Assessment of Monk

[swanseaandproud]

With the weakest team we have put out for a long time then i enjoyed the game. I already had it in my mind that we were going to lose anyway and i expected us to be on the back foot. I was pleased the way we defended and in the second half i felt the longer it went on the more optimistic i was beginning to feel that we can get something out of this. Monks HT team talk installed some belief in the players and when Shelvey hit the post and gomis doing a good job drawing players away from him finally set shelvey up for his trade mark long range goal. We are well safe this season already and on course for 50+ points mark and that is pretty good going for a young manager in his first full season....

 

[Sbulby]

Can't disagree at all with Dai on this one, a good appraisal of yesterday's match.

 

[LIBERTARIAN]

I think it's safe to say we have more than a 'few more' points in the bag.

It's "also safe to say" that we are out of a "few" Cup tournaments,which cannot be corrected.
I don't place much credence on the current points gained position, since it is ongoing.
You feel the need to revel in the points glory now, while I take a more pragmatic view.

 

[ValleyGraduate12]

It's "also safe to say" that we are out of a "few" Cup tournaments,which cannot be corrected.
I don't place much credence on the current points gained position, since it is ongoing.
You feel the need to revel in the points glory now, while I take a more pragmatic view.

I ain't revelling. I'm just responding to the negative spin. Also a pragmatic view arguing that Monk is 12 points better off than this stage last year would suggest he is doing a good job at present. His points total for his first 38 league games as manager has been very good.

 

[swanseaandproud]

Its been exceptional for a manager with no experience of the lower leagues let alone the top flight. Many would have failed starting at the top like he has. It was a very well calculated risk by jinx at the time with many raised eyebrows, But it was the right move...

 

[Bob the slob]

Its been exceptional for a manager with no experience of the lower leagues let alone the top flight. Many would have failed starting at the top like he has. It was a very well calculated risk by jinx at the time with many raised eyebrows, But it was the right move...

"but I put that achievement down to the attitude of the players"

 

[aswan_dam]

"xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx"

I think you pasted something there in error, Bob. I've removed it for you.

 

[LIBERTARIAN]

I ain't revelling. I'm just responding to the negative spin. Also a pragmatic view arguing that Monk is 12 points better off than this stage last year would suggest he is doing a good job at present. His points total for his first 38 league games as manager has been very good.

The extra points come with a dreadful cost,however.
Most games are unwatchable.
Swansea City F.C. have become unrecognisable.
In terms of value for money,paying customers haven't just been mugged,they've been Monked.

Where's the "negative spin" in reminding you that we are out of two Cup competitions,one of which we so gloriously won under Laudrup?
We've won nothing under Monk,is that more "negative spin"?
Sounds like FACT to me.

 

[ValleyGraduate12]

The extra points come with a dreadful cost,however.
Most games are unwatchable.
Swansea City F.C. have become unrecognisable.
In terms of value for money,paying customers haven't just been mugged,they've been Monked.

Where's the "negative spin" in reminding you that we are out of two Cup competitions,one of which we so gloriously won under Laudrup?
We've won nothing under Monk,is that more "negative spin"?
Sounds like FACT to me.

Is this the cup ML got us knocked out of in the first round the following season?
Yes some of our displays under Monk have been dire, the difference is that under Monk we are winning games and picking up points. Under ML we weren't picking up points and playing badly too.

 

[LIBERTARIAN]

Is this the cup ML got us knocked out of in the first round the following season?
Yes some of our displays under Monk have been dire, the difference is that under Monk we are winning games and picking up points. Under ML we weren't picking up points and playing badly too.

The very same Cup,but don't pretend that you don't know comparisons between Laudrup and Monk are based on M.L.'s first season.
So far there's NO comparison,other than a handful of extra points,but no higher position in the table.

 

[ValleyGraduate12]

The very same Cup,but don't pretend that you don't know comparisons between Laudrup and Monk are based on M.L.'s first season.
So far there's NO comparison,other than a handful of extra points,but no higher position in the table.

