KTF or WTF

[Oldsparkey]

OK, we're now into July and just 5 weeks to go before our first Championship game of the season. The guys are back in training and the speculation about additions to (or losses from) the squad seems pretty low key to me. A few names like Johnny Russell, Quinn, Wood and now Ameobi have popped up, but most disappeared very quickly and that's about it.

So what's the feeling on this board about where we're heading? Some might remember an age old question we asked before on the old 606 during the Ridsale/Jones era - is it a case of KTF or WTF? It's not a question of taking sides on this one - just gauging the thoughts of those who pay good money to watch a decent football match rather than cringing at the performances being put in this past 12 months.

Maybe the WTF approach is all a bit too much for some this early on - but how long will it be before those nagging doubts of some on here either start to have substance or get suppressed by some encouraging news.

Some might think it's still far too early to have any concerns and we should all just KTF and just let Slade sort things out, or question the whole approach at the club from Tan downwards toward this coming season and ask for some clarity - in other words WTF is going on?

Let's face it, we can do little else other than to voice our opinions.

 

[BluefromBridgend]

Extract from my comment a few minutes ago on the Transfers thread: -

"Perhaps Ninian is right and we are going to have to settle for another season of mediocrity - at best?

We should not be in such a negative place with the new season only 5 weeks away. This should be a time for optimism not the gloom facing us. For me it's the worst since Hammam's fire sale of our best players."

It's certainly not too early to be having concerns especially when those around us are adding to their squads. We have started the season best when all our deals have been done before the squad start their pre-season games. I'm feeling even more strongly that Slade has been told he can't spend the type of money needed to get in better players until the 6 or so "no hopers" have packed their bags and departed. After all they are still on the wage bill so we are chucking money away at the moment.

I've always been of the KTF variety since joining 606 (old and new) but if pigeon holed I'm now rapidly going in the WTF direction.

 

[remote]

Like Blue I've aired my views on the 'Transfers' thread.

By nature I'm an optimist but can't help thinking 'WTF is going on'. The two uncertainties are around what Tan's plans for the club which dictate what happens in the transfer market and the manager's vision for the club, including the style of play.

Players see big names being off loaded and don't want to come on board. At least under Jones and MM there was a story to tell however bleak or aspirational. I'm sure a player with ambition listening to a story of a future that might be tough and might take some time is more appealing than a void.

In addition, DJ had been reasonably successful elsewhere and had managed at a higher level so had some credibility. Not sure how we sell the club to players at the moment or what credibility we have. Again, under Sam and the Riddler, there were guys with a footballing background (hesitate to use the words footballing heritage) who had been successful (Leeds and Wimbledon). In summary, at present, the club doesn't have a footballing credibility on the field, in management or in the board room.

My glass is teetering on the brink of being half empty.

 

[isawronnymoorescore]

bumped into Mr Ridsdale weekend before last in Puerto Banus Marbella, he looked very well, he seems a thoroughly nice guy.

 

[Hilts24]

I dont see any grounds for optimism under the current manager.

I think we will have enough to stay up. Just.

 

[BluefromBridgend]

I dont see any grounds for optimism under the current manager.

I think we will have enough to stay up. Just.

But that's the trouble isn't it. Over the last 10 years we've been fed either success or the potential for it. Now, unless there is a radical change in the short term, we've got f all to look forward to. In fact less optimism than we had under OGS - and look where that led us.

 

[Statto]

I don't think its too early for WTF, I think I've been stuck in WTF mode since we turned into a laughing stock in the Premiership. Like others I've done my bit of pessimistic moaning on the transfer thread. But if I was trying to be an optimist I would say we finished last season better than we started it, if we can find those sort of results right from the start we may get a flirtation with the play offs. Looking at our squad on the bbc website we have 40 players listed I know its not completely up to date but the majority of the players listed are still with us. Other teams around us are strengthening whilst we seem to be doing very little, however (and here's where my optimism fails) I feel a half decent manager would be able to get a very decent championship side out of our squad (maybe 2 sides!)

On paper at least, how many other sides in the division could match a strike force of Jones, Le Fondre, Doyle, Macheda, Revell and Mason to name 6 of the 9?

 

[remote]

On paper at least, how many other sides in the division could match a strike force of Jones, Le Fondre, Doyle, Macheda, Revell and Mason to name 6 of the 9?

I agree Statto. I've asked before when signings have been mentioned, 'are they better than we already have?'. Is Revell better than KWJ or Doyle better than Mason and ALF. If not, why sign them? Macheda score 10 in 18 for Brum to pull them to safety the season before last, so they could put the bullets in the chamber.

