What tosh!!! Are you really stupid enough to think that BOTH sides didn't distort the facts to suit their campaign? To say that people didn't have a clue what they were voting for is, frankly patronising. If you want to go down that route, the same could be said for those that voted remain. It is odd that ALL the inflammatory remarks made since the DEMOCRATIC process was completed have come from the losing side. Tough ****, move on FFS!
The people who didn't vote, I believe there were 13 million of them, should be ashamed of themselves. Not voting does not imply that they were happy with the status quo imo. Sorry mate, but this WAS democratic. You seem to be implying that the people should never be trusted in a referendum. The result is beyond question and we now need to get o n with it.
The sad fact is BOTH sides were telling lies and exaggerating all the way through the campaign, it was one of the most negative and vitriolic campaigns in memory. The lies worked both ways, many people would have been frightened by the Government's scaremongering and threats so to make out it was a one-way street is being selective. Had the result been the other way round there wouldn't have been anywhere near the histrionics we've seen the last couple of days, probably only UKIP and far-right groups would have been bleating as they usually do. As for the turnout, 72% is extremely high and it is a simple majority that wins. If 28% of those eligible can't be arsed to vote that's their problem, it doesn't mean they all believe we should remain. As for those you say didn't have a clue what they were voting for would you like to have an IQ threshold for voting? Perhaps only those with 'A' Levels and above? Democracy can only work one way, through the ballot box and within the rules set down, that's what happened here and the result stands...
Who should have made the decision then? The PM? I that case we would have remained. Had Boris been PM we would be out. Would that suit you? No, of course it wouldn't. Possibly the most ridiculous post on the subject so far.
How do you know who the winners and losers are yet? Plenty of democratic and undemocratic processes to unravel before we know that. Agree, you can't assume that the did not votes would have supported the status quo. However, though it is nearly incomprehensible to me that someone wouldn't vote on an issue like this, it is their democratic right, and frankly if some people have ruled themselves out because they don't care either way or feel they aren't qualified to have an opinion, I'm glad their votes didn't count. Heartily agree about getting on with it. The result is the result.
I said earlier on this thread that in my heart I would vote to leave my my brain tells me to vote to stay. I think many voted with their hearts and not their brains!
Here's something funny, the petition for a second referendum if one side doesn't get 60% and/or turnout is less than 75% was started before the vote by a leave campaigner, "because he thought Remain would win". Unsurprisingly he now finds himself perfectly happy with 51.8% majority and less than 70% turnout, and is telling everyone to respect the vote, without a rerun. Safe to say if the vote had gone the other way a different 3 million would've signed it
I bet you wished you hadn't Frome. However well done for saying your bit and arguments should be heard and respected from all sides. For me i find it strange when reading stuff on twitter and Facebook by people saying "i didn't vote for Brexit so why should i accept it". I would say i didn't vote for that muppet Blair but accepted the democratic process. I also laugh at people saying "we should have left it to the government because some people didn't understand". Like when we let Blair and the other muppets take us into an illegal war ? The campaign was very nasty and i was saddened reading posts from my facebook friends referring to 'leaver's" as thick and racist. The problem is/was that just as many 'in' voters didn't understand it either. It is almost comical the myth going around that Brexit voters googled "what is the EU' the next day. how do know some 10 year didn't google it or someone with a lack of English or even a 'Remain' voter? It is ridiculous that these so called intelligent people who mocked 'Leaver's' as stupid to then flood Twitter/Facebook with this crap. Some 'Remain' voters are calling for a demo march in London. I will tell you what will happen. Many underage people that didn't vote. The usual wasters who turn up for other political things. And the usual riots by these democratic loving people. If people want to blame someone i would suggest they think back a bit because this was caused before Brexit. The country had a vote last time around, Tory (who said there would be a referendum) or Labour who said there wouldn't. Tory and Cameron won. You could argue if you voted Tory and wanted to 'remain' you cannot moan now. Cameron then went to Brussels and told them that much unrest in England was due to EU. That democratic organisation laughed at him and offered nothing. Rather than coming back and saying to the British public "they have given us sh2t" he turned himself into failed politician Neville Chamberlain waving his bit of paper. If he had at the time said this, i am sure many voters would understand. I also think if Cameron