Refugees Welcome

Care to explain why?

 

We don't need to welcome any of them. They're welcome to safety, homes and decent lives all over Eastern Europe in Hungary, Poland, Slovakia, Slovenia etc. but they don't want to go there. They all want to come to the UK, Germany, France and Scandinavia. I wonder why.

Also notice how many of them are out there wearing designer gear, brand new Nike trainers, decent jewellery etc.

They've been offered good homes, they said no, **** em.

 

Turkey, Saudi Arabia, UAE - all safe nearby countries with similar culture.

 

Yes, you are comparing apples and pears. For a start Britain had a standing army, air force and still a formidable navy in 1939. We were also rearming from the mid 30s and we had the support of a number of commonwealth countries. Given all that, the US joined our side.

Many Brits did clear off to the US and Canada - well, those that could afford it.

The Syrians caught in this conflict are wedged between being blown to bits by their own countries standing army on one side and ISIS on the other and on their soil. When you say stand and fight, then who against and what with exactly?

You cannot equate the two events in any reasonable way at all.

 

You can't compare benefits cheats and tax evasion / benefitting from contracts issued to party supporters. Benefit cheating is such a tiny fraction it isn't an issue
Housing shortage? Look no further than buy to let and corporations sitting on land waiting for a quick buck. Plenty empty houses too actually
And I can't imagine a few thousand refugees noticeably affecting the rail and road infrastructure either.
So yes I think we, collectively, should help them

 

To be fair, Lebanon, Turkey and Jordan have a lot of Syrian and Palestinian refugees. In fact, most Syrian refugees are in neighbouring Middle Eastern countries. Britain should take more refugees from Syria as it is a crisis and our numbers are embarrassingly low compared to other European countries. That being said, accepting hundreds of thousands of refugees is a short term response to a long term problem. Syria's politically unstable due to the civil war. Either we support Assad like Iran and Russia are doing to combat ISIS or we continue to go against both Assad and ISIS and train/arm moderate rebels.

 

The other Arab nations will not allow them in without a visa and that is strictly controlled. As we trade with them our PM should be putting the pressure on them, many groups within SA are trying to push their government to take them in. Though I wouldn't hold my breath on that one.

 

Well, there are more Syrian refugees than Assad's army and ISIS combined. Best bet would be to support and arm the moderate rebels and Kurds against both or negotiate with Assad and have Russia, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia, the UK and the US all brought to the table.

 

I quite agree with you on most of this tbh - the Buy-to-Let and Housing Corporation thing has become a joke, (or would have done except it isn't funny). And yeah benefit cheating is relatively small - certainly smaller than massive tax evasion.

Not sure I agree on the road/rail infrastructure argument though - sure, a few thousand might not make much a difference. But a few thousand here, there, everywhere (thinking previous relaxing of EU migration rules here) does make a big difference over time. And we've had crap investment in infrastructure for far too long now.

 

Yes it might seem harsh but even the wretched Syrians in Hungary are principally economic migrants. There are refugee camps much closer to home. I think the government is right to help some of the people in those camps that need more help rather than incentivise people to make dangerous journeys putting children at risk.

 

The table would have to be very big and as for the menu! Perhaps the knowledgeable posters on here could sort out the furniture and dining requirements

 

This is going better than I thought it might actually.

Is there any way of banning a poster from a particular thread? Because we know sure as hell Castro will **** all over this in the morning.

 

I agree to a point, but the best bet was not to start the mess over there in the middle east in the first place just to appease the likes of Bush, Cheney and the interests of Haliburton, then make it worse by following up half heartedly with minimum support when the populace began to rise up. Short of putting boots on the ground again, as you say, there is only one choice (as unpleasant as it may seem) and that is to talk to Assad etc

 

Before this thread gets closed then - we should never have meddled in the Middle-East, (2003 Iraq war is ultimately the cause of this). And we should never have handed border controls and laws to the EU. The EEC was a great idea for freedom of trade to compete with the USA and former Soviet Union in the 70s/80s. But as a more recent political union it has just caused unwanted ****.

 

On this we definitely agree, and to be fair there is bound to be a differential effect on infrastructure depending on your location

Anyway I'm having a first world crisis myself...my phone battery is nearly dead

 

I don't like it either but talking to Assad is probably the best way of ending this conflict. He's the lesser of two evils. Assad would never allow NATO to put troops in Syria unless it was on his terms and with the backing of Russia, China and Iran.

 

Apart from the U.S. that would be a great menu ( and if the U.S. were only allowed to bring BBQ that would be ok too)

 

They're a swarm incentivised by money and greed putting their children and families at risk to use as props to gain sympathy. You can see the media all love to run along with it as well every shot is of young children rather than young/middle aged men who no one would give a **** about.

I heard the Hungarian boss talking earlier he said they'd offered homes and safety to all these people alot with neighbouring countries out in Eastern Europe but the refugees had said no because they'd rather live in Germany.

They're beggars, and beggars cannot be choosers. If they really needed help its not a problem but they've been offered perfectly good help and rejected it so I don't see why we should be inclined to jump in and offer them more.

Better our resources were spent helping to sort their country out and help the ones who are really ****ed than the greedy ones with choices and wishful options.

 

I wonder watch Christopher Hitchens would think if he was alive today to witness this. He hated Assad (thought he was an Arab fascist/ultranationalist), hated Saddam and welcomed intervention in Iraq after the invasion of Kuwait and predicted the rise of the caliphate almost a decade ago.

 

Completely off topic here but today I learned the modern word fascism derived from the Latin word fasciae which were the bundles of twigs Roman magistrates used to wrap round their axes.

It's funny how words evolve over time.