Off Topic The Politics Thread

[GoldhawkRoad]

And with the UK out of the EU, how is that different? Actually, it's far more likely to happen if we leave because the EU won't have a single financial powerhouse if London leaves...

The Eurozone just will not be happy to use London as the single financial powerhouse. It will want a powerful financial centre in the Eurozone, which will compete with London.

If we're out of the EU, and the Eurozone bring in stringent trading regulations that would impact our practices in the City, we would not be bound by them, any more than any other independent country. The City can continue to make money and be governed by City regulators and Parliament.

 

[TootingExcess]

Take an example, Chaz. The Eurozone countries will want the Eurozone to thrive. They need a financial centre, probably Frankfurt, and they will want that to thrive. It will compete with London. France, in particular, has for years been highly jealous of London's success. If the Eurozone passes laws within the EU to boost Frankfurt at the cost of The City of London, there won't be a thing the UK could do about it except complain - and who will listen?

This is an argument to vote Remain Goldie. This will happen if we vote to Leave, some people might think the decline of the City of London to be a good thing, but it's one of the few industries the UK excels in. To voluntarily give up our advantage is madness.

 

[sb_73]

Take an example, Chaz. The Eurozone countries will want the Eurozone to thrive. They need a financial centre, probably Frankfurt, and they will want that to thrive. It will compete with London. France, in particular, has for years been highly jealous of London's success. If the Eurozone passes laws within the EU to boost Frankfurt at the cost of The City of London, there won't be a thing the UK could do about it except complain - and who will listen?

We've discussed this before, and as Chaz says we'd be worse off out if protecting these people is your aim. The Stock Exchange will soon be 50% German or 100% US owned, and the companies which populate the City are multinationals. On other posts you have had a go at 'big business' and multinationals because they largely support staying in the EU. And you are right to, they apply the '**** you buddy' rule, they are interested in what is best for them, not for the UK. Why do you have a different attitude to the City?

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

This is an argument to vote Remain Goldie. This will happen if we vote to Leave, some people might think the decline of the City of London to be a good thing, but it's one of the few industries the UK excels in. To voluntarily give up our advantage is madness.

If we stay in, Tooting, we can have rules imposed on us by the Eurozone that will not be in our best interests but will be in the best interests of the Eurozone - As you correctly infer, the City of London is vital to our prosperity, and those that work there are not just greedy bankers

If we're out, we make our own rules.

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

We've discussed this before, and as Chaz says we'd be worse off out if protecting these people is your aim. The Stock Exchange will soon be 50% German or 100% US owned, and the companies which populate the City are multinationals. On other posts you have had a go at 'big business' and multinationals because they largely support staying in the EU. And you are right to, they apply the '**** you buddy' rule, they are interested in what is best for them, not for the UK. Why do you have a different attitude to the City?

I'm interested in the welfare of all business in the UK, big and small. Big multinationals lobby Brussels and get their own way, and hence are pro staying in. There are plenty of hedge funds in the City that want to come out because they're concerned at the red tape that could be thrown at them. The Eurozone will be in competition with the UK, that's it in essence.

 

[sb_73]

If we stay in, Tooting, we can have rules imposed on us by the Eurozone that will not be in our best interests but will be in the best interests of the Eurozone - As you correctly infer, the City of London is vital to our prosperity, and those that work there are not just greedy bankers

If we're out, we make our own rules.

But if those rules are not exactly the same as the Eurozone rules we are excluded from that market. Which is worth £20bn in exports to us at the moment. I have just read articles in the Telegraph and FT on this and they say exactly the same thing, as does the City of London, any attempt to cut red tape post Brexit would put us on a par with Bolivia in terms of access to EU financial services markets. Though why we would want to reduce regulation on these people who lead us into economic woe with sickening regularity is beyond me. Did you know that the UK tried to stop the EU placing a limit on bankers bonuses of 200% of salary?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...-will-Brexit-mean-for-the-City-of-London.html

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

But if those rules are not exactly the same as the Eurozone rules we are excluded from that market. Which is worth £20bn in exports to us at the moment. I have just read articles in the Telegraph and FT on this and they say exactly the same thing, as does the City of London, any attempt to cut red tape post Brexit would put us on a par with Bolivia in terms of access to EU financial services markets. Though why we would want to reduce regulation on these people who lead us into economic woe with sickening regularity is beyond me. Did you know that the UK tried to stop the EU placing a limit on bankers bonuses of 200% of salary?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...-will-Brexit-mean-for-the-City-of-London.html

I'm not putting the moral case on the City - it needs to be properly regulated here. But trade with the EU represents less than half our exports (I think about 40% and is diminishing by the year). So why would we want to let the Eurozone dictate the rules that apply when we trade with the rest of the world, our expanding market?

 

[sb_73]

I'm not putting the moral case on the City - it needs to be properly regulated here. But trade with the EU represents less than half our exports (I think about 40% and is diminishing by the year). So why would we want to let the Eurozone dictate the rules that apply when we trade with the rest of the world, our expanding market?

It's 44%, and over 50% of all goods. But it is falling. Could that be because we are not competitive? Sadly we are not taking the slack up elsewhere, the trade deficit is growing. In fact the value of exports has declined quite a lot over the last year. Of course, the continued decline in the value of the £ could help the volume of exports, if not the value. But imports will be more expensive, unless we reduce volume there.