We've seen ALF go out on loan and score goals and the reason we signed him is because of his record at this level, so it isn't him. We need a midfield to load the gun and a manager to play a style to suit the players we have.

 

[Stevoldinho]

I think Doyle could have more goals in him than Mason. He'd started to slowly find his feet at the end of last season.

The 40 odd man squad is surely the issue. I can understand a reluctance to throw more players into one if the largest squads in the league.

We have the best keeper. Our cb's are a match for anyone. Pilks and noone are pretty close to PL standard. KWJ, Macheda, Alf have all proven them selves able to score at Championship level. Mason and Doyle are blatantly good enough too. Revel runs around a lot.

Whits is consistently one of the best creaters in the division.

On paper Dikagcoi, Gunnar, o keef, Ralls and adeyami would seem a pretty decent starting point for cm options. Although if I'm honest, like everyone else, I'd be happy to see real quality added here.

We don't really need signings we need structure, tactics and a game plan everyone in the squads believes in and buys into. Trollope had an effect last season. He's got an entire summer now to try and get his message across and get the squad fit (I believe this was a massive difference compared to MM).

Slade and Trollope have to start well. If we're knocking around the bottom 6 by October he/they'll be gone. Why add more signings to an already oversized squad chosen by a man who might only have 10 games left?

If he's pushing the top 6 come January then maybe get the cheque book out but right now I kind of feel like we're in a hole and we should stop ****ing digging.

 

[whiffletree]

I'm certain there are some clubs who will end up top six, who would gladly swap their entire squad with us....only thing is they've got half decent managers. We haven't. A part of me would like us to Bollox up the first half dozen games and then get rid of Slade. This squad, with a decent manager is capable of at least a top six finish. With Slade at the helm mid table mediocrity is the best we can hope for. I hope I'm wrong, though, and despite everything can't wait to see how things pan out.

 

[remote]

We don't really need signings we need structure, tactics and a game plan everyone in the squads believes in and buys into. Trollope had an effect last season. He's got an entire summer now to try and get his message across and get the squad fit (I believe this was a massive difference compared to MM).

I'm certain there are some clubs who will end up top six, who would gladly swap their entire squad with us....only thing is they've got half decent managers. We haven't.

In both of these comments the nail has been firmly hit on the head.

Player by player we have a decent squad. Not the best, but good enough for a top 6 finish. How those individuals come together as a team is the issue. And that is primarily down to the management.

It's fair to say the management have been given the opportunity to prepare for the season. Slade says he was trying to get players fit during the season after he inherited an unfit squad from OGS (to be fair, the players are professionals and should largely be able to get themselves fit), he's now have a full pre-season to sort that. He will also have had time to get his 'footballing philosophy' across and for Trollope to embed the game plan. By the end of the first month we'll have a clear picture of how successful they've been.

I hope to be pleasantly surprised but am still teetering on the edge of glass half empty.

 

[Oldsparkey]

We can only go on gut feelings as to the way this is all going at the moment. It's not just about new player acquisitions or the those already at the club - it's clearly about football management at this level.

Nothing Slade has done this past 9 months since he arrived gives me any confidence at all that he can put a team together to compete effectively in the Championship.

The point made above about somehow "hoping for the worst" in the first half dozen games is a very valid one. Remember that Ole only got 7 league games last season before he was turfed out after his shambolic tactics.

If Slade is the right guy for the job, he should be able to structure a successful system through the summer and during those first games. I just hope that if the August results do go against us, he (and the club) doesn't hide behind the claim that they were "tough fixtures" - that would be disastrous head in the sand stuff.

 

[Stevoldinho]

I obviously have some very big doubts about Slade and the season to come but like Whiffle I can't write it off before we even kick a ball. It might be worse than last season but it might be better. We were an absolute shambles when ole left, young/gabb bumbled along then Slade came in.

I can't blame him for hoofing it at KWJ trying to get results and in the end we were all relieved if not particularly thrilled by mid table mediocracy. We've got the players and Slade/Trollope have now had the time. I don't think that means we'll win our first 6 matches but if I see us passing the ball, creating chances, dominating possession at home against most sides then I'll consider that as progress and trust the players will be good enough in that structure to our us nearer the top than the bottom. We'll need one of our many strikers to find a level of consistency.

We all know it's an absolutely brutal league where a month of quality play can see little reward followed by a **** load of luck resulting in a 5 from 5 type run.

In March, April and May we averaged 1.75 points a game which works out to 80 points over a 46 game season. It might be a sign of the start of progress with Trollope on board.

