2 Points from 9: Is it only me who questions BR?

[Super G Ted'inho]

Despite all the plaudits, Foster made one world class save (from Gerrard) and guessed right from a penalty. The rest was bread and butter for a EPL keeper imo. We were limited to pot shots and half chances and a lot of wild efforts from outside of the box. WBA played 2 DM's (as usual) and basically said, come on then, play through us, knowing that if the ball goes wide, we do feck all with it. Tactical ****eness imo.

That guys talking sense!

We play one way and one way only, passing. However, when teams come to defend we aren't good enough at passing to break them down. We are possibly the ****test in the league when it comes to ariel threats too! So easy for an awat side to defend against. Least when we are away the other team have to attack more meaning there is space for us to passing & move.

 

[SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING]

We should have beaten Arsenal and Man City away - good performances and decent yet disappointing results.

We were dog sh1t last night - but yet we still dominated, still created chances, missed a penalty and ultimately should have won.

tbh, the performances against City and Arsenal were good....but just patting ourselves on the back because we 'should of won' is hiding a lot of inadequacies.

For a start, the team can't defend in open play or at set pieces....of course, our free flowing football looks great against teams that set themselves out to win matches and offer us the room to play.....but realistically, how many teams will do that? At present, we do not have a balance between penetrating attacking football and defending. I don't care how pretty the football is, I'd take ugly goals and clean sheets before that all day long......it's the basics....and we don't have it.

 

[Zingy]

2 Points from 9: Is it only me who questions BR?

Silly question.

Seriously though, against City we were all saying we were moving in the right direction. These results always undo us and prove nothing has changed in the last 6-7 years. BR is a young manager who hasn't achieved anything major, of course he is going to be questioned. Will he ever make it on the big? I guess we can only wait and find out where he is taking us.

 

[Lucas Talking]

tbh, the performances against City and Arsenal were good....but just patting ourselves on the back because we 'should of won' is hiding a lot of inadequacies.

For a start, the team can't defend in open play or at set pieces....of course, our free flowing football looks great against teams that set themselves out to win matches and offer us the room to play.....but realistically, how many teams will do that? At present, we do not have a balance between penetrating attacking football and defending. I don't care how pretty the football is, I'd take ugly goals and clean sheets before that all day long......it's the basics....and we don't have it.

How easy has it been lately to lose Agger? That is quite a few times recently that a simple move or dropped shoulder has got the striker a goal and he has lost his man countless times on corners.

 

[Jonesey]

tbh, the performances against City and Arsenal were good....but just patting ourselves on the back because we 'should of won' is hiding a lot of inadequacies.

For a start, the team can't defend in open play or at set pieces....of course, our free flowing football looks great against teams that set themselves out to win matches and offer us the room to play.....but realistically, how many teams will do that? At present, we do not have a balance between penetrating attacking football and defending. I don't care how pretty the football is, I'd take ugly goals and clean sheets before that all day long......it's the basics....and we don't have it.

Totally agree.

Andy Carroll would have been a good option to play from the bench last night

 

[Stereo]

We play some nice football, are good in procession but lack penetration and are pretty lightweight. We have become Swansea (11/12).

You mean you have become Swansea under Brendan Rodgers by the 11/12 thing right ?

 

[SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING]

Silly question.

Seriously though, against City we were all saying we were moving in the right direction. These results always undo us and prove nothing has changed in the last 6-7 years. BR is a young manager who hasn't achieved anything major, of course he is going to be questioned. Will he ever make it on the big? I guess we can only wait and find out where he is taking us.

But you have to look at the form book too; as it happens City lost badly to Southampton and in reality, were poor team when we played them.....So, with the benefit of hindsight, it stands to reason that we should of beaten a poor team

Anyway, we've had too many false dawns under Rodgers this season; I fully respect those who want to give him more time; we all have opinions and different thresholds of tolerance. I think he's a phoney. Period.

 

[No Kane No Gain]

I don't know what you guys expect from Rodgers. When he took over he had a club that's been sliding down the table and he's stopped that whilst getting you playing better football and without much money. I'm not saying he's doing brilliantly either but he's done enough to avoid criticism, in my opinion. Every manager will look clueless to fans when things aren't going well, just look at AVB, he got a lot of criticism early on when the results weren't coming yet it's clear he knows a good amount about football and can get results. I wouldn't be surprised if by the end of this season or next season, the results will have started coming and you'll be saying Rodgers knows his stuff.

Unless you finish the season on less points and in a lower position than last season then he deserves another transfer window and another season to start showing real results on the pitch, otherwise you'll end up with a new manager each year and the longer you do that and the longer you stay in midtable it's going to be harder and harder to get a good manager in.

 

[The artist JerryChristmas]

We now need to average a whole point a game more than Tottenham, I bet there are still posters that claim we can get fourth

I've said all along, better last seasons eighth and I'll be happy

I won't and I'll tell you why. Last year we qualified for Europe and we got to two cup finals. If we better 8th and win the Europey then ok we'll have bettered last year but 7th, no trophy and as big a gap to the top as ever just isn't good enough and it's certainly no better than we'd have been under Kenny. We'll also have a lot of our better players looking to leave and frankly who will blame them.