Ive never compared ML first season with Monk as under ML the football we played in his first season was magnificent. I've always compared his second season which was dire abd the fact we were in a downward trend that looked very difficult to get out of.

 

[aswan_dam]

Here's a question for Libertarian:

What do you consider to be the main factor in determining the success of a Premier League season (ignoring cup competitions) - number of points gained, or position in the league table gained?

For example, under Brendan Rodgers we finished 11th with 47 points. In Laudrup's first season we finished 9th with 46 points. (Both admirable achievements.)

 

[LIBERTARIAN]

Here's a question for Libertarian:

What do you consider to be the main factor in determining the success of a Premier League season (ignoring cup competitions) - number of points gained, or position in the league table gained?

For example, under Brendan Rodgers we finished 11th with 47 points. In Laudrup's first season we finished 9th with 46 points. (Both admirable achievements.)

That's convenient,aswan. Let's not consider Cup competitions,especially when your man ain't gonna win any, this season anyway.


A successful season in anyone's book is surely ---

a) Finish as high up the table as is possible.

There are financial incentives per place in the P.L.,however,there are none for the number of actual points gained.
Under your example,Laudrup's efforts earned more place money than did Rodgers,having gained one less point.

b) Progress in ALL Cup competitions,since that brings added revenue,exposure,etc.,and is attractive to potential future transfers in.

Actually WINNING a Cup,is the icing on the cake. Thanks for the cake,Michael.

Perhaps Garry would like a slice?


c) Attempting to play football to a high standard, thus ensuring the hard won reputation of the Club is maintained.

Good for spectator morale,and again attractive to transfers in.


Under Monk,the Club has actually lost ground,despite having achieved a good points haul.

Early Cup exits;extremely poor discipline;extremely abject performances,most of the time.
Media recognition diminishing.

Sadly,my pride in the way the team performs/behaves is being severely tested,and under this current regime I don't see much changing in the near future.

P.S. I really miss the charismatic quartet of Martinez;Sousa;Rodgers,and Laudrup,but I won't miss the non charismatic Monk,once he has gone to pastures new.

Barcelona,or Real Madrid,wasn't it? Any insight as to which?

 

[Bob the slob]

Here's a question for Libertarian:

What do you consider to be the main factor in determining the success of a Premier League season (ignoring cup competitions) - number of points gained, or position in the league table gained?

For example, under Brendan Rodgers we finished 11th with 47 points. In Laudrup's first season we finished 9th with 46 points. (Both admirable achievements.)

Lib has answered but here's my take on things which was, perhaps more striking on Sunday because of the personnel.
Southampton and Swansea are not miles apart in style or resources but they changed manager at he end of the season and had some of their best players transferred out. They were many people's favourites to struggle because of the changes. We know what that feels like with Roberto and Brendon taking staff when they left.
However, in March Ronald Koeman stated that he'd like to manage Swansea. For many the ideal situation would have been to have Koeman in charge with Monk his apprentice, ready to take over in time. (That I suppose was wishful thinking as we have a manager who has a closed mind to learning from others' experience.)
Monk is doing very well points and position wise but a glance at the table shows where we could have been with a little forethought.

 

[LIBERTARIAN]

Redknapp has resigned. Look out for a qpr swoop for Monk.

 

[Stumpy]

The thread head is - ASSESSMENT OF MONK - so.......

I have no interest in comparing Monk against any previous mangers as this is a pointless exercise as each incumbent has built his own squad, different personnel, different styles, they each managed entirely different teams so we can't compare them, they can only be contrasted.

So to assess Monk you have to look at Monk only, so lets see what Monk's done and judge him on that, alone.

Points he should be judged on include:

His Caretaker Stewardship post Laudrup:
Monk successfully managed us through a difficult period post Laudrup, his difficulties compounded by a negative changing room with the loyalties of many players remaining with the previous manager. Regardless of being surrounded by such negativity Monk 'took on' the changing room, re-selected 'his' team, re-focused 'his' team, re-set a training regime and, our fortunes slowly changed and we stayed in the premiership, which is what he was tasked to do.

Job done.

