I know most people don't seem to care these days but...

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Superman wears Grant Holt pyjamas in bed

Superman wears Grant Holt pyjamas in bed

Well-Known Member
Jan 24, 2011
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England play tonight.

Wayne Rooney is just a mere three goals away from equalling Sir Bobby Charlton's international goal record of 49. It's inevitable he will eclipse the total at some point but where would Rooney stand in the pantheon of England greats once he overtakes him?

He gets a lot of stick – some unfairly, some justified in my opinion – and its no mean feat to score nearly 50 goals for your country and we've had many players, arguably better players, who've never come close. I personally regard him as an excellent player but one who never managed to fulfil his potential. Could have been something really special but not sure he'd make my strongest England eleven.

Thoughts?
 
Pretty much agree with you on Rooney, Supers. There's no doubt he's been a great player, especially at club level, but he's just never really turned up for the tournaments (Not that any England player has since 2004). I think he was always poorly used by England, it's impressive he has managed nearly 50 goals but all bar 1 have come outside of tourneys and quite a few have come against less than impressive opposition. I think there are strikers who have been far better for England (Long before my time) but few have been as consistent as Rooney.
 
Pretty much agree with what you've said, he is talented but never quite fulfilled the early promise. He has been dire in the last 2-3 major tournaments (not alone in that to be fair) but greats don't just score a lot if goals they should inspire team mates and fans alike. They should preferably be intelligent and give their best at all times.
Mr Rooney in my opinion fails all to often in these aspects, you can to often see his head go and get thuggish or mope around like a spoilt child. I'd maybe consider the 19-21 year old vintage on the bench, for an impact in an all time eleven but no chance the 1st XI!
Bah!
 
I have a theory on Wayne Rooney, I remember his first league goal for Everton v Arsenal, a cracking goal for anybody, but for a 16 year old novice it was phenomenal.

His first game for Man Ure in Europe, a hat trick and all the pundits started piling him onto a pedestal. He pretty much warranted all the plaudits, but always, there comes a time when you go off the boil, nothing serious, just needs a bit of patience, but Wayne's temperament let him down, he became angry and frustrated and it led to problems on the field! Look at the Ronaldo "wink" incident, he (Ronaldo) knew which buttons to push and the rest is history!

Brilliant player but could have been so much better with a Bobby Charlton temperament!
 
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canary-dave said:
I have a theory on Wayne Rooney, I remember his first league goal for Everton v Arsenal, a cracking goal for anybody, but for a 16 year old novice it was phenomenal.

His first game for Man Ure in Europe, a hat trick and all the pundits started piling him onto a pedestal. He pretty much warranted all the plaudits, but always, there comes a time when you go off the boil, nothing serious, just needs a bit of patience, but Wayne's temperament let him down, he became angry and frustrated and it led to problems on the field! Look at the Ronaldo "wink" incident, he (Ronaldo) knew which buttons to push and the rest is history!

Brilliant player but could have been so much better with a Bobby Charlton temperament!
Click to expand...

Sums it all up for me Dave. <ok>
 
England already look several times too good for Lithuania. Lovley move by Welbeck who should have scored but Rooney was in the right place! He could easily get a hattrick tonight.
 
All correct on Rooney, could of been a very good player, now just a good one.

Is it just me who thinks a side wearing a yellow an green hummel kit playing at Wembley this week is apt (even though they will get beaten/stuffed).
 
I think Wayne could of developed better if he had a period abroad maybe Spain or Germany at about the age of 22-25.

Would of added more technical ability to his game and made him a more rounded player.
 
Reading this thread you'd think he was in the twilight of his career already. He's not 30 until another seven months and has a few more good years at the top level if you ask me, time enough to cement his reputation as an all-time England "great". If he'd been played as an out and out striker more he'd have even more goals for both club and country, unfortunately because of lack of options coupled with his versatility he's been played deeper in recent seasons, though if I were LVG or Woy I'd have him as a number 9 all day long.
 
For my 5 penny worth I think that he is / was a very talented individual who coasted far too often and let his early positive reputation carry him through too many games. He also suffered from the English press disease where they pick on the star of the time (next in line step forward Mr. Kane) and then do the usual of over-egging them until they reach a point where they are then battered mercilessly whether it be justified or not. This is made worse by the fact that we generally only have one such star at a time and so like Andy Murray and before him Henman in the tennis, they end up shouldering an unreasonable burden. We need a crop of half a dozen stars to come through at one time and then each one will be able to cope better as they would not be under such intense scrutiny and help each other through it.
 
He's a typical English player, good at the easy and enjoyable things that catch the British eye.

Poor first touch and passing when pressured.
 
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He's powerful, runs around (when fit), direct and scores good goals (even I wouldn't take that away from him).

Unfortunately. Those skills are easily quashed by quality defences that don't also have decent movement and passing to contend with. Same with Sterling and Kane, they will get found out against the best. Just need to wait a few more months for Jordan Ibe to complete the set.
 
carrabuh said:
He's powerful, runs around (when fit), direct and scores good goals (even I wouldn't take that away from him).

Unfortunately. Those skills are easily quashed by quality defences that don't also have decent movement and passing to contend with. Same with Sterling and Kane, they will get found out against the best. Just need to wait a few more months for Jordan Ibe to complete the set.
Click to expand...
Suspect that you are probably not too far off the mark there.
 
For me the we use "great" to describe players too easily. England have possibly had only two great players in the Bobby's Moore and Charlton.

Rooney, Gerrard, Lampard et al are good, sometimes very good but never great.

Rooney may well be one of the best England players of all time, the goal scoring record does not lie, but that does not make him a great.

Maradona, Pele, possibly messi, Ronaldo these are great players.

Mini rant over
 
Graham Paddon Football Genius said:
For me the we use "great" to describe players too easily. England have possibly had only two great players in the Bobby's Moore and Charlton.

Rooney, Gerrard, Lampard et al are good, sometimes very good but never great.

Rooney may well be one of the best England players of all time, the goal scoring record does not lie, but that does not make him a great.

Maradona, Pele, possibly messi, Ronaldo these are great players.

Mini rant over
Click to expand...

I can't believe you don't rate Emile Heskey as great!
 
Are you saying possibly to both Messi and Ronaldo.

I don't think there is any doubt on either.of them to be honest.
 
Graham Paddon Football Genius said:
For me the we use "great" to describe players too easily. England have possibly had only two great players in the Bobby's Moore and Charlton.

Rooney, Gerrard, Lampard et al are good, sometimes very good but never great.

Rooney may well be one of the best England players of all time, the goal scoring record does not lie, but that does not make him a great.

Maradona, Pele, possibly messi, Ronaldo these are great players.

Mini rant over
Click to expand...

Gordon Banks surely also great? Regarded as the best keeper ever by many.
 
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