I feel for BR to a certain extent. His team selection in terms of Shelvey up front (wtf?) Was poor and the pace too slow...however it isn't his fault Gerrard missed a pen, Suarez was ****, Johnson couldn't trap a bag of sand and Enrique had a shocker. It is his fault however that he took of Hendo who along with Lucas was our only energy on the park. It is his fault we swapped Mandy for ****ing Borini. It's also down to him that he hasn't yet worked out how to beat teams who play with two banks of four behind the ball.

Where the **** do we go from here fellas? I just haven't got a scooby do anymore

 

[SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING]

You mean you have become Swansea under Brendan Rodgers by the 11/12 thing right ?

Yes, not literally of course but we have become them (when under Rodgers! They are better this year!)

 

[Super G Ted'inho]

I won't and I'll tell you why. Last year we qualified for Europe and we got to two cup finals. If we better 8th and win the Europey then ok we'll have bettered last year but 7th, no trophy and as big a gap to the top as ever just isn't good enough and it's certainly no better than we'd have been under Kenny. We'll also have a lot of our better players looking to leave and frankly who will blame them.

I feel for BR to a certain extent. His team selection in terms of Shelvey up front (wtf?) Was poor and the pace too slow...however it isn't his fault Gerrard missed a pen, Suarez was ****, Johnson couldn't trap a bag of sand and Enrique had a shocker. It is his fault however that he took of Hendo who along with Lucas was our only energy on the park. It is his fault we swapped Mandy for ****ing Borini. It's also down to him that he hasn't yet worked out how to beat teams who play with two banks of four behind the ball.

Where the **** do we go from here fellas? I just haven't got a scooby do anymore

Fair points but we also started the season with a new manager this season. Kenny six months prior to last season and already knew the players come tge summer.

Until we figure out how to beat a team in the second quarter of the league we won't be winning ****.

 

[SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING]

Kenny made us into a counter-attacking team. A decent one but we also had an issue with finishing. He and Clarke looked to build from the back and am sure they had a 3 year plan to get balance in the team. In the end, the last few months under Kenny were dire too but we knew that we were heading somewhere and knew that he was no mug with good PR.

I'd of taken a second year of Kenny because he had nothing to prove to me or the players for that matter and had got us to two finals and shown progress. Can't say the same for Rodgers.

 

[Sir_Red]

I'm normally quick to blame the manager but quite frankly we had 19 shots and 0 goals. There is not much more BR could have done. Admit his selection was iffy but the players last night were ****ing awful, there is such a lack of strength of mind in the team. And that is something that can't be learnt, you're either a leader or you're not. And most of our players are not leaders, they are ******ed chickens

 

[morgan]

I worry that BR doesnt have what it takes to manage a big club like Liverpool, he done averagely at Watford, got sacked from Reading after 6 months. He done well at Swansea but to be fair he didnt really have to change much there as the club wanted to carry on playing the same style as Martinez. But anyway a mid table finish for Swansea is great for them but i cant see him being the driving force behind Liverpool. I notice a lot of fans blaming the players but i think that individually you have some of the best players in the league. Reina, Gerrard, Suarez etc, not a cheap team by any Length. The plus points of BR are that he will do as hes told by the higher powers and loves the press, seems perfect for a American backer. Maybe a top class assistant coach would bridge the gap instead of the joke you have atm. Also half the comments said by Liverpool about BR seem to be the same as Swansea fans said last year except they were happy with their position and didnt expect to beat half the teams Liverpool do.

 

[No Kane No Gain]

I won't and I'll tell you why. Last year we qualified for Europe and we got to two cup finals. If we better 8th and win the Europey then ok we'll have bettered last year but 7th, no trophy and as big a gap to the top as ever just isn't good enough and it's certainly no better than we'd have been under Kenny. We'll also have a lot of our better players looking to leave and frankly who will blame them.

I feel for BR to a certain extent. His team selection in terms of Shelvey up front (wtf?) Was poor and the pace too slow...however it isn't his fault Gerrard missed a pen, Suarez was ****, Johnson couldn't trap a bag of sand and Enrique had a shocker. It is his fault however that he took of Hendo who along with Lucas was our only energy on the park. It is his fault we swapped Mandy for ****ing Borini. It's also down to him that he hasn't yet worked out how to beat teams who play with two banks of four behind the ball.

Where the **** do we go from here fellas? I just haven't got a scooby do anymore

Dalglish was brought in and given a big budget to turn Liverpool back into a top 4 side and instead he took you further backwards, I don't see how he'd have done any better with less money this summer and sticking with this idea of Downing + Carroll = Goals. Rodgers was brought in as part of a longerterm, more realistic and sustainable plan to get the club back up the table and should be judged accordingly. Rodgers has a lot of players that he wouldn't have bought and probably doesn't want, had he been given the same level of money Dalglish had then you could judge him by the same standards that got him the boot.

