Match Day Thread Liverpool V Man Utd - Premier League

[InBiscanWeTrust]

Not asking to be convinced just wanted a conversation haha.

I would like someone who isn't a man u fan tell me why he is this great player because i just dont see it. And im not one to just hate man u players for the sake of it, i know when players are great and can agree with it.

He clearly has the attributes and potential to be WC. He was dominant in Italy at a young age (although league was nearly as one sided as the frenh league).

Confortable on the ball, athletic, can make a pass. Scored goals for Juve as well. I think he's just got a. It lazy at Juve. He didn't really need to run around a lot and defend, just played like Yaya Toure, but can't do that in the Prem.

 

[saintanton]

He clearly has the attributes and potential to be WC. He was dominant in Italy at a young age (although league was nearly as one sided as the frenh league).

Confortable on the ball, athletic, can make a pass. Scored goals for Juve as well. I think he's just got a. It lazy at Juve. He didn't really need to run around a lot and defend, just played like Yaya Toure, but can't do that in the Prem.

Yaya got away with playing like Yaya for some time.

 

[THE FOOL]

He clearly has the attributes and potential to be WC. He was dominant in Italy at a young age (although league was nearly as one sided as the frenh league).

Confortable on the ball, athletic, can make a pass. Scored goals for Juve as well. I think he's just got a. It lazy at Juve. He didn't really need to run around a lot and defend, just played like Yaya Toure, but can't do that in the Prem.

Is that 90m of footballer though, i think the lad has bought into his own hype and now he is in a fast paced league, suddenly he doesn't look to good.
It like the best player in school turning out for the counties and suddenly realising hes not the fastest and most skillful player in the world

 

[InBiscanWeTrust]

Is that 90m of footballer though, i think the lad has bought into his own hype and now he is in a fast paced league, suddenly he doesn't look to good.
It like the best player in school turning out for the counties and suddenly realising hes not the fastest and most skillful player in the world

No... but if anyone worth £30m? Just because he was expensive doesn't make him not a very good player.

 

[saintanton]

The whole "ranking players by their price" routine is pointless. Nobody can say a £50m player is 5 times better than a £10m one.
Clubs that can afford it will pay whatever is necessary to get what they think they need. The player can't be lumbered with the burden of a price he had nothing to do with.
Whether or not he constitutes value for money is another matter.
No doubt Diego will toddle along soon to explain this complex issue to the rest of us ignoramuses.

 

[THE FOOL]

No... but if anyone worth £30m? Just because he was expensive doesn't make him not a very good player.

Im not saying he isnt very good, i think hes a good quality midfielder, however if you put him up against some of the prems best midfielders of the past, i dont see why he is quite so hyped as he is. Hes not quite defensive enough to compare to makaele, hes not attacking enough to compare to scholes, and he isnt good enough all round to stand next to veira.

There are plenty of decent to good centre mids out there, which is what he looks like at the minute. Im not arsed what he cost, he just doesn't look a world beater.

 

[InBiscanWeTrust]

Im not saying he isnt very good, i think hes a good quality midfielder, however if you put him up against some of the prems best midfielders of the past, i dont see why he is quite so hyped as he is. Hes not quite defensive enough to compare to makaele, hes not attacking enough to compare to scholes, and he isnt good enough all round to stand next to veira.

There are plenty of decent to good centre mids out there, which is what he looks like at the minute. Im not arsed what he cost, he just doesn't look a world beater.

But he's played 7 games of football? Way to early to make any kind of judgement call on him. Fact he is proven top quality in Italy over 4 years is a better way to judge him.

 

[THE FOOL]

But he's played 7 games of football? Way to early to make any kind of judgement call on him. Fact he is proven top quality in Italy over 4 years is a better way to judge him.

There has been more top quality player imported from italy that have flopped, than been successful,
The Seria A is so different from the prem, its hard to make a comparison, style pace and tactics are all very different, plus quality is no wher near the same through out the league.

Its no suprise that prem imports are usually from germany or spain, where the leagues hold some similarity.

i was top scorer in pontins in southport for 3 years straight, doesn't make me any good.