Transfer activity - out:
The obvious suspects have left and since their departures we've had no one crying to the press, no fights, no clowns, no threats with bricks or throwing of chairs; miraculously harmony appears to have broken out in the changing room under Monk.
I miss Davies, but he asked to go so go he did. Pity
Bony, missing him already but.
Couldn't hold either of those two so best to get what we got, £28m and Siggy, nice.

Job done

Transfer Activity - in:
Monk cleared the changing room as we know but how has he done brining players in.

Lucas Fabianski - Great signing
Gylfi Sigurdsson - Great signing
Jefferson Montero - Great signing
Bafetimbi Gomis - so far a big bust
Tom Carroll - Good signing
Marvin Emnes - Good signing,
Modou Barrow - Good signing
Federico Fernandez - Great signing imo,
Kyle Naughton and Jack Cork, watch this space
and a few for the U21's

Monk offered contract extensions to Ki and Bartley who were previousely exiled and both of whom are now playing for the cause.

Imo Monk has built our first proper squad. We now have competition in every position, except Goalkeeper

Job done

So far this season:
It doesn't actually matter whether your a phobe or a phile as neither point of view actually changes anything.
Regardless of point of view it remains that Monk HAS built a decent squad, moulding them to be able to adapt to circumstances on the pitch, which we have not been able to do in the past.

So far this season we've played a beautiful ugly blend of football, we've survived constant disruptions to our team through a multitude of injuries, suspensions and others, but we keep coming back and we are sitting pretty, for us, with 33 points in 9th place. Sweet..

Imo, under Monk, we now have a Plan A, B and C. This irritates other teams who don't know how to play us anymore.

My assessment of Monk right now: Satisfactory to good, with a number of caveats relating to the fact that we're only half way up the steepening hill, but I'm happy right now.

 

[Pete from Crete]

Harmony not disharmony as was !

 

[Bob the slob]

'Regardless of point of view it remains that Monk HAS built a decent squad, - he had to after removing all the players he had personal issues with moulding them to be able to adapt to circumstances on the pitch, which we have not been able to do in the past that's arguable.

So far this season we've played a beautiful ugly blend of football, the beauty has been very rare we've survived constant disruptions to our team through a multitude of injuries, injury rates have been very small compared with previous seasons (I recall 10 first team players being unavailable for three weeks last season at a time we were still in three competitions and had played 10 more competitive games by this stage) suspensions so much for Monk's get tough pronouncements - they obviously haven't worked and others, but we keep coming back and we are sitting pretty, for us, with 33 points in 9th place. Sweet..No argument there

Imo, under Monk, we now have a Plan A, B and C. We must have a plan A but I'm buggered if I see any discernible evidence of what that plan is (at best it's clear the defence with a long ball and hope it turns to attack - if it doesn't ... defend. Occasionally we've tried passing the ball accurately, at speed and with purpose.) anything else is down to coping with the opposition. Monk said his plan went out of the window in the first minute against Chelsea, the players didn't do what he had told them to do against Blackburn and he had planned to play the usual way against Southampton. This irritates other teams who don't know how to play us anymore. Is that a serious comment?

My assessment of Monk right now: Satisfactory to good, with a number of caveats relating to the fact that we're only half way up the steepening hill, but I'm happy right now. Points and position are OK but we've lost our style and our identity is quickly following. If you are a 'win at any cost' person that's fine, if believe the same is achievable with some flair then it's not.

 

[trundles left foot]

Lets be honest about this most fans are more than happy where we are in terms of points gained and for that I cant fault GM. I go to watch the Swans to enjoy the game and of course the result is important. However this season I have never seen us play as bad as we have since we reached the Pl. The football is boring and we have turned in to a WHU, Stoke as they were in years gone by. It is boring and each game I hope we can get something early and hang on. I have to be honest that this seems to be the opinion of all sitting around me. People are no longer in and out of their seats.

I remember going to Stoke a few years back and watching the Pulis long ball and long throw, I spoke with their fans and to a man said they actually hated watching their club but put up with it to saty where they are. I ask the question, is that what we want, results but no substance. I want a bit of both, grind out results against better sides, but I want to see us getting at sides that are not at the same level.

