Personally I think you make a couple of great points RWB. Where you talk about 'group think' I think this sort of thing is a common yet unrecognised issue. Going back to feminism, I see time and again, this extreme feminist movement purporting to speak on behalf of all women, usually against all men. In reality, they do not represent all women, and do not argue for things all women want. That's aside from them tending to throw all men into the same hole. Unfortunately though, theyve got the wind behind them because they stand for something we've all been told is a rightuous and legitimate movement, and we firstly don't challenge them because we dont generally comsider that in spite of their status as representing good against evil, what they migt actually be saying is a load of malicious horse ****, and secondly because if we do realise it's a load of malicious horse ****, we're too scared to say anything anyway, and too scared not to do what they tell us to do. And i say again, that's not just men, that's also other women. This small group of leftist aggresive women, are dictating society and behaviour to us all. And that really deals with the second point of yours i was referring to above as well, namely standing up to the mob. And whilst i dont necessarily agree with you that the educated have become the mob, i do agree that theyve become so scared of the mob that they are unable and unwilling to stand up to it. Because the mob has become so strong, through it's influence, through the press,mthrough the way we have been taught we have to behave, that noone dares stand against it any more.
Discriminates against stupid and ugly people though. And joking aside, I think a lot of that is what feminism is about. If every woman was physically beautiful, I dont think here would even be a feminist movement tbh. And as much as the feminists scream and shout about men, i think in reality their frustration is at least as much against beautiful women. Sure, therell be some beuatiful women who get caught up in the hype, but the diehards i reckon are partly just ****ing jealous. NOTE : IM TALKING OFF THE HIP HERE. THIS DOES NOT FORM A PART OF MY FORMAL PRESENTATION.
Plenty of avenues for good-looking young men on TV. Plenty. Plenty of avenues for mediocre-looking men, plenty of avenues for old, ugly men. There is simply not many avenues for ugly old women to get onto TV. Didn't Mary Beard, a hugely qualified expert and fantastic communicator and educator, get loads of **** for daring to be on TV whilst being female, old and not attractive? It's pathetic. You seriously cannot argue that TV is not a place for men who look like, well, anything really and women who are much more likely to need to be young and beautiful. How many male sports presenters or newsreaders or breakfast show hosts are really attractive? And how many women? (I'll give you a clue - the figure for women will be around 100%). I wouldn't want my step-daughter or neices to think that to be on TV in any capacity the first thing is they need to be very beautiful and so maybe getting a boob-job that will titilate the producer is more important than really learning their stuff and getting good at their job.
Gloria honeybum, or whatever her ****ing name is, still infests my tv screen. They don't get much older and uglier than that!..
Ive got this point of yours Len in my (still incomplete - as yet skeleton - response). And i'll be honest with you, a lot of female news presenters, are ****ing ****, and would never have a ****ing job at all if they were a bloke ! (know you wont apprecoate the laugh, but **** it it's late). But coming back to rachael riley, what makes you say that this is a feminist issue ? Why does he fact that a woman have the job show discrimination against women ?
This comment will make me look very sexist and very racist. I assure you i am neither. But i'll tell you this. I dont think I have ever in my life seen a white male news presenter who is **** at presenting the news.
Okay. With all due respect - when the "If all women were fit there wouldn't be feminism" or "they're just jealous" thing comes out I'm done discussing this. FYI I've friends who are feminists who most of you would cut your dicks off to just sit next to on a bus in the pathetic hope that they might accidentally touch your leg or look at you. If a man who was as ugly as Mary Beard presented a documentary on Ancient Rome there would not be a single comment about his looks. I know this because it happens every day. Probably every hour of every day. It is a massive *thing* for a woman to not be physically attractive to men and yet be (horror!) in the public eye. That is ****ed up, it's stupid and I do not want to excuse it or encourage it. **** that. See you in a couple of centuries when conversations like this will be laughable. Men are having their lives dictated to by feminists? Sorry but I just can't handle this pathetic, self-pitying MRA cry-baby stuff any more. It's horse-****. Sorry but it is. As I said before - this stuff is not intellectual to me. It's not about stories I read about in the paper a year ago or some fantasy about how the world is out to get me despite my belonging to literally THE most privileged demographic the world has ever seen. It's about wanting those I love (and myself) to be treated fairly and intelligently.
