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OUT! It's not just about the three games of this season.Last season was painful and that was down to waddock and nobody else.waddock brought in some donkeys and it wasn't until the end of the season that we started to look better with some loan players but by then it was too late.
I'm sick of him blaming the players after every defeat,after all he picks the team and chooses the tactics so why is it not his fault?
Hayes gave him a long contract which we can't afford to end and he knows it so why would he quit? He will pick up a pay packet throughout the season even for being crap at his job,would this happen to anyone working in a factory or office,of course not they would be sacked without a pay-off and so should he!
The final reason i want him out is the disgraceful treatment of Kevin Betsy,enough said i think!!
I'm sick of him blaming the players after every defeat,after all he picks the team and chooses the tactics so why is it not his fault?
Hayes gave him a long contract which we can't afford to end and he knows it so why would he quit? He will pick up a pay packet throughout the season even for being crap at his job,would this happen to anyone working in a factory or office,of course not they would be sacked without a pay-off and so should he!
The final reason i want him out is the disgraceful treatment of Kevin Betsy,enough said i think!!
Hmmm i dont like waddock thats well known but i have to say im in agreement with JS on this one.
The situation is not ideal, there has been a lot of turmoil at the club and by changing manager that is not going to help.
Yes, performances particularly defensive performances are horrendous, tactics and substituions are somewhat non existant - ill never forget the brentford match last season one sub made in the final minute and we were truly awful. But we need stability for the time being and unless there is a serious risk to losing our football league status then we have to perservere.
The situation is not ideal, there has been a lot of turmoil at the club and by changing manager that is not going to help.
Yes, performances particularly defensive performances are horrendous, tactics and substituions are somewhat non existant - ill never forget the brentford match last season one sub made in the final minute and we were truly awful. But we need stability for the time being and unless there is a serious risk to losing our football league status then we have to perservere.
we should have got rid of waddock half way through last season because of the reasons already stated,he asked us to judge him when he had a full season in charge,he failed dismally.we all knew we were in for a tough season this year because of the takeover and lack of funds but the fact remains waddock is clueless as what to do for the best.at this moment in time we need to survive in the football league and i hope we do ,we can't afford to get rid of waddock at the moment ,i just pray we still have our football league status at the start of next season and if we do then is the time to bring in kieth scott.
Couldn't agree more - His decision making never ceases to amaze me. Just think we need to ride out the storm, and wait until we can afford to pay him off, which in all likihood is not going to be this season. I don't think we will get relegated but it could get mighty close. Can't see where goals are going to come from and can't see us keeping many clean sheets.
the fact that waddock doesn't like leon could cost us dear,he is one of our better defenders but gets treated like **** by waddock,i don't know what has happened between them but it needs sorting out,leon appears to be down the pecking order at the moment and that needs to change if we are to remain a football league club
Guywanderer
Well-Known Member
As Steve Hayes gets the money from the sell on clause's from Phillips, Harris and Ibe if we sack Waddock Hayes should foot the bill
As for Leon Waddock doesn't like defending
As for Leon Waddock doesn't like defending
Doesn't this sound familier? Kevin Betsy and Scott Redell fell out with Waddock and were moved on.It seems to me that he thinks he is more important than the players and what's best for the club.Arrogant b*****D!
A sensible well thought out post JS. I personally am not a fan of Waddock but he has done well in this league before. However my concern is that we appear to have a toothless unimaginative and very slow team. To say it is highly unlikely we will get relegated I am not so sure. Aside from at York we have been dreadful.
We were saved today by the fluke of an own goal and some good keeping from Bull. We had nothing in midfield at any point in the game and against a team with quick forwards we will get murdered. Doherty is looking like the donkey Charlton warned us of not the player on loan from last year. Leon, used to be good but is now past it and is not the answer. We cannot keep clean sheets and have sold our only means of regular goals.
Whilst it maybe hasty to sack now how long do you leave it? 10 games? 20 games? Yes he has 2 years on his contract but what is more expensive paying him off or getting relegated?!
I just can't see where goals or performances will come from. I can't see which players will step up and win us games. Can you see us ever regularly scoring more than one or even one?
