Where's that 'AVB is a clown' thread
I think hiag might be eating humble pie.
Right hiag?
AVB The Beginning
- Thread starter Spurf
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I think hiag might be eating humble pie.
Right hiag?
S
Spur of the Moment
Guest
Think it is fair to say that for the last few weeks AVB has hardly put a foot wrong - both on the pitch and with the Media. Early days still but very promising signs and still some significant players to return!!
But what a very agreeable day!!
But what a very agreeable day!!
The quality of the football needs improving though. Maybe that will come with confidence in the side.
Slice of Stilton Boss?
Slice of Stilton Boss?
Really ?? We were almost unwatchable for about 60% of todays game. Sorry, to be a miserable so and so, but this guy has a long way to go before he convinces me.
Hi SC, I think most know we have been riding our luck and we have yet to still perform over 90 minutes (which shouldn't be ignored) yet right now i'm giving AVB the benefit of the doubt, as he has got the best out of defoe, been dealt a bad card with injuries and the players are still adapting to his system.
I still can't relate to him in the same way as i did with redknapp and i still have concerns, but if he can keep us challenging for top four then i can put up with the dodgy performances for now, yet if we're still playing crap for one half, good next half after January, then it will make me question if we're just riding our luck more then I thought.
Tottenham Hotspur Manager's Records & Statistics from 1898 to 2012 updated after today's 3-0 win at Fulham...
http://www.myfootballfacts.com/TottenhamHotspurManagersRecords1898-2009.html
...AVB has a better Premier League win percentage than Harry and his overall statistical record is now just short of Bill Nicholson's.
http://www.myfootballfacts.com/TottenhamHotspurManagersRecords1898-2009.html
...AVB has a better Premier League win percentage than Harry and his overall statistical record is now just short of Bill Nicholson's.
Boss
. Would you agree that any manager worth his salt should be capable of taking the players AVB has had available to a position where we are now ?? I know he has had injury issues, but he still has always had plenty/enough of good players available to be capable of us getting into in a challenging position in the league.I am encouraged by the way he has got the best out of Defoe, but this is reduced somewhat by the indifferent performanes which seem to exist in nearly all our games. Today was a good example of my doubts because not for the first time this season, the style of play bored the pants off me for at least an hour of the game.
Guess I'll need to learn to be more patient !!!
Boss
I am encouraged by the way he has got the best out of Defoe, but this is reduced somewhat by the indifferent performanes which seem to exist in nearly all our games. Today was a good example of my doubts because not for the first time this season, the style of play bored the pants off me for at least an hour of the game.
Guess I'll need to learn to be more patient !!!
I ain't going to lie, I personally don't enjoy disliking any spurs manager, so im trying to find ways to give AVB the benefit of the doubt, but i dont like the guys personality or the football we play overall, he comes across as being dour, unflexible and obsessed with 4-2-3-1.
And yes I agree any top manager would have us challenging for top four with the current squad so considering we sacked arry (who had us playing better football) and got us champions league football, then really the least we should expect is our current position.
However just to be fair to AVB, he has stuck by and shown complete faith in Defoe, and didn't panic about the lack of strikers we had, and look at the result, Defoe is on fire! playing the best football of his career.
Also he hasn't been able to put out his best team for many games, and isn't worried about giving youth players a chance (like carroll), also he has yet to manage for a full season in the premier league, and is only 35.
Im hoping after January the team will click into gear and put in performances for 90 minutes and play exciting football (which we have done in patches) for example that first half performance away to Utd is the type of display I believe AVB believes this team is capable of, so do we think he can get us near to that level overall?
Im unconvinced at the moment but am hoping!
I don't feel comfortable about having doubts about our manager either, but my feeling remains we are where we are in the league more due to the failings of others than our own performances.
It's a good point about giving youth a chance though, because players like Tom Carroll would barely get a sniff if Harry was still about.
It's often said the way a team playes portrays the charactor of their manager. Mark Hughes' teams are good examples and so too are Neil Warnock. We all know Harry's teams are, so I am hoping AVB can loosen up a bit and get us playing with a bit more excitement than we currently are because this can take us to the next level.
How can anyone be struggling to find reasons to like AVB?
This is a new job for him and the start has been solid. We could try to be pretty like Liverpool try to....but I'd rather be where we are. Tippy tappy has it's place. I can understand why AVB would rather try to have a solid start and then take it from there.
If it brings this club a trophy then I'm more than happy. We are in a situation where pretty football may get us more plaudits but a solid team would aid is in landing silverware.
I think a trophy would help us achieve our goals of attracting top players and getting into the CL more so than pretty football.
Sometimes you have to stop polishing your boots and roll your sleeves up.
This is a new job for him and the start has been solid. We could try to be pretty like Liverpool try to....but I'd rather be where we are. Tippy tappy has it's place. I can understand why AVB would rather try to have a solid start and then take it from there.
If it brings this club a trophy then I'm more than happy. We are in a situation where pretty football may get us more plaudits but a solid team would aid is in landing silverware.
I think a trophy would help us achieve our goals of attracting top players and getting into the CL more so than pretty football.
Sometimes you have to stop polishing your boots and roll your sleeves up.