 

[SIR_KENNY_KLOPP_KING]

I'm normally quick to blame the manager but quite frankly we had 19 shots and 0 goals. There is not much more BR could have done. Admit his selection was iffy but the players last night were ****ing awful, there is such a lack of strength of mind in the team. And that is something that can't be learnt, you're either a leader or you're not. And most of our players are not leaders, they are ******ed chickens

We had 16 potshots and 3 decent efforts (or close to that).....Even I could of sat 30 yards out and contributed to that pointless stat.

You're right about leadership though.....and the bit about ******ed chickens

 

[mighty_stevie_g]

Kenny made us into a counter-attacking team. A decent one but we also had an issue with finishing. He and Clarke looked to build from the back and am sure they had a 3 year plan to get balance in the team. In the end, the last few months under Kenny were dire too but we knew that we were heading somewhere and knew that he was no mug with good PR.

I'd of taken a second year of Kenny because he had nothing to prove to me or the players for that matter and had got us to two finals and shown progress. Can't say the same for Rodgers.

We haven't finished the season yet so how can you say that? We aren't gonna be axing anybody mid-season so lets just get behind him. **** me everyone was blowing our trumpet before last night, all is not lost - we have just found out that top 4 is off the cards which i'm sure 95% of us knew before we'd kicked a ball this season.

 

[DirtyFrank]

While all the criticism BR is getting may be valid to an extent : I'm starting to despair at this constant free pass we're giving this group of players. How many managers do you want to call tactically inept before you face the fact this group of players just isn't at this moment in time good enough to be much higher than they are?

This plan B nonsense is a red herring: show me what plan b would be with this squad? Oh the old Carroll chestnut eh? Yeah because he's been a blinder (injury aside) at a team designed around "plan b" isn't he?

And that's the crux. We either play passing football, counter attack football or hoofball. Anything else is variations of a theme. Our players are average or just above average on a good day at the first two & too small & weak for the third.

Can some of these players improve enough through age & development to go past "just average" with any consistency? I think yes. But there's also going to be quite a few who won't & that's despite of not because of manager/s.

Add to that limited budget & strict policies & we can't buy our way out of the problem en masse immediately.

So there's the reality. I'm not going to criticise the manager this early because the squad at this moment in time is average & inconsistent. Another couple of transfer windows then yes. I'm also not going to expect him to have half the squad 6ft5 & mimicking west ham in training just in case the opposition intends to park the bus.

So I'll give him time to buy/discover the players that do suit our game & can unlock the defences. I'll criticise the owners if they won't buy the players with those required qualities to make it work as they hired the man with the full knowledge of how he was going to set up. If they had wanted plan b they would have hired fat Sam. Well they can pay up for their choice. If they do & BR buys rubbish then I'll call for his head.

But as I said earlier: none of that should distract us from criticising a distinct lack of effort from this group. I'll expect average but with 100% effort. We didn't get it last night.

I see Hendo is the latest to trot out promising us they'll work harder & change. I wish they'd all **** up & just do it.

 

[mighty_stevie_g]

While all the criticism BR is getting may be valid to an extent : I'm starting to despair at this constant free pass we're giving this group of players. How many managers do you want to call tactically inept before you face the fact this group of players just isn't at this moment in time good enough to be much higher than they are?

Exactly this - the league table doesn't lie, it's not about what manager we have our team is simply **** compared to the teams we are trying to compete with. BR has a job to bring players in and ship players out which he will pretty much complete this summer - so NEXT season is the real test. Finish 7th or 8th next season and I will be asking serious questions about him then as well - to do it now is naive to say the least.

 

[Jimmy Squarefoot]

We had a golden opportunity to rebuild under Kenny, given the amount of money he spent. I feel he tried to change too much too quickly.

But enough of looking back.

I do believe Rodgers is the right man to take us forward and it will take another 2-3 years to get the squad he wants. The fact that we had to play Borini and Shelvey says it all about our squad quality and depth. Granted, Borini was his own signing but he's clearly not a first team player just yet.

This is an inexperienced team, with an inexperienced manager, ran by an inexperienced MD, owned by inexperienced owners. We are learning from our mistakes e.g. the transfer debacle in the summer was quickly rectified in January and our reluctance to overspend on players.

Last night was very frustrating but I maintain - we played poorly, one of the worst games ever yet we still dominated and created chances and ultimately should have won.

If we are going to improve, then we need more 'Sturridge' signings - players that can come in and improve the first team. Hopefully Coutinho could do this as well but he's only 20 and I think he needs more time before he can make an impact. Allen, Borini, Assaidi, Sahin (and anymore that I have missed) have simply not made an impact so in effect, our squad has weakened with the transfers of Kuyt, Maxi and Bellamy and we have not replaced them.

Out of all of these signings, only 1 (potentially 2 if Coutinho hits the ground running) has come into the team and improved us. That is simply not good enough.

After an aggressive cost cuttnig exercise over the past year, we really need to spend on quality. I feel we need a couple of £20m+ signings - similar to the amount we spent on Suarez, Torres etc.