Ok, if you want to make an excuse to bail out, that's obviously up to you. And I apologose if I caused offence. But where does the sexism come in when a good looking woman is given a tv job over - for example - a man. Youve argued that tv presenters are wither ugly old men, or young attractive women. To me that disrciminates against ugle and old woman, and young and good looking blokes. On what basis do you say it discriminates against all women, and not against any men ? Is that not a fair question ?
What about stand up comedy then ? Almost all the top stand up comics - live and on tv, are men. Why is that ? What barriers are stopping women being the top stand up comedians ?
Men are better at being brash, showy, vulgar, rude, overbearing etc. When women do it, it seems false. Most modern day comedy relies on causing some degree of discomfort and embarrassment. Men do it better. Looking an comedy from the past, the best comedians were great at being dumb fools. Men are naturally dumb fools.
That's consistently not what i've said. I've consistently said that a minority of (largely) women, is dictating the culture to all - male and female. And it's not about being intellectual. This isn't an intellectual issue. It's about saying it how it is. Yes, but your obsession, and the feminist movement's obsession about demographics is one of the main problems here. Equality movements were about forgetting demographics. The problem is that while those who were originally told demographics shouldnt exist have accepted the point and moved on, those who originated the message ar clinging on to the concept of demographics like a religion.
Not now. In the past, comedians were usually the fool (from George Formby, Rob Wilton etc to Bobby Davro and his ilk).There was Bernard Manning whose routine was based on being offensive in a tongue in cheek way. Modern comedians are in your face in the same style whilst trying to avoid being overtly racist, sexist or homophobic. There are some good female comedians (Sarah Millican, for example), but it's often a self deprecating humour.
So why is men being good at being stupid, relevant to why most leading comedians now are men ? Btw, why is it acceptable to say that men are good at being (insert chosen criticism eg brash, stupid), but not acceptable to say that men are good at (insert chosen compliment) ? In your opinion.
It's like some science fiction film talking to the americans readers They cant help but be offended by a sllliiiightly unsanitised world, yet at the same time, they cant help being sliiightly fascinated by it The naughty ones anyway And that's why Lenny will be back
Once again, I'd say that being stupid was the blueprint for being a comedian in the past, not now. The modern trend is for observation and wit. Some of it is not very sophisticated and it helps to be loud, in your face etc. It comes down to social mores. We don't expect women to be loud or brash. Most women aren't. Men and women have different behavioural characteristics. That's not an issue about equality - it's a fact that men and women behave differently in society. If the trend is for people to laugh at the likes of Lee Mack being loud, animated, confrontational etc in presenting his observations on life, then it's unlikely there will be the same openings for women in stand up. The question asked related to why there are few women stand up comedians. The answer is not an endorsement of male domination of the genre, but an observation on why it is so. Why do more women dominate jobs in child care? Surely, men can cope with small children?
Now.....as Inspector Clouseau would say...we are getting somewhere. I'll come back to this Re comedians btw : I don't think Chaplin, Keaton etc were stupid. They might have acted stupid, but I doubt they actually were - far from it. As it happens, I think most stand up comedians would probably be great leaders * * except for david baddiel.
No, they were far from stupid, but they played the clown. Society was happy for men to be clowns. It would have been abhorrent for women to be portrayed in this way. Comedy is actually one of those subjects where our social attitudes and beliefs - particularly about issues such as sexism, gender equality etc - are challenged. Often the laugh is obtained from our discomfort at the realisation of how close-minded, prejudiced, discriminatory etc are views are.