I'd agree with that first paragraph, OS . To my mind, that shows how the playing field has levelled out somewhat. It also tells me that we are not doing too bad a job, being where we are, considering our comparative paucity of financial resources.
Re AVB. For me, I still remain to be entirely convinced. However, he seems to be learning fast. He seems to be making far better use of what we have now, than he was a month or two go. As a very long standing Spurs fan I hope he succeeds.
We looked far from solid against Liverpool and a number of other teams, so you're argument there is weak. Solid means your keeper having a relatively quiet game, not relying on poor finishing. Take a peak at our goals conceded column compared to those around us. There are more than enough reasons there to remain sceptical for those of us who wish to do so.
Far from solid perhaps but solid enough to end their 8 match unbeaten run and gifting them a freak goal. I've been critical of Spurs and maybe we're expecting too much too early on. Some of our wins have been too close but overall we've been ok. I think the attractive Spurs attacking football will return when confidence returns to its peak.
S
Spur of the Moment
Guest
Yes really!
Certainly not saying that there isn't room for improvement, but he personally has done pretty well.
I thought that Villas-Boas got his line-up wrong yesterday and for most of the game we lacked creativity and struggled to impose ourselves on Fulham.
The first goal seemed to break their defence, though and they imploded quite badly after that.
One thing that evaded me during the game was the lack of decent chances that Fulham had.
Berbatov had a good game and looked a constant menace, but he was largely controlled by our defenders and Lloris only really had one save to make, from what I can remember.
That's in stark contrast to this tie last season, when we somehow won 3-1, despite getting absolutely battered for virtually the entire game.
I think he's done pretty well overall, considering the big players that we lost in the summer (King, Modric, van der Vaart) and the way that we missed out on his main transfer target.
He's made mistakes (leaving Huddlestone out of the pre-season for Jenas, not picking Dawson enough), but that's to be expected.
The first goal seemed to break their defence, though and they imploded quite badly after that.
One thing that evaded me during the game was the lack of decent chances that Fulham had.
Berbatov had a good game and looked a constant menace, but he was largely controlled by our defenders and Lloris only really had one save to make, from what I can remember.
That's in stark contrast to this tie last season, when we somehow won 3-1, despite getting absolutely battered for virtually the entire game.
I think he's done pretty well overall, considering the big players that we lost in the summer (King, Modric, van der Vaart) and the way that we missed out on his main transfer target.
He's made mistakes (leaving Huddlestone out of the pre-season for Jenas, not picking Dawson enough), but that's to be expected.
S
Spur of the Moment
Guest
Morning PNP - We didn't start well yesterday and I have questioned a few line ups, not just yesterday's, but as you say it is fairer to reserve judgement on that until he has the full(est) squad available.
What has impressed me though has been the fact that there seems to be a very good team spirit in evidence. I know that Defoe will naturally be happy with life but he seems to have the the players on his side. And as previously mentioned, his management of the media has been a massive step up on the last incumbent: the Modric comments being a prime example.
The next 4-6 weeks will be interesting as injured players return and the rumour mill kicks in around the Transfer Window.
What has impressed me though has been the fact that there seems to be a very good team spirit in evidence. I know that Defoe will naturally be happy with life but he seems to have the the players on his side. And as previously mentioned, his management of the media has been a massive step up on the last incumbent: the Modric comments being a prime example.
The next 4-6 weeks will be interesting as injured players return and the rumour mill kicks in around the Transfer Window.
I'm not saying he hasn't done well at times either, but its things like this stat that came out on MOTD that concern me...Spurs, most defensive clearances of ANY (more than QPR, Soton, and Reading!! 
) PL team so far this season, 645.
) PL team so far this season, 645.
I'm not saying he hasn't done well at times either, but its things like this stat that came out on MOTD that concern me...Spurs, most defensive clearances of ANY (more than QPR, Soton, and Reading!!
Plus we've still concede 23 goals in 15 games. Yesterday was our first clean sheet for quite some time. O.k. We have players out injured, but we've still got to defend better than that.
I don't get to spend so much time on Not 606 as I've gone and found myself one of those proper job things (in the UK) rather than trapesing all over the globe enjoying myself, breaking a few bones and almost killing myself on a couple of occasions, it's interesting to pick up a thread like this which started at the at the end of a bad run and has been ongoing throughout a better period with us picking up 9 points from 3 games.
What is curious is that the posters views of AVB do not seem to have changed too much in that period despite the results changing significantly. Those sitting on the fence unsure during the bad spell still seem to be sitting on the fence now, those who had glasses half full still seem to have them half full. Everybody seems to be in agreement that the quality of football leaves a little to be desired but again nobody is arguing the fact that we have been decimated with injuries and that Adebayor didn't help things by getting himself sent off. However, we've not done that badly results wise since he received his red card which might mean he finds it difficult to find a place in the strating line up on his return. What is true is that the Doom and Gloom' merchants predicting hell and high water at the start of the season are now somewhat quieter although I'm sure a bad run will bring them back in their droves.