had some balls at this time the EU may have offered a deal to shut up many moaners. Cameron then made the mistake by creating 'project fear' and involving hated figures such as Blair and the very grey John Major. Then good old Barack Obama made the 'back of the queue' threat. Followed not too far behind was the camera shy David Beckham, who by the way earns all his dosh in the land of the free. trying to convince us he actually wrote that statement on the EU (sure you did David). The final Straw was using EU leaders to threaten us which really gets people's backs up. These same leaders could have avoided this Brexit if they had been democratic and listened to us. The fact is and this is fact. The EU is run to help big business and make these people richer. It is also geared up to favour Germany. Angela Merkel is the only voice we should listen to because she is the 'Big Boss'. I am no racist, I love Europe and people that know me will tell you i spend a great deal of time there. Last year i spent 3 months of the 12 in France. I cringed when i saw Farage in Westminster with his thugs behind him. Some strange times ahead
Yes I did, but I was making a point. Your opinion came out on top, that's fine, but all your work lies ahead of you. It's fine sounding off against people who are unhappy with what happened on an Internet forum, but in the real world the people who lead the Brexit campaign have to work out firstly how they form a government, and secondly how they represent the whole country. And I think it is pretty evident that some of the things which will happen are beyond the control of our or any other government. Enjoy your moment in the sun, look to the future which involves us all, not just the 'winners'. Grace in victory mate, I have no choice but to trust people who share your views with large elements of my future and more importantly my kids' futures. I'm not interested in reruns, petitions, Scotland trying to block Brexit, I'm interested in what happens next. Two days in and I don't have the faintest idea of what we are trying to achieve, who will represent me in trying to achieve it, or how long it will take. Forgive me, I'm an impatient and probably unrealistic man, but I do think somebody high up in the Brexit team should be able to say how they want this to play out, even if they may not be in a position to ultimately deliver it (and I can't blame them for that).
As I have said in a earlier post, I am a little scared of the future, so whilst I have a moment in the sun, it is to be savoured rather than enjoyed. I have grace in defeat as well as victory, the same cannot be said for a large number of those who wished to remain. Yourself excluded I hasten to add.
Sb your comments are worthy and understandable. The main Brexit players we all know now will probably not be around in 2 years. Many tories don't want Boris. Many people will not want to see Farage. New players will come to the front. As we speak the labour party is self-destructing. There will be a lot of uncertainty in the coming Months (maybe years) and i feel for all of us Remain/leave voters. There is certainly no gloating from me. I am just like the rest of us concerned about our future.
Look I'm a big boy now, and no Mr Shefford I'm not stupid, I know we've just got to get on with it but two days after the result I'm certainly not going to apologise for still feeling a bit raw about it. I can only speak from my own personal experience and the leave voters I've spoken to either didn't consider their decision properly or genuinely didn't understand what they were voting for, I'm not saying that is reflected across all leave voters because clearly it isn't but it is what I have experienced. As for the deceitful campaign, well it was paraded around on the side of the big red fun bus and was a fundamental part of the leave strategy to win votes, which it did. So for Farage and co to be rapidly distancing themselves from those words almost the second the result was in I think is disgraceful as they will have played a major part in the result. Obviously I voted remain so that colours my stance somewhat and it is disingenuous of me to suggest (although I don't think I did) that there wasn't also stupidity and bending of the truth on the remain side of the fence. But when a lie is one of the main selling points of a campaign and an intentionally emotive one I find it hard to accept. Democracy isn't necessarily at fault but I do strongly believe the undecided and the less engaged have been maliciously preyed upon.For the record I thought the remain campaign was poor but I still think remain was the right choice for me.
So, the disgraceful, atrocious behaviour of those in the remain camp after the murder of Jo Cox wasn't emotive? THAT for me is the worst piece of electioneering I have ever seen. Those scumbags should hang their heads in shame.
I wasn't aware of anyone using that tragic event for gain on either side. The media did all the linking there as far as I can tell. The leave campaign did fly a plane dragging a Vote Leave sign over her memorial event though so if you want to talk disgraceful behaviour there you go.
Convenient. The leave banner was flown over LONDON you fool. It could be seen for miles. How is that a DIRECT attempt at using Jo Coxs' murder as electioneering? More inflammatory rubbish.
