Suck it up, you bunch of pussies. We cop this ALL the time and have learned to live with it and turn it to our advantage (No-one likes us..........). Why not try 'Everybody hates us, and we are scared'.
And a Lion isn't just a big pussy?? Scratching Valley Cat thinks he knows the truth here! Brisbane - this is a discussion about the good reputation of our club being sullied by a few sordid individuals who by their ignorant behaviour (something that may be acceptable at the Bricklayers Arms) have damaged a reputation that has taken more than a few years to build. I, like others on here, have recognised that the boerish behaviour of some of our supporters verges on the immoral if not quite illegal. That some have crossed that line annoys me and others on here. I want the Valley to be welcoming to all possible support from whatever race, colour or creed and as a season ticket holder I have witnessed that on the whole we are. Most other clubs supporters, when asked, have enjoyed their trip to our ground because it is a friendly place. We even welcome reformed denizens, nigels that have seen the light and fish out of water (no Gills) - so long as they respect the fact that football is a game where passions can run high but they know where the line is.
Agree with your base sentiments, Cat, but look closely at mine. A few drongos cause a ruckus and we all get the blame. Its no good whinging about it 'cause it ain't going to go away as long as there's good press and it sells papers, so live with it. We have, and we have fun with it. Will it happen again, betcha balls, there will always be the idiot element that are out for a donnybrook and bugger the ball. I remember during the Falklands conflict, out here we had a cartoon that showed the Argies retreating rapidly over the hill as a boatload of ManU supporters were let loose at them. Times have changed a bit, eh?
There's been a bit of a story here running for a while. I can remember references to idiots at our games going back to Halifax, Walsall and the Blades. Sadly, it's just a memeber of the public who outed this lot, but I hope the club moves in and removes them permenantly. Sorry Typical, but racist behaviour has no place in modern society, dress it up how you will.
Who is dressing this up? I was always under the impression that we were a club as and such we can afford fellow supporters a fair and a balanced hearing. Because the word racist has been mentioned thats it then, there guilty, they wore stone island clothes, they must be guilty. They were loud and rowdy, and upset a local Putney lady, let's kick their doors in and invite the press along, because there guilty. The evidence against them may have come from a hysterical woman who phones the police when the milkman is late. Why can't fellow fans show some solidarity and if they are CHARGED and CONVICTED then you can play hangman and get all uppity. The sheer unfairness of this whole thread astounds me, we have some idiot fans, we have some right tossers but some of you make out that travelling away is like a day out with the third reich.
Typical, if you want solidarity why don't you stand shoulder to shoulder with people who all support Charlton and all have had enough of some vile behaviour that they don't want to spoil the reputation of their great club? Do you ever post on subjects other than race?
My post is about equality, fairness and principal. I can't see that race comes into it or been mentioned by me. I want to see some balance for the many cafc fans who are treated like dirt by the club, and are being forced away from one of the very few things that mean anything in their lives. I did not see the club treating the fans so badly when it was going out of existence. There was no mention of all this equality back then when arguably a problem did exist. It was all about the money, they did not care whose hands it came out out off. I will stand shoulders with any cafc fan but what I will not do is condemn any one so quickly and on the flimsiest of evidence.
I going to be honest and state I am struggling with all this media attention on racism. I have just by pure coincidence come across via a media publication, that police are investigating an incident, in regards to alleged racist gestures by a fan. In crowds of 60,000+ people, there will be many people that have resorted into some sort of criminal activity, probably a lot worse than said incidents. Maybe these same media sources would like to start vetting every individual that enters an entertainment arena, whilst at it, why not tag everyone to monitor their behaviour. Why are one or two individuals being highlighted to such an extent to bring scorn on conduct within our gaming arenas, whilst these are social issues not just a football problem. I am not saying we should dismiss them or turn a blind eye, however, it would be nice if the media could just stick to reporting on the actual event and let the police carry out their public duty, without the big brother eye on every incident, I am starting to question the media's motives. You can suppress people within a stadium but it will not change that individual in reality. Maybe it is to stop these individuals from infesting others with their sickness. So where does it end? There is chanting within football grounds that could be deemed highly offensive if expressed face to face, that is not racist. What next, cart people off by the coach load to the nearest cells. Racism should not be condoned neither should it be used as a tool for some media propaganda.
