Draw - good??
- Thread starter Spurm
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Ultimately, all on here (including you and I) want the same thing. That is to win games, trophies and outdo the domineering clubs., We are in total agreement with that.......
How we get there will always be a matter and subject of opinion and will always be the cause of debate until we achieve our 'own' goal(s) (excuse the pun).
Maybe I came across as being hyperpatriotic, in recent posts., I had no intention to be patronising to you Spurm. I must offer my appologies.
Thanks. In that case i also apologise for going off on one after misinterpreting your posts.
COYS
Building a winning mentality.....
Whilst the difinition is not unified, I agree with you in part about its benefits when applied to professional competative sport. Games can undoudtedly be won or lost in the mind. Mentality however, is NOT 'the be all and end all' to winning and I'm going to suggest that talent plays the greater part.
Without talent you could go out there thinking your Cassius Muhammad Ali Clay, but you'll still lose.
Some may also disagree, with this notion of taken every game seriously ., ultimately why 'fight a battle if you don't gain anything at all by winning ?'., (ref Man Utd v Chelsea 5th May).
It is my belief that winning is a byproduct of talent first and mindset after. I also think a true champion needs motivation above and beyond winning. A winning mentality is not enough.
When the likes of Chelsea and Manchester Utd are winning then everything that happens can be claimed to be right and wise.
2 things, firstly the competition could be relegated with 40 points...a previous safety total.
Secondly, its funny that you said exactly the same a thing a little while ago when the top teams 'didn't' get a high points total, according to you that means the League must be weak aswell. So whether a few teams piss it, or are given a workout, the league is weak...well done for undoing your own mantra, that or you're the hopeless wum I've always said you are.
There are the same number of points on offer each season, however they are distributed. That distribution follows a similar pattern every season.
Whether the PL is weaker or not is a subjective judgement. Seeing how so many teams have been improved by recent imports- Cazorla, Hazard, Vertonghen, Mirallas, Coutinho, Ramirez etc, etc and looking at the ability in the ranks of a team like Wigan, I'm sticking to my view that the PL is continuing to get stronger.
Whether the PL is weaker or not is a subjective judgement. Seeing how so many teams have been improved by recent imports- Cazorla, Hazard, Vertonghen, Mirallas, Coutinho, Ramirez etc, etc and looking at the ability in the ranks of a team like Wigan, I'm sticking to my view that the PL is continuing to get stronger.
2 things, firstly the competition could be relegated with 40 points...a previous safety total.
Secondly, its funny that you said exactly the same a thing a little while ago when the top teams 'didn't' get a high points total, according to you that means the League must be weak aswell. So whether a few teams piss it, or are given a workout the league is weak...well done for undoing your own mantra, that or you're the hopeless wum I've always said you are.
Notso. Having a different view to yours doesn't mean I am a "hopeless WUM". There's no need to take it so personally.
We will never agree but I have long held the view the PL was much stronger 6/7 years ago than now.
I remember when 4th placed Arsenal had Thierry Henry, Dennis Bergkamp, Robert Pires, Ashley Cole, He Who Must Not Be Named on this board etc. World Class players.
There was also Wenger at his best, Benitez who wasn't as crap then and then Fergie/Mourinho. Now we have Moyes and most probably Pelligrini managing our n.o 1 and 2 clubs.
Across the board it is far easier to get points now. The West Ham team that went down 10 years ago would be 8th/9th in this current league. A vast lack of quality from Swansea downwards
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LDL all that's getting stronger is the gap between the top and bottom teams, IMO
I think that you're clutching at straws when you're mentioning future managers when discussing the current strength of the league, DL.
Pellegrini was good enough for Real Madrid a few years ago, so I'm not sure that picking him out is helping your cause, either.
West Ham went down because they had a manager with health problems, some diabolical players and no balance. Repka getting sent off every other game didn't help, either.
Pardew took over that team and you could easily argue that his current side is far better overall, despite their low league position.
Pellegrini was good enough for Real Madrid a few years ago, so I'm not sure that picking him out is helping your cause, either.
West Ham went down because they had a manager with health problems, some diabolical players and no balance. Repka getting sent off every other game didn't help, either.
Pardew took over that team and you could easily argue that his current side is far better overall, despite their low league position.
This is quite a common mistake unless truely understood.
Same amount of points on offer- yes - but that doesn't mean the same amount of points are actually distributed as if a game is drawn only two points are given out whereas if a team win 3 are handed out.
I think there have been more wins this year than last which means there are more points around.
Notso. Having a different view to yours doesn't mean I am a "hopeless WUM". There's no need to take it so personally.
We will never agree but I have long held the view the PL was much stronger 6/7 years ago than now.
