we'd have a chance of drawing some sort of line under it. As it is he's going to be a hate figure for the forseeable.

    He needs to make some sort of apology to Hiadara I think - if he hasn't already. It'll be infomrative to find out exactly what is the extent of the injury to the lad too. I really hope its not too bad.

    Bobby will play CM against Norwich in a fortnight, probably as a sub. Be interesting to see how that goes.

    sorry missed out the "F" in the subject
     
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  2. HP Sauce

    HP Sauce Active Member

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  3. magicbus

    magicbus Member

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    Unbelievable and cowardly decision by the FA who hide behind a rule book and dont have the balls to take the bull by the horns and dish out some sort of punishment. What message is this sending out to all who play the game. Sincerely hope Hiadara is not too badly injured and wish him a speedy recovery if that is at all possible.
    If I had my way a player who puts another player out of the game should not come back until the injured player is back playing. Dreamland I know.
     
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  4. Albert's Chip Shop

    Albert's Chip Shop The riddler...
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    The FA are cowards.
    The comments from Whelan and Martinez are pathetic and delusional.
    These two blokes lost a lot of credibility when they came out with that horse ****.
     
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  5. HP Sauce

    HP Sauce Active Member

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    As lots of NUFC fans have written on blogs, most people would see that if the roles were reversed, Pardew would probably say the same sort of things that Bobby said after the match. And I do believe that Whelan is trying to draw fire away from the player.

    And finally the reaction of some NUFC supporters - and supporters of other clubs - is getting really disproportionate. The lad made a terrible tackle but most commentators don't see malice. I don't. Just real misjudgement. The claims of thuggery are pretty sick. Look to your own assistant manager for real thuggery.

    Let's see what the actual injury is. Why won't NUFC say? Perhaps because it doesn't suit their interests for it to turn out to be not too serious.
     
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  6. Never Say Die

    Never Say Die Who is this cnut?
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    I agree with you HP that it would have been better all round if CM had received a decent length ban. I thought it was a shocking tackle, but he's not the first and he wont be the last to do so. The lack of a ban will, however, lead to him being stuck with the label of a 'thug' for a long time - whether or not he deserves it. There would have been a far better chance of drawing a line under it if a ban had been administered. If a punishment had been put in place then he could have served his ban and then come back with a clean slate. In a lot of supporter's minds now he will never be given the opportunity to have a clean slate. In that, and only in that, I feel a level of sympathy for him. Mud sticks and he may well find himself with a few undeserving yellows and reds down the line if too much mud sticks. It becomes a vicious circle. None of this changes the fact that he has brought it upon himself though. It really was an awful tackle.

    As far as Robert Martinez's comments go, I don't like them but I can understand them. He hasn't covered himself in glory by saying he didn't see it, but then saying he got the ball, but I can understand a manager staying loyal to his player and drawing fire away from him. As for what Pardew would have said had the roles been reversed I don't know and I hope I never do. He has come out and defended players before, just as he has come out and admitted bad tackles before. What he hasn't had to do is defend a tackle as bad as Sunday's - at least not yet. However, Managers don't always feel the need to ignore right and wrong and in doing so ignore the truth. Newcastle fans actually have a little moral high ground to claim on this subject. At a similar time of the season, in a similar relegation battle, Joey Barton put in a horrible tackle on Xabi Alonso in a game against Liverpool. Barton was a key player for us and it would have been very understandable for our manager, Alan Shearer, to try and deflect blame away from a key player. Instead he came out and said that there was no place on a football pitch for that sort of tackle and promised that Barton would be 'dealt with.'

    As for your claims that John Carver is the real thug then I cannot see where you are coming from. You chastise not only Newcastle fans, but the general consensus of fans of other football clubs, for offering the opinion that Callum McManaman's tackle was thuggish - a tackle that was always going to inflict injury on a fellow professional. You chastise not only Newcastle fans, but the general consensus of fans of other football clubs, for offering the opinion that Callum McManaman's reaction to the tackle, and his immediate lack of concern, displayed behaviour that many would interpret as being the behaviour of a thug. And yet, you choose to describe John Carver's actions of VERBAL abuse as the behaviour of a thug. John Carver did not start pushing anybody. He did not try and injure anybody. He didn't even attempt any actions that could have accidentally injured anybody - and yet you call him the real thug. He did respond angrily to being shoved by your physio. He did react angrily to being roughly manhandled by Wigan stewards. And yet, even in that state of anger, he didn't attempt anything that could have injured anybody. If the FA were to act in relation to the facts then they would punish your physio more severely than John Carver as your physio started the PHYSICAL abuse in response to John Carver's VERBAL abuse. I hold no such expectation or faith that the FA will act in such a fair manner though.