I was very much sitting on the fence when it came to the sacking of Arry because although I did think that he had took us as far as he could. However, I was fearful for the future without him. Some of Levy's appointments have been dire, take Ramos (who I was very much in favour of), Santini (who I wasn't) so any appointment had to be looked at with suspicion. When it became apparent that Levy didn't have a big name lined up and it was obvious he had decided to 'twist' rather than 'stick', I was more than a little worried. At the time of the England fiasco there were some decent candidates out there, Anchellotti, Bilic, etc. but Levy hung out for compensation which never arrived and the favourite candidates were swallowed up by people with large wallets. Of the candidates left at the time of the sacking, I was initially anti AVB as he was never my favourite although when he was appointed, I like many, decided to get behind hime and offer my full support.
AVB is certainly learning, switching formations, giving youngsters a chance etc. It is a big step up from the Portuguese League to the Premership. The top sides may be of similar quality but once you get to 4th and 5th there is no contest. The Prem is probably the most competitive in the world with bottom teams more than capable of beating the top ones. Whether AVB is out of his depth now we will wait and see but for his end of first term report I would give hime a B+, the plus is for effort, there is no doubting his effort. All of us might think that we could do better but most of us think we could predict football results better than Lawro; but who is top of the alternative prediction league?.....yes, bloody Lawro. Humble pie time for the rest of us.
In retrospect, I think Arry had to go. He was beginning to get stale just like Wenger is at the Goons. Of the options we had available back then we could have had Martinez, we might have been able to pursuade Moyes or probably could have got Benitez or employed any of a number of foreign coaches who would have demanded stonking great salaries with no guarentee of results. How would Spurs fans feel about having Martinez or Benitez rather than AVB? I know I am firmly in the AVB camp. I think we have to give hime time, at least 6 transfer windows. That will then be the time to think about 'sticking or twisting again'. I just hope Levy does everything he can to help with money to spend and allows him to identify his own target.
What is curious is that the posters views of AVB do not seem to have changed too much in that period despite the results changing significantly. Those sitting on the fence unsure during the bad spell still seem to be sitting on the fence now, those who had glasses half full still seem to have them half full. Everybody seems to be in agreement that the quality of football leaves a little to be desired but again nobody is arguing the fact that we have been decimated with injuries and that Adebayor didn't help things by getting himself sent off. However, we've not done that badly results wise since he received his red card which might mean he finds it difficult to find a place in the strating line up on his return. What is true is that the Doom and Gloom' merchants predicting hell and high water at the start of the season are now somewhat quieter although I'm sure a bad run will bring them back in their droves.
I was very much sitting on the fence when it came to the sacking of Arry because although I did think that he had took us as far as he could. However, I was fearful for the future without him. Some of Levy's appointments have been dire, take Ramos (who I was very much in favour of), Santini (who I wasn't) so any appointment had to be looked at with suspicion. When it became apparent that Levy didn't have a big name lined up and it was obvious he had decided to 'twist' rather than 'stick', I was more than a little worried. At the time of the England fiasco there were some decent candidates out there, Anchellotti, Bilic, etc. but Levy hung out for compensation which never arrived and the favourite candidates were swallowed up by people with large wallets. Of the candidates left at the time of the sacking, I was initially anti AVB as he was never my favourite although when he was appointed, I like many, decided to get behind hime and offer my full support.
AVB is certainly learning, switching formations, giving youngsters a chance etc. It is a big step up from the Portuguese League to the Premership. The top sides may be of similar quality but once you get to 4th and 5th there is no contest. The Prem is probably the most competitive in the world with bottom teams more than capable of beating the top ones. Whether AVB is out of his depth now we will wait and see but for his end of first term report I would give hime a B+, the plus is for effort, there is no doubting his effort. All of us might think that we could do better but most of us think we could predict football results better than Lawro; but who is top of the alternative prediction league?.....yes, bloody Lawro. Humble pie time for the rest of us.
In retrospect, I think Arry had to go. He was beginning to get stale just like Wenger is at the Goons. Of the options we had available back then we could have had Martinez, we might have been able to pursuade Moyes or probably could have got Benitez or employed any of a number of foreign coaches who would have demanded stonking great salaries with no guarentee of results. How would Spurs fans feel about having Martinez or Benitez rather than AVB? I know I am firmly in the AVB camp. I think we have to give hime time, at least 6 transfer windows. That will then be the time to think about 'sticking or twisting again'. I just hope Levy does everything he can to help with money to spend and allows him to identify his own target.
deedub... very well reasoned, interesting article. I don't actually agree with everything (I would have kept Harry for example) but there's no doubt how refreshing some good debate is. I would also award B+, although if anything it is difficult to make any sensible assessment until AVB gets to play with his chosen team for a few matches. Just as we seem to be starting something, something else stops... Ade gets toward match fitness, gets sent off - Dembele looking good and we don't lose when he plays, he gets injured - Parker, Kaboul and Benny on long term injuries - now Daws gets injured when he looks like he's getting back to form and similarly for Bale. Of course it's asking too much for the doom brigade to take anything like this into account (not forgetting the most important point that he hasn't even had half a season yet!)
Anyway, most importantly, how the hell do you get a job in this country!
Anyway, most importantly, how the hell do you get a job in this country!