I just hope that our brand of football just gets back to somewhere where it was. I wont hold my breath though.

 

[Yankee_Jack]

The thread head is - ASSESSMENT OF MONK - so.......

I have no interest in comparing Monk against any previous mangers as this is a pointless exercise as each incumbent has built his own squad, different personnel, different styles, they each managed entirely different teams so we can't compare them, they can only be contrasted.

So to assess Monk you have to look at Monk only, so lets see what Monk's done and judge him on that, alone.

Points he should be judged on include:

His Caretaker Stewardship post Laudrup:
Monk successfully managed us through a difficult period post Laudrup, his difficulties compounded by a negative changing room with the loyalties of many players remaining with the previous manager. Regardless of being surrounded by such negativity Monk 'took on' the changing room, re-selected 'his' team, re-focused 'his' team, re-set a training regime and, our fortunes slowly changed and we stayed in the premiership, which is what he was tasked to do.

Job done.

Transfer activity - out:
The obvious suspects have left and since their departures we've had no one crying to the press, no fights, no clowns, no threats with bricks or throwing of chairs; miraculously harmony appears to have broken out in the changing room under Monk.
I miss Davies, but he asked to go so go he did. Pity
Bony, missing him already but.
Couldn't hold either of those two so best to get what we got, £28m and Siggy, nice.

Job done

Transfer Activity - in:
Monk cleared the changing room as we know but how has he done brining players in.

Lucas Fabianski - Great signing
Gylfi Sigurdsson - Great signing
Jefferson Montero - Great signing
Bafetimbi Gomis - so far a big bust
Tom Carroll - Good signing
Marvin Emnes - Good signing,
Modou Barrow - Good signing
Federico Fernandez - Great signing imo,
Kyle Naughton and Jack Cork, watch this space
and a few for the U21's

Monk offered contract extensions to Ki and Bartley who were previousely exiled and both of whom are now playing for the cause.

Imo Monk has built our first proper squad. We now have competition in every position, except Goalkeeper

Job done

So far this season:
It doesn't actually matter whether your a phobe or a phile as neither point of view actually changes anything.
Regardless of point of view it remains that Monk HAS built a decent squad, moulding them to be able to adapt to circumstances on the pitch, which we have not been able to do in the past.

So far this season we've played a beautiful ugly blend of football, we've survived constant disruptions to our team through a multitude of injuries, suspensions and others, but we keep coming back and we are sitting pretty, for us, with 33 points in 9th place. Sweet..

Imo, under Monk, we now have a Plan A, B and C. This irritates other teams who don't know how to play us anymore.

My assessment of Monk right now: Satisfactory to good, with a number of caveats relating to the fact that we're only half way up the steepening hill, but I'm happy right now.

I resent the word suspects and clowns .... clearly indicates a jaundiced view, you're probably yellow (if not green with envy) over Laudrup's abilities and accomplishments.

So let's examine the suspects ....

Per the CIES Football Observatory Annual Review 2014. which uses the OptaPro databases as the data source for their analysis. Section II - Player Performance, based on the Big-5 leagues

In Europe: @FB ranked 6th - Angel Rangel 74 pts (on a scale of 100) -- this surprised me, but it is based on ranking in 6 different categories of performance (rigor, recovery, distribution, take on, chance creation, shooting). Well done!

In the Prem, our best showings were:

@Cb: Chico ranked joint 3rd with 84 pts, Williams ranked 9th with 73 pts.
@FB: Rangel ranked 1st with 100 pts, Davies ranked 9th with 69 pts (above Luke Shaw)
@CM/DM: JDG ranked joint 9th with 76 pts
@Forward: Bony ranked joint 7th with 40 pts. (Suarez 1st @ 100, Sturridge 2nd @72)

We got rid of our top CB, LB and midfield player, also ranked among the top in the league by CIES. We just got rid of our best forward.

BTW, Vorm was 13th lowest in the Big-5 with 66% save percentage.