Off Topic The SIR Kenny Dalglish Public House

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Tobes said:
A snip at $100k mate. Give them the beans and that range will half btw.
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They start at 70k and then there is 20k off on average for subsidies. After rebates etc , you can probably get it down even more.

Granted they're an expensive car, but that's not really the point. The point is that the technology is there and electrics won't always be "only good enough for 50 mile round trips". We're already way past that (for a cost).


They are planning to make budget friendly cars too but are sticking to luxury cars until the tech gets cheaper... And it will in time.

They don't have the benefits of economies of scale that other manufacturers have. In fact Elon Musk's endgame proposal for the Tesla project was not to make cars but to make powertrains for manufacturers who could build the cars cheaper.


£ for £ a combustion engine still makes more sense in today's world for most people but I think it's incorrect to call it a dead end technology. I fully expect at some point in my lifetime electrics to make up the majority of cars on the road.
 
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moreinjuredthanowen said:
No.. it is battery life in several ways.

1. There is no getting away with the fact that irrespective of charge time you only barely get a commute out of a electric car. If I drove to work and home I would not be able to take someone to an event or go out for the evening or anything.
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Not true anymore with modern electrics.

2. Charge time is 8 hours that is true the fast charge systems can cut it but it drops range
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Doesn't drop range but does lower battery life.


3. Car life is 5 years max and then in effect you trash it as batteries are toast.
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I think they're up to 10 years now... And you don't trash the car, you replace the batteries.

5. Battery disposal is dirty.
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Which is why they're being repurposed in arrays of them for backup electricity for buildings and even experiments going on to use large numbers of them at peak time electrical usage for discounts on power consumption.

Used batteries as used in cars like the Tesla still have a lot of storage ability, they just don't have the oomph to crank a car after 10 years of usage.

The range one visit real. You should get 6-800 miles out of a tank of petrol.
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That's just silly. My 10 gallon tank at 35mpg only gets 350 miles. (approximately a weeks worth of driving). No reason it has to be 600 to 800 miles. Who drives London to Edinburg and back again on a daily basis?

That's US gallons don't remember conversion rate. Tesla have already had one car hit 500 miles on a charge (even though that is not typical). Their range isn't much different to my car now.



I would strongly say that the bad outweighs the good.
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Currently, I would agree, but the technology is improving at a rapid rate.
 
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Milk has gone sour said:
Currently, I would agree, but the technology is improving at a rapid rate.
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I agree.
They wouldn't even be bothered to develop the technology if they didn't think it was going to be viable at some stage.
The problem is that they tend to push new things before they're really practical in order to start dosh coming in to fund further development.
Digital cameras are a prime example of this. The first ones were dismal, they were marketed as the future of photography- future being the operative word.
 
Milk has gone sour said:
Not true anymore with modern electrics.



Doesn't drop range but does lower battery life.




I think they're up to 10 years now... And you don't trash the car, you replace the batteries.



Which is why they're being repurposed in arrays of them for backup electricity for buildings and even experiments going on to use large numbers of them at peak time electrical usage for discounts on power consumption.

Used batteries as used in cars like the Tesla still have a lot of storage ability, they just don't have the oomph to crank a car after 10 years of usage.



That's just silly. My 10 gallon tank at 35mpg only gets 350 miles. (approximately a weeks worth of driving). No reason it has to be 600 to 800 miles. Who drives London to Edinburg and back again on a daily basis?

That's US gallons don't remember conversion rate. Tesla have already had one car hit 500 miles on a charge (even though that is not typical). Their range isn't much different to my car now.





Currently, I would agree, but the technology is improving at a rapid rate.
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Seriously milk... you are talking from your perspective.

Over here in the world of actual fuel efficiency

1. Getting 600 miles out of one tank is not at all impossible. It's actually easy with 50 and 60 mpg diesels.

2. You can't quote one complete top end version which is not built to scale with the average and there are plenty of average Japanese models what are ****.

3. The harsh reality is what you are talking about is people scrambling to make the best of a bad situation to repurpose these batteries. The supply chain and cost means these batteries are far to dirty and far too costly and don't deliver.

4. the future of electric is not really lots of batteries. It's going to be supplanting those batteries with generation technology. Hydrogen fuel cells offer a far better way to go imo.

5. The whole point on range is flexibility. I don't need to drive 600 miles in one go. I need to be able to drive to work and back without plugging in and then need to be able to say ok... I'm taking you to the doctor or hospital without needing to hope the thing will make it... I can in short take 4 days between refueling and take 2mins to refuel.

Finally the other argument about cost electric lovers make is interesting as they consistently ignore duty on fuel and when electric supplant petrol we all know what governments will do to us.

The facts are electric drive trains are better than internal combustion but the batteries are total **** for many reasons so I can see battery becoming much smaller and used as a capacitor between the power generation and the motor
 
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