Ooh, Liam Fox is launching a petition to stop the Govt leaflet being distributed. Man of action! There is more informed debate on here about the EU than there is amongst these numpties.

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

It's 44%, and over 50% of all goods. But it is falling. Could that be because we are not competitive? Sadly we are not taking the slack up elsewhere, the trade deficit is growing. In fact the value of exports has declined quite a lot over the last year. Of course, the continued decline in the value of the £ could help the volume of exports, if not the value. But imports will be more expensive, unless we reduce volume there.

We're in a semi-recession, so exports are declining worldwide. But as you say, the 66% exports to the rest of the world is going up. This general idea that if we stay in, we can lead the 26 nation Eurozone is implausible imo

 

[sb_73]

We're in a semi-recession, so exports are declining worldwide. But as you say, the 66% exports to the rest of the world is going up. This general idea that if we stay in, we can lead the 26 nation Eurozone is implausible imo

Where do you get 66% from? And who is saying we can lead the Eurozone? We excluded ourselves from that possibility years ago. Our choice.

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

Where do you get 66% from? And who is saying we can lead the Eurozone? We excluded ourselves from that possibility years ago. Our choice.

56%, my mistake. Chaz said "The UK would become the most powerful and influential 'external force' stating an independent case. If anything, it would likely be listened to more than today." I don't see it. He also said London would be the single financial powerhouse. Don't see that either. The Eurozone is going to take on a life of its own if and when it resolves current difficulties. In what, five or ten years? That's why I think you're either in it or competely out.

 

[kiwiqpr]

The 200% bonus limit
Would that just be applied to millionaire bankers
What about any others working in the city not earning squillions who might get a bonus
Will theirs be limited too

 

[sb_73]

56%, my mistake. Chaz said "The UK would become the most powerful and influential 'external force' stating an independent case. If anything, it would likely be listened to more than today." I don't see it. He also said London would be the single financial powerhouse. Don't see that either. The Eurozone is going to take on a life of its own if and when it resolves current difficulties. In what, five or ten years? That's why I think you're either in it or competely out.

I completely agree that we are marginalised now, and this will only become more exaggerated if we stay in, and of course, entirely formalised if we leave. But you still have more ability to protect your interests in than out, just. And either way, Eurozone financial institutions will get stronger, it's inevitable.

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

I completely agree that we are marginalised now, and this will only become more exaggerated if we stay in, and of course, entirely formalised if we leave. But you still have more ability to protect your interests in than out, just. And either way, Eurozone financial institutions will get stronger, it's inevitable.

I think we agree, mostly. It's the "just" that's the difference. I'm on the other side of the line. That's partly why this vote will be so tight. I think it will probably go for Remain because people feel safe with the status quo and this country is not doing badly. But things won't stay the same in the EU, and it's the predictions of where it will be in a decade that divides people.

 

[rangercol]

If ever there was any doubt about how far the tentacles of the EU are curled around every aspect of our lives in the UK, just look at how difficult it would appear to be to free ourselves from their tangled throat hold.
We must start the process of freeing ourselves and becoming a truly independent Country once more, if, as seems fairly clear, there will be a few years of disruption.
Our kids and grandkids will thank us for it!

 

[QPR Oslo]

This is an argument to vote Remain Goldie. This will happen if we vote to Leave, some people might think the decline of the City of London to be a good thing, but it's one of the few industries the UK excels in. To voluntarily give up our advantage is madness.

Madness to leave for very many reasons!

 

[sb_73]

Donald is going all out for the young female vote

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[sb_73]

If ever there was any doubt about how far the tentacles of the EU are curled around every aspect of our lives in the UK, just look at how difficult it would appear to be to free ourselves from their tangled throat hold.
We must start the process of freeing ourselves and becoming a truly independent Country once more, if, as seems fairly clear, there will be a few years of disruption.
Our kids and grandkids will thank us for it!

Any examples of how the EU has its tentacles around your throat Col? With the possible exception of immigration from the EU I cannot think of a single area where leaving would make a noticeable difference to me. Unless it ****s up the economy. 'A few years of disruption' may mean nothing to you, but to others it will put a serious dent in to their standard of living.

 

[Chaz]

56%, my mistake. Chaz said "The UK would become the most powerful and influential 'external force' stating an independent case. If anything, it would likely be listened to more than today." I don't see it. He also said London would be the single financial powerhouse. Don't see that either. The Eurozone is going to take on a life of its own if and when it resolves current difficulties. In what, five or ten years? That's why I think you're either in it or competely out.

I didn't say we would lead the EU. I also didn't say London would be the single financial centre. I said that if we leave, the EU would definately need to build up Frankfurt, but not necessarily if we stay. I don't mind the debate, but don't misquote me please, it belittles your good position.

 

[Uber_Hoop]

Any examples of how the EU has its tentacles around your throat Col? With the possible exception of immigration from the EU I cannot think of a single area where leaving would make a noticeable difference to me. Unless it ****s up the economy. 'A few years of disruption' may mean nothing to you, but to others it will put a serious dent in to their standard of living.

Who's got their testicles around Col's throat? Wait..........what?