Lennon resigned

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Oldsparkey said:
Nobody's forgetting the good times we had with Malky getting out of the Championship. It was the season we'd been waiting for for 6 years under Jones and failed to get. The point being made by Swampy has nothing to do with that.

Malky's position at the club became untenable and he orchestrated his own dissmissal. He realised the **** had hit the fan about his poor judgement at Premier League level and courted the media playing the sympathy card over his plight. He was asking for it and he got it - nobody's fault but his own. Once again - that's an opinion.

We'll never know, but the dropping of his legal action like a ton of hot bricks is open to all interpretations. Some (particularly those down the road) will always say that Tan paid him off to take a hike. I suspect there's far more behind Malky backing off than will ever come out in public.

The point being made by Swampy was that Lennon having actually resigned seems to merit some praise rather than engineer his own removal by others. The reasonable conclusion was that the next manager who does actually engineer his sacking for his own purpose is very unlikely to be the first to do it.
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Personally I believe Malky's position became untenable due to unreasonable pressure from Tan. That is my opinion of course.

So why do you suspect there is more behind Malky backing off then Spark?
 
snlk/poksnbn said:
Personally I believe Malky's position became untenable due to unreasonable pressure from Tan. That is my opinion of course.

So why do you suspect there is more behind Malky backing off then Spark?
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I've no knowledge at all about it Bob, and everyone can draw their own conclusions about that. I was merely suggesting that the belief held by some (particularly the vocal many down the road) that Tan made a "payoff" to get rid of Malky tends to suit those that want to believe it.

There was a thread stuck up down there about it and I offered them the following alternative scenario - needless to say, they didn't want to talk about it as it didn't suit them.............<laugh>

"Could it be that Tan had Mackay and Moody banged to rights for being irresponsible with club's funds, lacking in professionalism sufficient to perform their duty of care in the interests of the company, ultimately failing in their obligations to carry out their contracted requirements in a diligent and efficient manner commensurate with their appointed positions?

Maybe then he could prove he was entitled to terminate their employment with immediate effect for what amounted to gross misconduct?

Whatever, when a someone launches a £7.5M compensation claim with the media seemingly right behind him, and then drops it like a hot brick and scuttles off publicly apologising, it makes you think. Anyone can put whatever spin on it that suits their preferred standpoint."

Entirely possible don't you think? Just as likely as anything else for that matter. <ok>
 
Stevoldinho said:
Unless you are talking about actual stats then it's fair to say what we all post here is our opinion. Surely it's the point of this place.

Some people post counter arguments or alternative opinions, some use inflammatory language to flame other peoples opinions. It's the point of a football forum, to have a chat, share ideas then probably argue about them.

First part of the MM debate has been settled for me, him and Moody have had to back down from Tan. Whatever your point of view it's hard to believe a man as proud and stubborn as MM would not have taken Tan 'all the way' if he'd had a case. Therefore he must have done enough during his time in charge to justify his sacking IMO.

The part about his management ability is impossible to settle for now. His Watford record seemed reasonable with the resources they had, his first season with us was also decent. Our Cup final appearance did involve a very favourable draw, from memory the only PL side we beat was a piss poor Blackburn at home.

Second season he used the biggest budget in the division and won it. Plenty have failed to do the same, others have done as well on less resources. We scraped a lot of results and won pretty much every game by a single goal except the home win v Burnley. They all count, it worked, he got the job done.

He then spent the biggest budget by far of the promoted sides and failed to add the things we needed. I've said it before but Bruce showed the difference between someone who knew what the PL was going to take and the 'kid in a sweet shop' shopping style of MM/Moody. We paid 2mill for a right back who's played in one friendly and was replaced in the same transfer window he was purchased in!! The fact he was never in the bottom 3 is due in the main to the fantastic results against Man City and Man U but other results were dire, we were being outplayed by sides from mid table down and the writing was on the wall.

I enjoyed MM's time in charge, I'll always appreciate the fact he got us to the PL, it doesn't put him beyond any criticism though.

If I was quantifying how 'good' a manager MM is I'd say I think he's a better manager than Ole, but probably not as good as Bruce or Pulis who are both bottom to mid table PL managers at best.
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Can't disagree with much of this; says it all really.

IMO I see little point in discussing the MM time at City. He got us up, and he was instrumental in sending us back down.

I think he will struggle to get another PL job given his failings at City. Best bet is a Championship one where he knows what is needed to get out of the league.
 
