The Great Mandela debate.
- Thread starter SgtBhaji
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Mandela was a murdering bastard, with a convicted criminal wife 'Winnie' he single handedly descended South Africa into decay.
Dont believe me, well just try and let you wife walk or drive through Johannesburg unattended.
Dont believe me, well just try and let you wife walk or drive through Johannesburg unattended.
Did it really take a bump on Schumachers head to get this conversation started ? I dont really know much on the subject so I will read and learn....
Freedom fighter or terrorist, or as said in the original thread, is there any difference?
What did happen, is that the black people of South Africa are barely better off after Aperthaid. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. As soon as Mandela got power, he forgot about the people he had fought for.
When Jerry Adams or Martin McGuinness die, will they be looked upon as people who tried to free NI from the British, or leaders of a terrorist organisation?
To see how oppression of black people should be 'fought', just see what Martin Luther King did for their rights. Was a shot fired, or a murder ordered by him?
What did happen, is that the black people of South Africa are barely better off after Aperthaid. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. As soon as Mandela got power, he forgot about the people he had fought for.
When Jerry Adams or Martin McGuinness die, will they be looked upon as people who tried to free NI from the British, or leaders of a terrorist organisation?
To see how oppression of black people should be 'fought', just see what Martin Luther King did for their rights. Was a shot fired, or a murder ordered by him?
He was no Ghandi that's for sure, he was pretty much in an open prison, had visitors constantly and planned the ANC's 'terror' campaign from there, (how many children died?) Amnesty International refused to view him as a political prisoner, which speaks volumes to me as they'll pretty much back anyone. The ANC tortured and necklaced more blacks than the Sth African Government (and then of course there's Winnie Mandela's crimes, how many children did she order murdered by necklacing?). It's a shame Biko died, he would've made a far better job of South Africa than Mandela.
All that said he was still a brave man who stood up for his people, but he was certainly not the guy they portray him to be, he was pretty ruthless and cold-bloodied.
All that said he was still a brave man who stood up for his people, but he was certainly not the guy they portray him to be, he was pretty ruthless and cold-bloodied.
As an aside, I actually owwe a small debt of gratitude to Mandela. I was trekking in Lesotho in July and August 1998 when rioting broke out in the capital Maseru (I was in the mountains close to a small airstrip village called Sehonhong). Mandela ordered the South African army to quell a potential coup that followed on from elections held in the country that were thought to be rigged. The South African army were aware of our groups presence and were on standby by to airlift us out of the county if necessary as our route out of Lesotho meant travelling through Maseru.
The violence calmed enough to allow our passage through the capital via sanctuary at a Red Cross station for a couple of days, though long enough to get harrassed by locals for believing we were South African students there to do a recount of the votes!
All quite scary stuff for a while.
The violence calmed enough to allow our passage through the capital via sanctuary at a Red Cross station for a couple of days, though long enough to get harrassed by locals for believing we were South African students there to do a recount of the votes!
All quite scary stuff for a while.
In respect to terrorism/freedom fighters it does all depend on the perception, I don't see the IRA as freedom fighters, maybe a long time ago, yeah, but that was a few decades ago, now they're just corrupt egotists lusting for money and power with their middle finger raised to those they pretend to serve, I've been all around NI with a group of catholics, didn't see anyone being . Osama bin Laden, on the other hand, was someone whose stated ideals I can respect, he showed the hypocrisy of the wests much vaunted 'war for democracy' so intent are we in enforcing that democracy that we'll support any monarchistic/despotic regime that gives us oil by helping keep the 'unwashed masses' down where they belong by force of arms (we train all their torturers, elite guardsmen, special forces and state 'security'). He certainly didn't throw the first punch
I guess Miggins, sadly as a species we really have no chance of ultimately surviving on this planet as agreeable and unified population, we are just far too selfish and greedy, some more than others of course, but that's mother nature aint it, she only recognizes and promotes winners.
alas mother nature has been taken out of the equation as far as humans are concerned, there's no way people like Bush or Obama would've ever got in charge if natural selection had been in play. The truth is as a species we're about as socially advanced as baboons, and that may be a disservice to baboons. I find it quite ironic that the smartest animal on earth is also the one whose stupidity is destroying it. I've started to notice quite a lot recently how much irony controls the world, for example, the Abrahamic religions which promote peace and harmony are probably the biggest cause of war, the Jews, who gave us those religions, have been the most persecuted because of it, Mohammed, the prophet of the brown races (I'm being a bit general I know) was a ginger haired blue eyed white man, Jesus, the prophet of the whites, was a Brown Buddhist and without Hitler the Jews wouldn't have reunited and returned to Israel, so therefore he must be their Messiah. Ironic or what?
lol, then we have politics, you should never give power to those that desire it, unfortunately only those that desire it will ever get it.
My whole life has been ironic, pretty much from conception onwrds, now I've realised it I'm starting to embrace it and going for the most ironic thing I can think of.