This is not a thread to bash no hopers in top races. I regularly route for the underdog (Carruthers yesterday!) and I suppose if the horse is fit and connections pay the fee then they are entitled to line up. That said if Kinkeel were able to communicate his views I suspect he'd opt for less exalted racing company. This 14 year old stalwart has raced SS 3 times and never got to within 100 lengths. Yesterday's effort was his worst attempt finishing 138 lengths behind the champ. I noted that those bastard bookies actually clipped him in from 200s to 150s just before the off. The 14 year old has raced 119 times winning only 5 - in short a fine servant to the lower echelons of jump racing. So my question is this: Assume that Kinkeel next takes on SS in a handicap over 2 miles, carrying the minimum 10 stone with Ruby in the plate. The upper limit is scratched, what weight would forumites allocate SS to give the old boy a chance of being upsides at the last?
Sprinter Sacre versus Kinkeel
- Thread starter Chaninbar
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Kinkeel, shouldn't be allowed to enter a graded race. It's ridiculous a 70 odd rated horse in a G1 field getting tailed off everytime. It offers absolutely nothing to the race. They should have to be currently racing off a minimum OR of say 140 to gain entry into a G1, otherwise they're wasting everyone's time.
SS rated 179
Kinkeel rated 64
Which makes a difference of 115lbs on official ratings (although maybe Kinkeel's 64 is a little flattering and SS maybe more of a 200 rated horse) so if Kinkeel carries 10 stone you'd have to have SS lumping round 18st 3lb which would mean RV could ride him
On a more serious note, Kinkeel also viewed Master Minded's backside from a respectable distance on several ocaisions and I think it nothing short of sheer cruelty that they keep running him in these top races. He owes connections absolutely nothing and they should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves. Thanksfully the championship races at the festival have entry conditions which prevent this nonsense.
Kinkeel rated 64
Which makes a difference of 115lbs on official ratings (although maybe Kinkeel's 64 is a little flattering and SS maybe more of a 200 rated horse) so if Kinkeel carries 10 stone you'd have to have SS lumping round 18st 3lb which would mean RV could ride him
On a more serious note, Kinkeel also viewed Master Minded's backside from a respectable distance on several ocaisions and I think it nothing short of sheer cruelty that they keep running him in these top races. He owes connections absolutely nothing and they should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves. Thanksfully the championship races at the festival have entry conditions which prevent this nonsense.
It wasn't Kinkeel's ground yesterday, he would have got a few lengths closer if it was good to soft good in places 
I guess there's two sides to every argument though
On one hand the owner has paid the entry fee, so why should he not be able to contest the race he wants his horse in (lets not forget sometimes these horses are placed in such company because the prize money goes down to such a placing that it covers the entry and some!)
But on the other hand, this complete no hoper could fall and bring down a horse of SS's nature, injuring them or worse
Imagine the uproar if that happenned?
On one hand the owner has paid the entry fee, so why should he not be able to contest the race he wants his horse in (lets not forget sometimes these horses are placed in such company because the prize money goes down to such a placing that it covers the entry and some!)
But on the other hand, this complete no hoper could fall and bring down a horse of SS's nature, injuring them or worse
Imagine the uproar if that happenned?
A touch of reality please.
Kinkeel (or any horse) doesn't know he is supposed to pass a certain point of the course ahead of other horses, anrd certainly doesn't feel humiliated at not doing so. That is human emotion, and we wrongly assume that the horse will feel the same.
Nor does he know - or care - that humans have bet on his rivals. He runs because he enjoys it - simple. And if he wasn't enjoying it he would soon let connections know.
If he was running but getting unduly exhausted, or making blunders due to his age then he should be retired, and most responsible trainers would advise their owners that the time was right to do so.
I agree that it looks too stupid for words from a human perspective, but as already been said, they are entitled to their run, having paid the entry fees.
I'm happy to know that if it was a handicap and I was to ride Sprinter - I'd need 3 stone of lead weight. And superglue on the saddle
Kinkeel (or any horse) doesn't know he is supposed to pass a certain point of the course ahead of other horses, anrd certainly doesn't feel humiliated at not doing so. That is human emotion, and we wrongly assume that the horse will feel the same.
Nor does he know - or care - that humans have bet on his rivals. He runs because he enjoys it - simple. And if he wasn't enjoying it he would soon let connections know.
If he was running but getting unduly exhausted, or making blunders due to his age then he should be retired, and most responsible trainers would advise their owners that the time was right to do so.
I agree that it looks too stupid for words from a human perspective, but as already been said, they are entitled to their run, having paid the entry fees.
I'm happy to know that if it was a handicap and I was to ride Sprinter - I'd need 3 stone of lead weight. And superglue on the saddle
Leave Kinkeel alone!
He had no chance but is a great old stick and has amassed a fair few quid over the years finishing 5th and 6th in graded races and isn't knocked about.
He tried and ran on his own merits against SS which is more than Bullet Train ever did.
Whoops..apologies...not allowed to mention anything critical against you know who on here....
He had no chance but is a great old stick and has amassed a fair few quid over the years finishing 5th and 6th in graded races and isn't knocked about.
He tried and ran on his own merits against SS which is more than Bullet Train ever did.
Whoops..apologies...not allowed to mention anything critical against you know who on here....
That's a thought Dex - Kinkeel could be used as a pacemaker as well and then nobody would ever mention him and just bow at the altar that is Sprinter Sacre.<whsitle>The owner should be allowed to ebter the horse in any race he likes.
As I said in the opener not for me to criticise Kinkeel just a bit of a lark to establish how the two could be matched. I've given it a bit of thought and I reckon Sprinter needs to carry an extra 100 lbs. Not just any old 100 lbs but the 100lbs of loveliness that is Rebecca Curtis. She slips in the saddle with Geraghty, anchors Sprinter, distracts Bazza and galvanises Ruby. Game on. Kinkeel by short head.
..... Sounds good to me!
While the black aeroplane is tucked up in his stable having the best of everything I see the old boy is back at it again tomorrow. Similar trip but gets weight of all his opponents and with his pilot's claim carries a mere 9st 11. I have a new theory, that the cunning buggers were just getting the old boy primed the other day and tomorrow is his 'target'. Ok so his record at Towcester isnt good - 2 from 17. Furthermore his 17 furlong record is pretty shabby - 1 from 31. But those nice people at Paddypower have just given me a free bet. It's must be a sign. Paddy knows......tomorrow is Kinkys day. The money is down (£2) on the nose.