It's a theory Spark but you could also point the accusing finger at gross incompetence on the part of the Chief Exec at the time who seems to be made of Teflon. Sorry Spark but you'll have to pool me in with those down west as far as a Malky pay off. (not the most comfortable positions for me :emoticon-0101-sadsm ) The long running embarrassment for both parties suggests to me that a win/win trade off was made.
 
snlk/poksnbn said:
It's a theory Spark but you could also point the accusing finger at gross incompetence on the part of the Chief Exec at the time who seems to be made of Teflon. Sorry Spark but you'll have to pool me in with those down west as far as a Malky pay off. (not the most comfortable positions for me :emoticon-0101-sadsm ) The long running embarrassment for both parties suggests to me that a win/win trade off was made.
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No problem with that - at least it's coming from one of our own and not a biased wishlist viewpoint based on club rivalry. <ok>
 
so he made a crap signing in cornelius. a manager at a club for 2.5 years will invariably make more than one poor signing.

yes he wasn't particularly professional in his handling of himself towards the end but its rubbish to state that he is a championship manager at best. i knew that when he went his next job would not be at PL level but thats because of the timing in which he left us. managers reputations go from one extreme to another so quickly in football nowadays almost as much as daiswans comments on cardiff city.

lennon feels he has taken the club as far as he can, he's just being honest with the fans that the club needs someone who wants to take on the job.
 
Not just one poor signing though. What about Brayford (although he could still come back and do well at Championship level, especially as Bellers has gone - training ground bust up I heard) and Odemwingie? KTC is not everyone's flavour either.

That's about £15m in transfer fees.

It's not necessarily the number of players but the financial cost when the money could have been more wisely spent on experienced Premier players who knew what to do to keep us there. And, of course, Cornelius was a total donkey for £8m and ridiculous wages.
 
BluefromBridgend said:
Not just one poor signing though. What about Brayford (although he could still come back and do well at Championship level, especially as Bellers has gone - training ground bust up I heard) and Odemwingie? KTC is not everyone's flavour either.

That's about £15m in transfer fees.

It's not necessarily the number of players but the financial cost when the money could have been more wisely spent on experienced Premier players who knew what to do to keep us there. And, of course, Cornelius was a total donkey for £8m and ridiculous wages.
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Such as Kenwyne Jones BfB? How much do you reckon he's raking in a month? Brayford was never given a chance. Why? Other than rumours I have no idea. I think Odemwingie has since gone on to prove doubters wrong. Cornelius I agree was a mistake. KTC - Can't see a problem.
 
OGS signed KWJ not Malky. Piss poor signing though and a continuing waste of money.

Odemwingie was not the right player for us in the style Malky used. Malky had him operating as either a lone target man or a winger. He is neither. As shown at Stoke he is best picking up the pieces off a big front man.

By elimination therefore he was a crap signing for us as Malky didn't know how to use him.

I don't have a problem with KTC but many others do - as I intimated in my post.
 
so we're down to overpaying for cornelius, brayford and perhaps medel, plus not knowing how to use odemwingie.

give the guy credit he hit gold every time he bought players in the championship and made some good signings at this level.

i don't think we'll see another cardiff city team that gives it 100% and was as professional as the team we had under malky. players were playing for him you could see that.
 
Swamp said:
so we're down to overpaying for cornelius, brayford and perhaps medel, plus not knowing how to use odemwingie.

give the guy credit he hit gold every time he bought players in the championship and made some good signings at this level.

i don't think we'll see another cardiff city team that gives it 100% and was as professional as the team we had under malky. players were playing for him you could see that.
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Etien Velikonja was fantastic
 
Swamp, no argument about the majority of his Championship signings (I go along with snlk on the Veronica signing) and also his achievement with us at Championship level. <ok>

However, around 50% of his Prem signings did not work out. That is not a good percentage and perhaps shows that Malky's strengths are suited to the Championship. That is not to say he will never succeed in the Prem but in his carer path maybe the Prem was too soon for him last season or we were not the right club for him to perform at that level.

As for "I don't think we'll see another Cardiff City team that gives it 100% and was as professional as the team we had under Malky. players were playing for him you could see that.", we'll have to wait and see what next season brings. While we lost to Chelsea, the players gave everything but were just not good enough. That description also applied to many of the Prem games under Malky's tenure although in some we were just poor as were his tactics.

Don't get me wrong, as I said elsewhere, I liked Malky as our manager and figurehead and wish him well at whatever role he has next - although the available jobs in relation to the number of available managers is shrinking at present.
 
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