We were saved today by the fluke of an own goal and some good keeping from Bull. We had nothing in midfield at any point in the game and against a team with quick forwards we will get murdered. Doherty is looking like the donkey Charlton warned us of not the player on loan from last year. Leon, used to be good but is now past it and is not the answer. We cannot keep clean sheets and have sold our only means of regular goals.
Whilst it maybe hasty to sack now how long do you leave it? 10 games? 20 games? Yes he has 2 years on his contract but what is more expensive paying him off or getting relegated?!
I just can't see where goals or performances will come from. I can't see which players will step up and win us games. Can you see us ever regularly scoring more than one or even one?
Excellent post JS. Basically agree with all you say but have the following comments.
1. My immediate reaction would be we can't afford to sack him but, as Finchey says, "What is the more costly?" Interesting question; unfortunately I couldn't even hazard a guess.
2. Sure Scotty as manager would be a risk. But, isn't that how we started with MON? I don't think he came with qualifications of any note as a manager. Personally I'm not one to be impressed by CVs and qualifications, things that can be made to look better than they are. We've had some right ******s come here with supposedly glowing CVS. Much more interested in aptitude for the job, passion, drive, ability to motivate and, with our budget, would rather risk someone with these qualities (at a price we can afford) than (say) someone who has managed to get a job with a team from a higher division. Alan Smith and John Gregory spring to mind.
I'm not sure that we can be confident of staying up this season to be honest. If things continue to deteriorate then maybe some calculations should be at the ready in order to assess the feasibilty of the sacking option.
We were mostly happy to drop down to NL status rather that carry on under Hayes so, in some respects, we should be happy we are where we are and just hope we can stay up under Waddock and review the situation when his contract expires.
I wouldn't make any rash decisions just yet but if it could be shown that turning to a lesser experienced, dedicated manager (eg Scott, Brown) could be financially advantageous, maybe this is an option for further consideration between now and Christmas.
1. My immediate reaction would be we can't afford to sack him but, as Finchey says, "What is the more costly?" Interesting question; unfortunately I couldn't even hazard a guess.
2. Sure Scotty as manager would be a risk. But, isn't that how we started with MON? I don't think he came with qualifications of any note as a manager. Personally I'm not one to be impressed by CVs and qualifications, things that can be made to look better than they are. We've had some right ******s come here with supposedly glowing CVS. Much more interested in aptitude for the job, passion, drive, ability to motivate and, with our budget, would rather risk someone with these qualities (at a price we can afford) than (say) someone who has managed to get a job with a team from a higher division. Alan Smith and John Gregory spring to mind.
I'm not sure that we can be confident of staying up this season to be honest. If things continue to deteriorate then maybe some calculations should be at the ready in order to assess the feasibilty of the sacking option.
We were mostly happy to drop down to NL status rather that carry on under Hayes so, in some respects, we should be happy we are where we are and just hope we can stay up under Waddock and review the situation when his contract expires.
I wouldn't make any rash decisions just yet but if it could be shown that turning to a lesser experienced, dedicated manager (eg Scott, Brown) could be financially advantageous, maybe this is an option for further consideration between now and Christmas.
i think waddock could be given time, but how much time do we give him? some managers would have been sacked after the first relegation, theres 2 or 3 times last season when i though GW would go. now weve gone down again, where do we draw the line? relegation wont happen, but our realistic aim should have been the play offs. id give him more time but he is on very very thin ice now
from what i saw on the pitch today relegation is not out of the question and if we drop into the bottom 3 i think the trust will review the management situation again .we shouldn't panic just yet but i do think waddock has 4 or 5 games to get some results or his days as our manager will end
You may be right rocky we can't afford many more performances like that the midfield looked especially weak only Gaz coming on improved the situation.
the lack of a proper right back hasn't helped the balance of the team,yesterday we missed blooms badly but the main worry is i just can't see where the goals are gonna come from.the confidence of the team has gone and that is a worry, we are in a rut and the manager needs to sort it out very quickly.now is the time for waddock to find another loan signing up front which in the past he has done very well,whether we have the funds in the coffers to do that i don't know
I agree Rocky, relegation is not out of the question and, unless something is done soon, is more of a probability. It appears we had one goal attempt all match and that wasn't on target. In the previous game I said we had a load of goal shy strikers and that appears to have been confirmed.