    As for Dave Whelan, I have no respect for the man. He allows his personal, and well documented, hatred of Mike Ashley to cloud his judgement. I can't imagine that this hatred has been helped by the collapse of JJB Sports and Mike Ashley picking up the bones of his former business for a pittance. Callum McManaman made a terrible decision in a split second. Robert Martinez made a poor choice of words when put on the spot immediately after the game. Dave Whelan had 24 hours to think about his comments, and after that thinking time chose to bend the truth and also contradict statements he had previously made (concerning his own injury). Dave Whelan has form for being a controversial figure, and has made controversial statements in the past about British workers and the labour movement when campaigning on behalf of the tory party. He has a history of seeing events from a skewed point of view.

    I know that many Wigan supporters have come out and condemned the tackle and expressed their embarrassment at it. However, others have tried to justify it, or worse still - like Dave Whelan - change the truth. It is this fact more than any other that is annoying Newcastle fans. The FA's failure to have a backbone, and their continued policy of ignoring things outside of London and Manchester, has ensured that this episode will rumble on for a lot longer than it needed to. I imagine most Newcastle fans would now be pleased to see Wigan relegated. That is a shame as many would have had a soft spot for the perennial underdogs. I would also expect that Newcastle fans will be denied this, admittedly childish, revenge as Wigan have a habit of avoiding the drop. We are not even guaranteed yet that you wont avoid the drop at our expense. The most likely scenario though is that both clubs will still be in the premier league next year and that there will be a lot of ill feeling between the clubs. The ill feeling is probably generated far more from Tyneside at the minute, but such feelings have a habit of becoming mutual.

    I cant help thinking that all of this is a shame and could have been avoided. Apart from obviously being avoided if Callum McManaman had not been so reckless, it could have been avoided by a little more contrition from Martinez and a lot less bile from Dave Whelan.

    Finally, and most importantly, lets not forget that as we all bicker and score points over each other, there is a young man who was the real victim of all this. I really hope that this all ends up looking like a storm in a teacup (which it isn't) and that he is not badly injured. Most of all I hope that whatever the extent of his injuries he is able to resume a very promising club and international career. His name is Massadio Haidara for the benefit of Mr Whelan!
     
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  7. Never Say Die

    Never Say Die Who is this cnut?
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    The reason that nobody is saying how serious the injury is is no secret. It has already been announced that he has had a scan, but that doctors need to wait another week to scan again before they can judge how bad the damage is. There are no broken bones (Thank God!). There is ligament damage, but doctors are unable to say how bad the ligament damage is as yet as the swelling is still too severe. We will all have a better idea in a week's time.

    I hope that the injury isn't serious for the sake of Massadio Haidara. If you want to then feel free to hope that the injury isn't too bad so that you can be petty. Either way I will be pleased for the player.

    However, no matter what the injury is - does it make a difference? It was still a career threatening tackle. It is comments such as these that are turning a lot of fans against Wigan at the moment, and by no means just Newcastle fans!
     
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  8. HP Sauce

    HP Sauce Active Member

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    Thanks Hope for your well thought out posts mate, I'm grateful. Lots I agree with in there. I was at the game, and at the end of the ground where the tackle took place and we were all convinced that it was a red. One or two people were arguing that the lad had got "some" of the ball - and I think the video does show that he gave it the lightest of touches with his right boot as he went through - but its the fact that he went over the ball with studs which of course makes it a horrible, horrible tackle. Persnally I think it was misjudgement, but there is no justifying it. Equally the boy doesn't have a glass head, and plenty of people have decided it was deliberate. None of us know. I'm not doing the "he's a good kid" thing - he's a fringe player, who has put in some reasonable performances in the cups and was good enough against Everton to get his first start. So even Wigan supporters don't really "know" him. Hence the fact that for us a ban would probably have helped to take the heat out of all this - without really affecting our football.

    If it turns out that the lad has sustained serious injury I'll be back here to apologise for my pettiness. If it turns out that he hasn't sustained anything worse than cuts and bruises then I'll feel like the NUFC management have stoked the fire pretty cynically. All we can do is wait and find out. Sorry if you think it's petty - we're a club under siege just now and I'm sure if your club was under this sort of attack you wouldn't just passively suck it up.

    Incidentally, if you're at all interested in the DW / Mike Ashley relationship, this might fill in some of the gaps - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19635988 Both Mike and Dave picked off tasty parts of the JJB group - but Dave sold his share, at the top of the market, in 2007.
     
