Off Topic Politics Thread

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- Doing The Lambert Walk said:
ITV: "Labour voters are split on the EU and many voters don't actually know where the party stands on this, with three weeks to go can you honestly say that everyone is aware and you have campaigned as well as you can?" - (para)

Corbyn: "Well it's partly down to how much the media report what the Labour Party says..."


<laugh>
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Channel 4: “You’ve spoken about how you’re opposed to TTIP, if that deal had already been signed would you still be campaigning for a remain vote?”



Corbyn: “That’s a hypothetical question if I may say so…”



Channel 4: “And you could say that’s weak support…”



Corbyn: “…no, it’s just telling you it’s a hypothetical question, actually.”
 
You can see why Sadiq Khan wasn't desperate to secure Jeremy Corbyn's support.

But surely this referendum trancends party loyalties? Certainly does in the conservative party, where they're all fighting like rats in a sack.
 
Whiteley Saint said:
Oh dear Jeremy Corbin is a principled man with strong ideals and for that he should be admired (even though I don't agree with a lot of what he says) but unfortunately a leader he is not.
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Pretty much my view. British politics is pretty grim right now and there's not much leadership material among the lot of them.

Politics needs more Corbyn's, though. And by that, I mean more principled and genuine people who actually believe what they're saying.

But yes, a leader of people he is not.
 
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- Doing The Lambert Walk said:
Pretty much my view. British politics is pretty grim right now and there's not much leadership material among the lot of them.

Politics needs more Corbyn's, though. And by that, I mean more principled and genuine people who actually believe what they're saying.

But yes, a leader of people he is not.
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The trouble is if you want to lead a country compromises have to be made and that sometimes may mean not going with what you believe. You have to look at the bigger picture. If I was a politician I would want to be a backbencher because some things I would strongly want to vote against and in the cabinet/shadow cabinet you have to toe the party line. Jeremy Corbyn is struggling to toe the line I think.
 
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A former aide to Prime Minister David Cameron has been found guilty of possessing and downloading indecent images of children as young as 10.

Patrick Rock, 64, an ex-deputy director of policy at Downing Street, was convicted of five charges and acquitted of three similar counts.

The jury was unable to reach a verdict on the remaining 12 charges.

Rock had admitted downloading 20 images of nine young girls in 2013, but denied they were indecent.

Southwark Crown Court heard the youngest of the girls was 10 years and four months old when Rock, of Fulham, south-west London, downloaded the image - meaning she would have been younger when it was taken.

While none of the girls were naked, prosecutors argued they were in "sexualised" poses in clothing including swimwear and bras.

The court heard Rock downloaded the images at a golf club while on a trip to visit family in the US.

Prosecutor Tom Forster said Rock used the internet specifically at the golf club, away from his family home.

'Morally wrong'
But Sasha Wass, in mitigation, said her client had been in America after his mother had died in order to handle her affairs.

Rock's sister, in a statement read to the court, said at the time of the offences he had been "sad, angry and holding on to the fact he had not been with mum when she died"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36427629
 
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Beefy said:
CALLS were growing tonight for an urgent inquiry into the integrity of the EU referendum amid claims that European citizens are being sent polling cards despite being ineligible to vote.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...e-integrity-as-EU-citizens-sent-polling-cards
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Wouldn't surprise me. I've got a German friend who's (amusingly) received a lot of literature from the Leave campaign. Might just be admin issues in that campaign but it wouldn't surprise me at all if she got a polling card at some point. Presumably they get their names and addresses from some central authority.
 