 

[Oldsparkey]

I doubt anyone has written next season off "without a ball being kicked".

It's a question of the confidence individuals who post on here have in the present management structure to produce an effective side on the pitch. That to my mind is the crux of the problem and is of far greater concern than the actual players on the books.

The Slade/Trollope/Young scenario seems all wrong to me. It's pretty certain we'll start the season with it and we'll just have see how it goes. I just hope the 1.75 points a game scenario you quote Stevo starts a bit earlier than last season - March is far too late if we want to challenge for anything other than avoiding relegation.

 

[Hilts24]

I doubt anyone has written next season off "without a ball being kicked".

It's a question of the confidence individuals who post on here have in the present management structure to produce an effective side on the pitch. That to my mind is the crux of the problem and is of far greater concern than the actual players on the books.

The Slade/Trollope/Young scenario seems all wrong to me. It's pretty certain we'll start the season with it and we'll just have see how it goes. I just hope the 1.75 points a game scenario you quote Stevo starts a bit earlier than last season - March is far too late if we want to challenge for anything other than avoiding relegation.

I can assure you there are loads that have.

 

[Oldsparkey]

I can assure you there are loads that have.

Not really sure what "written off" means. There's such a variation in expectation levels, it means different things to different people.

I've got no expectations other than a struggle next season to finish mid table. On that basis I've "written it off", but that maybe OK for others.

 

[Hilts24]

Mid table would be fine by me if there was attacking entertaining football with a sign that we are progressing as a club.

Id also like the man in charge to sound like a winner not big up the opposition and make it sound we are up against it all the time.(Blackpool a difficult game FFS!!!)

As it happens I reckon a quality manager would get us near the play offs or even in them with this 11 of this 18 Marshall Fabio Turner Manga John , Pilkington , Ralls , Whitts , Gunner , Doyle , Mason , Connelly , Noone , Kennedy , Peltier , Morrison , Macheda

That doesnt even include Adeyemi , Malone , Morrison , Jones , Le Fondre and the fat guy who sat last season out.

Just wait till Slade opens his mouth pre-season it will be underdog talk all over again.

Our current squad needs a quality manager. The club needs that man to be a leader and someone the fans can get behind. Then I believe we can move forward. I dont believe this regime as a clue what its doing. Complete joke. The squad needs to be cut and a couple of additions and a quality manager , back in blue and wed have a season to look forward to. All I see ahead is more dire football and Slade being under extreme pressure.

Love him to prove me wrong. Its not his fault its the man put him there in the 1st place.

Yeah I think next season will be a season wasted.

 

[remote]

As it happens I reckon a quality manager would get us near the play offs or even in them with this 11 of this 18 Marshall Fabio Turner Manga John , Pilkington , Ralls , Whitts , Gunner , Doyle , Mason , Connelly , Noone , Kennedy , Peltier , Morrison , Macheda


Our current squad needs a quality manager. The club needs that man to be a leader and someone the fans can get behind.

Spot on Hilts.

 

[Stevoldinho]

I doubt anyone has written next season off "without a ball being kicked".

It's a question of the confidence individuals who post on here have in the present management structure to produce an effective side on the pitch. That to my mind is the crux of the problem and is of far greater concern than the actual players on the books.

The Slade/Trollope/Young scenario seems all wrong to me. It's pretty certain we'll start the season with it and we'll just have see how it goes. I just hope the 1.75 points a game scenario you quote Stevo starts a bit earlier than last season - March is far too late if we want to challenge for anything other than avoiding relegation.

I think there's a really high possibility we'll be poor, continue to bang our head against the Gunnar/whits 4-4-2 brick wall and Slade will be fired. If we **** up the next appointment as badly as we have the last 2 we could easily go down in that scenario. If I had to bet on an outcome I'd probably back that one without the relegation if I'm honest.

I can't argue with the Slade Trollope young setup being wrong. I can't believe Young adds anything at all and it's debatable what Slade brings to the party based on what we were having to witness until the introduction of Trollope.

My 'stats' about our improvement could be used to suggest Leicester City will be PL title contenders next season as they topped the form table for the last 9 games. I know I'm cherry picking, but things had got better. Not to the level we'd all hope for but it was better. I solid pre season, decent fitness levels and who knows?

All I'm doing really is playing devils advocate and at least raising the possibility it might not be that bad. The Championship is full of surprises every season.

 

[Stevoldinho]

I will add I'd absolutely love to see a quality manager brought in ASAP, but for the time being we've got to piss with the cock we've got.