Criminal activity during the event that's ignored? Such as ? Sure, racism is a social problem, not just in football. Football clubs always claim that they're at the heart of their society. Maybe they should take a stand on behalf of part of that society. Typical has an understandable point about Charlton being happy to take everyone's money back in the old days, but genuinely I have never heard the Kevin Lisbie song as much in past seasons as in this. Based on the account in this thread, what happened on the train was on another level to that.
That was not my words. What I mean though, is in a crowd of 60k+, there are probably people you would never want to socialise with in person for one reason or another. As much as you would not want to be associated with that racist. Should football stadiums vet people before we let them in. What happened to all the criminals from the recent riots, how many of them attended a sporting arena this weekend but were never brought to justice as an example. Maybe those same cameras would like to do some profile searching within the crowds to catch them, does football not also play a part in resolving those social issues. Yes, football does have a place to stamp out racism. This is not football as general I am talking about, this is the media, do they have an interest to stamp out racism or a bigger interest in making a story by laying in wait for that one individual out of 60k to step forward for a picture that I can only guess might sell for thousands. Bearing in mind they are probably struggling more now with their exclusives in light of the Leveson enquiry. Finally we quite rightly will not accept racism in a football stadium from a single individual but it's socially acceptable for a mass crowd to chant at the ref or a player is a **** or a ******. Maybe in years to come that will be looked back on with the same scorn and cameras vetting the crowd ready for the next arrest.
brb, the difference is that the alleged racist abuse in Anfield happened in a football ground during a football match. The activities of fans or players during football matches are a concern for football clubs and football authorities. Without knowing any more about the story, I would say that there's a 98% likelihood that the alleged abuse was directed at a player who was at the centre of a case of racist abuse earlier this season. There were no riots this summer in football grounds. Media choose the story that sells the most. Maybe today that's the story about a Liverpool fan. Tomorrow it might be some crisis in the Eurozone. A year ago, it was a story about Jude Law. It never seems to be about the civil war in the Congo or epidemics across the world or famine in the horn of Africa. That's a problem with the people the media is selling to [ie. us], probably a problem with the media in general, but I don't think football is being targeted any more than any other popular activity or person. If you have allegations to make about the fans or players in any other sport, say, rugby or cricket or whatever, by all means do. Your last part, I doubt it will happen. That abuse is directed at people because of what they do, not who they are. At any rate, racism has been 'stamped out' of football much the same as it has in general society, not by someone on high declaring it wrong, but by ordinary people doing their part, stopping it and stopping other people. We're now at a point where the vast majority of people think racist abuse is unacceptable at football. The police are acting against a tiny minority, as you say.
Whilst I despise racism in any form whatsoever, I can identify very strongly with BRB's point. We are 28 years past the date when George Orwell predicted that Big Brother would control our lives,even down to the way that we are allowed to express ourselves but we appear to have reached the point when through the monitoring of our society by the forces of the holier than though media organisations we have minor localised incidents tarring the reputation of everybody within a two mile radius. None of seriously believes that every Liverpool fan is a racist, but we are led to believe that the right minded are in a minority in that club because of the behaviour os some. We view Charlton as a family friendly club where colour race and creed does not divide us. Maybe there are one or ten amongst us who do not think like we do particularly when they have had several bevies to many on their way home from a cup defeat. Is that news? The Grauniad would like to tarnish us with that and has found us guilty without trial. We have found ourselves guilty without trial because big brother has told us we are! racism is a scourge on our society, but the 24 hour rolling media that has become the big brother in our society has equal fault in creating doubt and self loathing in a group of people that are on the whole well meaning is a cause for fear. Others on here have pointed out that we don't know the truth of the situation. Was it just some drunks singing a tasteless song that they had heard at a ground before without thinking about the situation because they were inebriate? Or was the second coming of the third Reich? That we all, myself included, responded as judge and jury is exactly the way that BB wanted us to behave. Orwell was wrong, BB was not the government that he foresaw or the religious bodies that Marx believed were the opium of the masses. It may well be the "right minded" who are driving us to trial without due process. That the right minded media have come this far is a grave concern. After the 1870 reform act Disraeli suggested that with universal male franchise we now had to "educate our master" he meant that we should educate our populace so they could see what was truly right. We have as a society let ourselves down and are now allowing ourselves to not question the media reporting which inflames a problem. We failed not only in allowing a drunken bigetted few to do what they did but in allowing the media to convince us that it is all of society. Rant over