The debate for in or out has turned into American style debating. I mean by that very little is said about actual policies or reasons more about personalities, just trying to discredit them in the eyes of the voters.
Mostly in this debate one side Says one thing, the other says the opposite and then criticises that person for saying what they have said.
I so wish that someone somewhere could actually tell us something without an Ax to grind. Sadly that is not going to happen as it doesn't matter which side you are leaning towards. There is too many if's and buts' which ever way you look at it.
A lot of us senior citizens remember how well we did outside of the EU. We joined the EU because the thinking then was we could do even better. What was not thought out was the direction of the EU or common Market as it was known then would turn. It has gone more political it has expanded well beyond the thinking of the day and mainly letting the easterly countries join just so they wouldn't turn to the Russians for aid. It is debatable if they actually bring anything to the concept of the original common market.
In the early days when the common market was formed the UK declined to join because of the fears as to the direction it would follow in future years. As events have proved over the last nigh on 50 years. Perhaps a very wise decision.
In the 50's a change of Government decided we could do better in the common market, we were refused entry on the Grounds that we had nothing to bring to the table. Not the exact words true, but the meaning was clear.
The Germans and French dominated the Market and did extremely well out of the arrangement but as the market began to decline they decided we had something to offer after all. So they grudgingly let us join. Then they stopped us trading with the likes of our commonwealth countries without levies. So the likes of New Zealand lost their market for the Lamb and butter. Not part of the original agreement it would seem. Their argument.....they had a butter mountain. Suddenly all the silly little rules started to be implemented, the shape of our Bananas, even the size of them!! I could go on but most will know where I am coming from.
There has been a lot of Scare mongering from the Americans.........(What the heck it has got to do with that lazy lot I do not know) The Germans saying it will be hard to negotiate deals with us......So look out BMW and the like....The French saying similar things too ........so look out Citron and Peugeot.....The Italians.........Hmm well I don't need to say more. Oh and I haven't forgotten the Swedes either...........
I believe the EU have as much to lose by us not being there, if they prefer not to deal with us. There is a bloody great market place out there that at the moment we are not allowed to tap.
I think you have probably guessed my way of thinking we did ok before and we will do ok again by being out of the market. If the Germans or anyone rise up again to conquer Europe then just leave the so called Europeans to sort it out. We lost too many of our young men trying to defend them and I don't wish our country to be involved again.
So for me I'm an out, the EU have interfered enough in my life time and it will only get worse IMO.
 
I'm wondering what effect the EU campaigns will have on the next General Election.
Given that both the in and out campaigns are being dominated by Conservative MPs, and given that so many of the public are voicing concerns at the mudslinging, the extortion of facts and blatant lies, coming from both sides, it could have a big impact on how people vote in a General Election. Especially if there is a snap vote organised for October, as has been suggested, when the lies etc are still fresh in the minds of the electorate.
The weak leadership, of the Labour Party, could be the saviour for the Tories, should this happen.
 
St Badger said:
I'm wondering what effect the EU campaigns will have on the next General Election.
Given that both the in and out campaigns are being dominated by Conservative MPs, and given that so many of the public are voicing concerns at the mudslinging, the extortion of facts and blatant lies, coming from both sides, it could have a big impact on how people vote in a General Election. Especially if there is a snap vote organised for October, as has been suggested, when the lies etc are still fresh in the minds of the electorate.
The weak leadership, of the Labour Party, could be the saviour for the Tories, should this happen.
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I think that's probably part of why it's happening as well. I reckon a lot of Conservative MPs believe they can fight as much as they like at the moment and it won't make the slightest difference.
 
Labour is considering backing the idea of a universal basic income – a radical transformation of the welfare state that would ditch means-tested benefits in favour a flat-rate payment.

John McDonnell, the shadow chancellor, who is keen to find policies to match his slogan of a “new economics,” will appear at the launch of a report on the proposal from the left-wing campaign group Compass in the House of Commons on Monday evening.

McDonnell said the research, “makes an interesting case for a universal and unconditional payment to all which could prepare our country for any revolution in jobs and technology to come – it is an idea Labour will be closely looking at over the next few years”.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics...-basic-income-welfare-benefits-compass-report

It's going to happen. Just a matter of when.
 
This UBI thing is very interesting. The one thing I don't get is what's to stop rents, prices etc rising to the point that you can't live on the UBI. Mind you, the increase would have to be pretty extreme if they used something like the level of payment the Swiss were looking at.
 
Puck said:
This UBI thing is very interesting. The one thing I don't get is what's to stop rents, prices etc rising to the point that you can't live on the UBI. Mind you, the increase would have to be pretty extreme if they used something like the level of payment the Swiss were looking at.
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Doubt they would be able to do that. If rents etc went up crazily then the UBI wouldn't work at all. That would basically be like benefits today not being enough to cover most rents, which would be a disaster.
 
The UK must be the only advanced economy without rent capping. Just got back from New York where there are notices on subway trains announcing that rent increases are currently capped at 2% on two year leases and 0% on leases of 1 year or less. Meanwhile New York State has a minimum wage of $15 an hour. Now Congress has raised the basic salary below which all employees are entitled to an overtime rate of time plus 50% (for each hour worked over 40 per week) to $47500 pa. It has become apparent to me that working oeople are getting royally shafted in the UK.
 
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Beefy said:
Doubt they would be able to do that. If rents etc went up crazily then the UBI wouldn't work at all. That would basically be like benefits today not being enough to cover most rents, which would be a disaster.
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Yeah, that would be my worry. Most (well, a lot of) landlords wouldn't give a **** about whether the welfare system worked if they were able to rake in more cash. Rent controls would probably be the answer but the devil would be in the detail.
 
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