 

[Diego]

The whole "ranking players by their price" routine is pointless. Nobody can say a £50m player is 5 times better than a £10m one.
Clubs that can afford it will pay whatever is necessary to get what they think they need. The player can't be lumbered with the burden of a price he had nothing to do with.
Whether or not he constitutes value for money is another matter.
No doubt Diego will toddle along soon to explain this complex issue to the rest of us ignoramuses.

I actually think you have explained it very well

 

[astro]

But he's played 7 games of football? Way to early to make any kind of judgement call on him. Fact he is proven top quality in Italy over 4 years is a better way to judge him.

He also had 3 years at Man Utd before Fergie had his £89m strop, so let's not pretend he's a newcomer adjusting to an unfamiliar league.

He's just an above average player at a below average club, that's all.

 

[saintanton]

I actually think you have explained it very well

Funnily enough, I don't recall you concurring when I made a similar point in defence of Big Ben.

 

[Diego]

Funnily enough, I don't recall you concurring when I made a similar point in defence of Big Ben.

Can't remember that discussion but would imagine it concerned more than price

 

[moreinjuredthanowen]

But he's played 7 games of football? Way to early to make any kind of judgement call on him. Fact he is proven top quality in Italy over 4 years is a better way to judge him.

Well said. A top player imo. Nobody else was matching that fee and it looked a bit desperate but in the end utd got their man.

 

[saintanton]

Can't remember that discussion but would imagine it concerned more than price

Nah. It's rarely a discussion, more a slagging off session. Wums, as usual, were queueing up to have a dig at us for paying the price we did, and coming out with usual "he's not worth it", "waste of money" stuff.
Same thing applied to him - not his fault how others value him. Of course he wasn't a good buy, but that was for reasons of appropriateness, not price.
It remains to be seen whether or not Pogba is any good or not.

 

[Diego]

Nah. It's rarely a discussion, more a slagging off session. Wums, as usual, were queueing up to have a dig at us for paying the price we did, and coming out with usual "he's not worth it", "waste of money" stuff.
Same thing applied to him - not his fault how others value him. Of course he wasn't a good buy, but that was for reasons of appropriateness, not price.
It remains to be seen whether or not Pogba is any good or not.

Wouldn't have been me then, I happen to think Benteke is a very good player and worth £30m in today's market.
I am more likely to take the piss out of the fact you couldn't use him correctly

 

[saintanton]

Wouldn't have been me then, I happen to think Benteke is a very good player and worth £30m in today's market.
I am more likely to take the piss out of the fact you couldn't use him correctly

It's not that we couldn't use him correctly, it's that he didn't fit the style of play we want and we should never have bought him, that's all.
I think he's very good at what he does, and I'm happy that he's found a more appropriate set-up for himself now. He'll probably go back to scoring a ****load against us now.
Anyway, Utd are probably the last club to be mocking others for spending big on players who don't work out, so .

 

[astro]

Wouldn't have been me then, I happen to think Benteke is a very good player and worth £30m in today's market.
I am more likely to take the piss out of the fact you couldn't use him correctly

What part of him winning us 13 PL points and reaching 2 cup finals indicates we couldn't use him correctly?

 

[Diego]

What part of him winning us 13 PL points and reaching 2 cup finals indicates we couldn't use him correctly?

Maybe the fact that you benched him and couldn't wait to get rid?

Who was the highest PL point earner in your squad last season anyway?

 

[astro]

Maybe the fact that you benched him and couldn't wait to get rid?

Who was the highest PL point earner in your squad last season anyway?

Just because you want to sell your Honda and spend more time with your Bugatti doesn't mean you couldn't use it

Don't know but Firmino's 16 goals and assists only won 11 points

 

[Diego]

Just because you want to sell your Honda and spend more time with your Bugatti doesn't mean you couldn't use it

Don't know but Firmino's 16 goals and assists only won 11 points

Just seems a little strange that a club would sell it's highest points earner, unless of course he was the most valuable to sell [HASHTAG]#assetstripping[/HASHTAG]