We have to remember the situation we were in with Hayes and be thankful that is history, even if that means NL football for a while. If we aren't good enough for L2 so be it. But I don't think that is the problem. We must be good enough with the team we have. Maybe they aren't putting in 100% effort. Under the new ownership I was expecting drastic cuts in budget but for the players to be treating every game as an important cup match, fighting for every ball, sprinting out of defence in numbers to score on the break; something to give fans belief in the commitment and something to cheer, even if we do lose.
Last season I was fairly adamant that the main problem was morale, caused by the cloud of uncertainty surrounding Hayes' motives etc. Now he has gone there should be a new lease of life and a survival instinct. Where is it? I'm becoming more inclined to agree with those who blamed Waddock, and there lies a problem.
1. Presumably, we can't afford to sack him but maybe some sums should be done to verify that
2. No-one is going to come for him with a relegation and current form on his CV. That would have been some kind of let out as it would not cost
3. He has a family to support so he's hardly likely to put himself out of a job
So it could be that we have a manager who doesn't really want to be here but has a duty as a bread winner to hold out until the end of his contract. If that is the case there is nothing worse than someone who has mentally left the club but is physically still there due to circumstances and the club should be thinking hard about the feasibility of sacking him. If they can work something out based on certain assumptions (eg he will go at the end of his contract, a replacement will cost £x less for the remainder of the contract term, change in revenue as a result of relegation), then he should be given 6 games to turn things round. With this "kick up the arse" it should be quite clear after just 2 or 3 games whether he has the ability/inclination to succeed.
We have to remember the situation we were in with Hayes and be thankful that is history, even if that means NL football for a while. If we aren't good enough for L2 so be it. But I don't think that is the problem. We must be good enough with the team we have. Maybe they aren't putting in 100% effort. Under the new ownership I was expecting drastic cuts in budget but for the players to be treating every game as an important cup match, fighting for every ball, sprinting out of defence in numbers to score on the break; something to give fans belief in the commitment and something to cheer, even if we do lose.
Last season I was fairly adamant that the main problem was morale, caused by the cloud of uncertainty surrounding Hayes' motives etc. Now he has gone there should be a new lease of life and a survival instinct. Where is it? I'm becoming more inclined to agree with those who blamed Waddock, and there lies a problem.
1. Presumably, we can't afford to sack him but maybe some sums should be done to verify that
2. No-one is going to come for him with a relegation and current form on his CV. That would have been some kind of let out as it would not cost
3. He has a family to support so he's hardly likely to put himself out of a job
So it could be that we have a manager who doesn't really want to be here but has a duty as a bread winner to hold out until the end of his contract. If that is the case there is nothing worse than someone who has mentally left the club but is physically still there due to circumstances and the club should be thinking hard about the feasibility of sacking him. If they can work something out based on certain assumptions (eg he will go at the end of his contract, a replacement will cost £x less for the remainder of the contract term, change in revenue as a result of relegation), then he should be given 6 games to turn things round. With this "kick up the arse" it should be quite clear after just 2 or 3 games whether he has the ability/inclination to succeed.
I don't think it's a case of Waddock not caring it is his ability as a manager I would question! I don't believe that he gives anything but 100% to the job. Managers do not want to fail.
Not having seen the last couple of matches, were the players giving 100%? With just one attempt on goal in the last game, I don't see how they could be. Surely there must have been chances to break out of defence in numbers which could have at least resulted in a goal attempt. We must have pacey players who can break fast out of defence (together) and get back quickly when the attack breaks down. This sort of effort can cause trouble to any team. When any of our players get the ball, how many other players are moving into spaces, wanting the ball, to give him options. It isn't rocket science. It seems to me that there is a lack of (effective) effort, lack of confidence, lack of understanding. Oh dear we are just ****ing useless.