Reality check

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jeremygoss

jeremygoss

Member
Jun 9, 2011
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Im sure im not the only Canary to be having a right old moan lately. But this article gave me abit of perspective.

Lets all stay positive!!! OTBC



http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun/cs/blogs/norwich_and_beyond/archive/2013/03/15/2885271.aspx
 
jeremygoss said:
Im sure im not the only Canary to be having a right old moan lately. But this article gave me abit of perspective.

Lets all stay positive!!! OTBC



http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun/cs/blogs/norwich_and_beyond/archive/2013/03/15/2885271.aspx
Click to expand...

Thanks for posting the link jg - a really worthy (and I don't mean he who was our manager a few seasons ago). If my memory serves me correctly, I think we would have been bottom of league 1 for a few weeks had Saints not been deducted 10 points. I'm sure however that so called 'fans' will still moan/boo whatever, but I won't be one of them!!!!
 
I love the description of our play as "Tiki-tractor", that sums it up perfectly!
 
Again I think there isn't different degrees of moaning. On here everyone has common sense and can back up their argument and i agree there are some which do harm to the club.

The thing i don't understand now is how the people that are really positive and optimistic seem to have an arrogant tone about themselves lately.

To be honest i am happy with are league position, i want performances to improve and i also think they will next year. But there seems to be a sense of dismissing a negative opinion with a arrogant and patronizing message. Which to me is causing a lot of the friction amongst Norwich fans and also this board.

I went off topic there, but it is sort of to do with the different factions attitudes at the moment.

A point about that post is, it does my head in a bit when people say "look at Roeder, Grant and Gunn, we could have them in charge still". Does that mean because we've had them in charge and we have a better manager in charge we should give up on improving further? And because we don't have loanees anymore, we now have Turner, that's it, lets put the cheque book in the shredder. I just don't see why we should compare our personel to probably our most dire time player wise. Our biggest progress has been the bank balance and because that's going to have an effect on the future of the club its worth measuring that as genuine progress.

I don't think the post is bad but harps on too much about the past, we should be looking at the future and never rest on our laurels.
 
YellowLittle said:
I don't think the post is bad but harps on too much about the past, we should be looking at the future and never rest on our laurels.
Click to expand...

Thats the best thing about Hughton I think. Whenever you hear him speak some see it as negative, talking about clubs of our stature a lot. But he does not take anything for granted, whatever I think about his tactics sometimes I have to admit he always comes across as a man who has his head screwed on and doesn't get carried away as shown by his conduct. It is also good to see him celebrate in the manner he did against everton when the second goal went in because we don't see much of that from him but it shows he realised how big that win could have been. I think with him and Mcnally about we won't be resting on our laurels any time soon, which can only be a good thing.
 
QUOTE FROM LITTLE: 'A point about that post is, it does my head in a bit when people say "look at Roeder, Grant and Gunn, we could have them in charge still". Does that mean because we've had them in charge and we have a better manager in charge we should give up on improving further? And because we don't have loanees anymore, we now have Turner, that's it, lets put the cheque book in the shredder. I just don't see why we should compare our personel to probably our most dire time player wise. Our biggest progress has been the bank balance and because that's going to have an effect on the future of the club its worth measuring that as genuine progress.'

Interesting point. I think there is still a sense of overwhelming relief that we're not on that dreadful negative spiral that finished at the home game against Colchester, and this is colouring our response to what is happening now. I suspect this season will mark the end of this if we survive. I think we'll all start looking forward then, rather than be haunted by the ghosts of the recent past.
 
Having a sense of perspective is not just about comparing where we are now to the, at times dire, recent past; it is also about taking a realistic view of the time scale required for getting back to the level of the slightly less recent, and on occasions glorious, past. What exasperates some of us about some of the current outbreak of negative post-match reaction, is that the posters will insist on reading the future from the here and now. There's nothing wrong with giving an objective appraisal of what happened on the pitch in the 95 minutes or so of today's match. But to carry on as though we are condemned to the same fare for years to come is simply not justified. Is expressing one's exasperation at the negativity "arrogance"; I don't think so. <ok>
 
I think there is a sense of superiority amongst the more optimistic fans sometimes. Not all of them and not all comments are but that's my observation on it.

I think that post that the thread is about harps on way too much about the past. I think he would have a stronger argument looking forward, ie, becoming debt free, Hughton hopefully building a decent squad. Its just something which ticks me off.
 