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  9. Never Say Die

    Never Say Die Who is this cnut?
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    I think there is a lot of anger and hurt on both sides. It cannot be nice being vilified and feeling like the world is against you, particularly when you are used to reveling in the reputation of a friendly family club. I have no doubt that the feeling is in many ways one of a siege mentality. Equally, we are feeling very hard done by. It is not easy losing a very promising full back (and a very important one in our European campaign) and then feeling like our players are fair game for bad tackles. Both situations will lead to angry words and bitterness. Our clubs haven't enjoyed a good relationship at boardroom level for a few seasons now, but this had never extended to the terraces to the best of my knowledge.
     
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  10. HP Sauce

    HP Sauce Active Member

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    I've always enjoyed my trips to St James (it has, until recently, been a happy hunting ground for us). I don't like the fifteen flights of stairs to the away section though...:)

    But yes, this will sour relationships with not just NUFC but many other clubs. So be it. You know what sticks in the craw though?I've watched this club for a good number of years. It is clear that Bobby sends his teams out to conduct themselves well. There is very little diving or cheating or waving imaginary cards or rolling around on the floor trying to con referees (apart from Gomez :)). They play the game the right way. One horrible tackle from one fringe player and we're now "dirty bastards" and everyone's pick for relegation. While I'm genuinely sad for the lad who was hurt, I really hope we stick it up all the haters by staying up and winning the FA Cup.
     
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  11. Never Say Die

    Never Say Die Who is this cnut?
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    It wont sour your relations with other clubs - not seriously anyway. McManaman has set himself up for a fall anytime that he is involved in a dodgy situation, and when he is this will be dragged back up. Like I said earlier, he could even find himself picking up a few dubious yellows and reds if too much mud sticks. But all of the righteous anger that is doing the rounds from other clubs will soon die down when the next drama unfolds. I wouldn't expect a warm welcome anytime soon at St James for McManaman, Martinez or Whelan - but I doubt it will go far beyond that. We both know that if you find yourself in a cup final in May against Man Utd then there will be more than a few ABU's supporting Wigan.

    It might spill over into your next few games - especially towards CM, but i doubt it will last long. I am sure the thought that a semi-final victory almost certainly gives you European football next year will make up for it.
     
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  12. Cristòfol

    Cristòfol Member

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    I love Martínez, it's a shame his recent comments have made him appear a bit of a ****er to some, but this kid is young,inexperienced and not defensibly inclined it was a horrendous tackle but it didn't seem in any way malicious just incredibly reckless and though obviously most agree match bans should of be given to really make the point to the lad that it won't be tolerated again with my previous points highlighted you can understand Martínez' interest in in defending his player. Except for the odd few managers that love nothing more than to publicly bash their players, most managers would do the same.
    I hope Haidara is alright and recovers well and I really think as said before a ban should of been given to demonstrate to Callum that he needs to use his brain before taking on moronic challenges. Be a prick, get a bollocking. But naturally the FA pick and choose when this applies *sigh*
    Anyway I hope Haidara is well and back in the game soon and I hope these stupid actions from one individual doesn't give Wigan and Roberto a bad reputation Wigan really aren't a dirty team
     
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  13. Never Say Die

    Never Say Die Who is this cnut?
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  14. fromthestands

    fromthestands Member

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    HP whats that site you go on to find out about injured players might find out something there.
     
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  15. fromthestands

    fromthestands Member

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    Tell you what magicbus that's not a bad idea and i can see that it could work it would put a stop to all the bad fowls and every club wold come under the same rules from the prem downwards to the smaller clubs but how do you implement it would it be cup buy cup European the FA. league cup. what? <confused>
     
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  16. Sammy's Silky Skills

    Sammy's Silky Skills Well-Known Member

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    Martinez has gone down in my estimations.
    Sir Bobby wouldn't have come out with that blinkered ****.
     
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  17. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    I saw the tackle for the first time last night, looked to me that he went for the ball, I've seen far worse things done on a football pitch and be ignored. Slo-mo'd and freeze framed it looks a hell of a lot worse than it does in real-time, yeah, he got injured, though no one knows how badly, but that's not a valid reason to go on a witch hunt.
     
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  18. Never Say Die

    Never Say Die Who is this cnut?
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    You are in a very small minority with that point of view. Most commentators and pros seem to think it was horrific
     
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  19. Never Say Die

    Never Say Die Who is this cnut?
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    How wrong have the FA got this? Well 4 days, 5 articles and several thousand comments later (thats just the BBC) the debate is still raging on. Not just Geordies and Latics, but a football debate. The FA had a chance to draw a line under this and let us move on. The number of people from all clubs still willing to read and comment shows they have seriously misjudged how much leadership was needed by them in this situation.

    A quick announcement on Monday that a retrospective ban had been put in place and I think we would all (including CM) be better off, and probably talking about something else!
     
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