I remember when 4th placed Arsenal had Thierry Henry, Dennis Bergkamp, Robert Pires, Ashley Cole, He Who Must Not Be Named on this board etc. World Class players.
There was also Wenger at his best, Benitez who wasn't as crap then and then Fergie/Mourinho. Now we have Moyes and most probably Pelligrini managing our n.o 1 and 2 clubs.
Across the board it is far easier to get points now. The West Ham team that went down 10 years ago would be 8th/9th in this current league. A vast lack of quality from Swansea downwards
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LDL all that's getting stronger is the gap between the top and bottom teams, IMO
Rubbish, you don't have a view to differ with. The only reason we won't agree is because you can't admit you're wrong, you even lost your Poll thread in the end.
You base your hapless point on English CL performance one minute, then PL top teams having too many points meaning the rest are ****, or if they don't have enough points they're not good enough. In practice whichever suits you at the time, your post history confirms this. If you ever make your mind up I might consider a debate, till then you're just talking ****e. There becomes a point where ****e isn't an opinion, its just ****e, and thats where you're argument is.
Rubbish, you don't have a view to differ with. The only reason we won't agree is because you can't admit you're wrong, you even lost your Poll thread in the end.
Entitled to your opinion but there is absolutely no evidence to suggest the PL is getting stronger but there is to suggest its getting weaker.
What constitutes "evidence" of whether the PL, as a whole, is getting stronger or weaker? It is a subjective issue.
What about the continued influx of many leading international players, the increasing depth of the squads of all teams because of the funds they have available and the success of Swansea and Wigan in the cup competitions, beating the top sides on merit and showing quality indicative of a high standard of football? All this points to the PL being stronger. Teams from the lower half of La Liga or the Bundesliga do not have players of the quality available to the likes of Southampton, Newcastle or Wigan. Would Benteke or Mignolet be playing for German teams battling to avoid relegation?
A poor season in the CL does not mean the PL must be weaker than those leagues providing the successful teams. Bayern and Dortmund do not reflect the standard of the rest of their domestic league; ditto Real Madrid and Barcelona. To the contrary, there is a huge gulf in class between them and the rest. You can't say that about the PL. There is far greater competition; there are no easy fixtures. Although the top sides are more consistent and cope better when they lose key players, any PL side can beat any other on their day. Wigan can beat Man City on merit because they have quality players. Augsburg didn't have a prayer against the top German sides. Barcelona and Real have always breezed past the lesser Spanish sides.
What about the continued influx of many leading international players, the increasing depth of the squads of all teams because of the funds they have available and the success of Swansea and Wigan in the cup competitions, beating the top sides on merit and showing quality indicative of a high standard of football? All this points to the PL being stronger. Teams from the lower half of La Liga or the Bundesliga do not have players of the quality available to the likes of Southampton, Newcastle or Wigan. Would Benteke or Mignolet be playing for German teams battling to avoid relegation?
A poor season in the CL does not mean the PL must be weaker than those leagues providing the successful teams. Bayern and Dortmund do not reflect the standard of the rest of their domestic league; ditto Real Madrid and Barcelona. To the contrary, there is a huge gulf in class between them and the rest. You can't say that about the PL. There is far greater competition; there are no easy fixtures. Although the top sides are more consistent and cope better when they lose key players, any PL side can beat any other on their day. Wigan can beat Man City on merit because they have quality players. Augsburg didn't have a prayer against the top German sides. Barcelona and Real have always breezed past the lesser Spanish sides.
Correct, I am entitled to my vast majority opinion, and you are entitled to...well, you're on your own with yours.
Sorry DL, take this anyway you like, but your understanding of European football is pretty poor really. An astute comment as is the one from Luke, is something beyond your remit I feel, I also feel you're the epitomy of 'a little knowledge is worse than no knowledge'. You're a great fan no doubt supporting your team an all that, but the big picture is over your head a bit...I'm being kind, a lot if we're honest.
If I'm wrong, impress me and counter ALL of Luke's points.
Probably it is correct to say that the Premiership as a whole has become more competitive. Perhaps that sounds daft as Utd have just walked away with the title, but in general, I believe that to be the case overall.
There is, however, little doubt that our teams are not as competitive in Europe as they were a few years ago. O.k. Chelsea are in the Europa league final. But only after being bombed out of the CL at the group stage.
There is, however, little doubt that our teams are not as competitive in Europe as they were a few years ago. O.k. Chelsea are in the Europa league final. But only after being bombed out of the CL at the group stage.
On the flip side, two English teams have forced their way into the competition next year for the first time...could be 3 if Arsenal join Wigan and Swansea!
Doesn't that apply to most major European leagues? Although oil state money is changing the situation in one or two of them.