YellowLittle said:
.... I think that post that the thread is about harps on way too much about the past. I think he would have a stronger argument looking forward, ie, becoming debt free, Hughton hopefully building a decent squad. Its just something which ticks me off.
Click to expand...

Yes, as I said, perspective needs to include the future as well as the past. Actually some of the most irritating and damaging harping back to the past doesn't focus on our fall and subsequent rise under Lambert, but to the club's best years in the 80s and 90s. It's fine to hold those years up as what we should now be aiming to reproduce; but there still appear to be people around who regard it somehow as our "right". No such thing. <ok>
 
YellowLittle said:
I think there is a sense of superiority amongst the more optimistic fans sometimes. Not all of them and not all comments are but that's my observation on it.

I think that post that the thread is about harps on way too much about the past. I think he would have a stronger argument looking forward, ie, becoming debt free, Hughton hopefully building a decent squad. Its just something which ticks me off.
Click to expand...

Not sure I get a feeling of superiority from them (except for one who may no longer be with us) but I do get a sense sometimes that they feel we are being treacherous if we criticise, that we are traitors to the cause.
 
vietnamcanary said:
Not sure I get a feeling of superiority from them (except for one who may no longer be with us) but I do get a sense sometimes that they feel we are being treacherous if we criticise, that we are traitors to the cause.
Click to expand...

Smileys were invented precisely because this sort of communication deprives the reader of the usual clues to the sentiment behind the words. I see what I interpret as exasperation; others see a patronising attitude or arrogance. The real answer is not to read anything into a post regarding the sentiment behind it. Just concentrate on the words? Of course, when people use personal language ....... <ok>
 
I have criticised Hughton on here recently but reading that article really does put things into perspective. Funny how there are no comments from the 'pink-un' posters at the foot of the article <whistle>


P.S. I still think Hughton's brand of football is dire ..........................coat
 
Hi, long time phantom (back to the old 606 days).

I think perspective is good, for now. We're still implementing the 7 year plan. Achieve Premier League football for 2 seasons and write off debts. That was the goal, and we're mighty close to getting there! Who would have thought that we'd achieve it in the manner we have done? How close were we to looking down the barrel? So looking back occasionally to keep perspective is healthy.

However. After this season, I think the goal posts change. If we stay up, then my understanding is that we clear all external debt. We also upgrade the stadium to accommodate 5000 more seats. We've already upgraded our Academy to the highest level. If that's not a statement for the future I don't know what is. But most importantly we finish the 7 year plan. We draw a line under that era of the club. We can stop looking back to the dark times and we can create a new 7 year plan.

For me this new 7 year plan would include, maintaining Premier League status, building up the squad and bringing in youngsters to the academy and perhaps an adventure or two towards Wembley (and beyond???)... Of course, you guys may have different visions ;)
 
Astro Canary said:
Hi, long time phantom (back to the old 606 days).

I think perspective is good, for now. We're still implementing the 7 year plan. Achieve Premier League football for 2 seasons and write off debts. That was the goal, and we're mighty close to getting there! Who would have thought that we'd achieve it in the manner we have done? How close were we to looking down the barrel? So looking back occasionally to keep perspective is healthy.

However. After this season, I think the goal posts change. If we stay up, then my understanding is that we clear all external debt. We also upgrade the stadium to accommodate 5000 more seats. We've already upgraded our Academy to the highest level. If that's not a statement for the future I don't know what is. But most importantly we finish the 7 year plan. We draw a line under that era of the club. We can stop looking back to the dark times and we can create a new 7 year plan.

For me this new 7 year plan would include, maintaining Premier League status, building up the squad and bringing in youngsters to the academy and perhaps an adventure or two towards Wembley (and beyond???)... Of course, you guys may have different visions ;)
Click to expand...

Great post, I agree a new plan is needed. I hope it's as successful as the last one.
 
Astro Canary said:
..... If we stay up, then my understanding is that we clear all external debt.....
Click to expand...

The external debt is to be cleared at the end of this season, irrespective of whether we stay up or not. And re. the 7-year plan, in an online Q&A session some months ago, DM said that the original 7-year plan had already been superceded and a new plan is in place. He didn't go into details, e.g. with any specific timescale for expanding Carrow Road, or winning anything, etc. My impression was that the objectives of the new plan were more general in nature, e.g. grow the academy, grow the capacity, improve the team, stay in the PL, and so on. <ok>
 
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