Who actually has the better strongest 11?

[Chappaz]

My honest XI:

----------------Krul------------------
Bardsley --- Colo --- Saylor --- O'Shea
----Cabaye --- Tiote --- Sessegnon---
---------HBA --- Cisse --- Ba ---------

Has to be Colo and Saylor for me, as when we had them as our CB pairing, we had the best defence in the league until Saylor got injured. Those two players combine to make a sum greater than their individual parts.

Cabaye and Tiote, nuff said, cracking players.

As for the front 3, I can't see any Sunderland player replacing anyone there. Ba has 16 goals, Cisse has 7 in 7 and HBA has 3 goals and 5 apps in the past few months. It would be a toss up between HBA and Sessegnon, but I'd benefit from them both by putting Sessegnon just behind Ben Arfa, as Sessegnon seems better playing a little deeper than HBA.

The thing is, this XI might make it look like I think our team is far better than Sunderland's, but that's not how it works. For example, I might think Tiote is only 1% better than Cattermole, but due to that 1%, Tiote's name is in the XI, not Cattermole's.

So even though I've chose 8 of our players, I don't think Sunderland's XI is as far away from ours as it looks.

 

[Big Bad Wesley Brown]

I'd say both teams are fairly evenly matched, it is very hard to evaluate who is better in individual positions as both sides are obviously going to be biased towards their own players, even if it's only because they've seen more of them.

 

[Poyet's Eleven]

The thing is, this XI might make it look like I think our team is far better than Sunderland's, but that's not how it works. For example, I might think Tiote is only 1% better than Cattermole, but due to that 1%, Tiote's name is in the XI, not Cattermole's.

So even though I've chose 8 of our players, I don't think Sunderland's XI is as far away from ours as it looks.

Exactly

 

[poolie_mackem]

In my honest opinion if I had to pick a match day squad I would go with...

Manager: Martin O'Neill

------------------ Mignolet ------------------

- Santon --- Brown ------- Colo - Richardson -

----------- Tiote ---------- Cabaye ---------

Ben Arfa -------- Sessegnon -------- McClean

-------------------- Ba ---------------------

subs

O'Shea
Krul
Larsson
Cattermole
Gutierrez
Gyan
Cisse

Cannot stand S.Taylor rather play myself than that ****. I know Krul has been playing well this season but I have hardly seen anything of him whereas I have with Mignolet. Cisse and Gyan on the bench because of the formation

 

[cabluigi]

-------------Krul
Santon--Colo--O'Shea--Bardsley (or swap fullbacks)
-------Cabaye---Tiote
Ben Arfa---Sessengon--Ba
--------------Cisse

So hard to make some of those decisions. The likes of Mclean and Jonas are difficult to leave out. Like Chappaz says, there are some very competitive positions. I think our first XI is better at the moment, you're only a few quality players away from beating us.

 

[monty987]

Our defence is poor !, midfield wise we win hands down with Sess and Mclean, then Larsson (free kick and corner expert) i rate the best ever free kick taker in the north !.And they 6th because refs go against us and that stops us progressing and they have had untold luck. Lets see them win at either Chelsea or Everton or even Swansea. Roll on next season!.

 

[Billy Death]

Let's be honest about it, it's been shagged to death & we're never gonna agree so **** it.

 

[cabluigi]

And they 6th because refs go against us and that stops us progressing and they have had untold luck

Have some class man. It's 30 games into the season, and we're 11 points clear! You look like a tool when you play the "lucky" card at this stage of the season.

 

[concrete tony]

My honest XI:

----------------Krul------------------
Bardsley --- Colo --- Saylor --- O'Shea
----Cabaye --- Tiote --- Sessegnon---
---------HBA --- Cisse --- Ba ---------

Has to be Colo and Saylor for me, as when we had them as our CB pairing, we had the best defence in the league until Saylor got injured. Those two players combine to make a sum greater than their individual parts.

Cabaye and Tiote, nuff said, cracking players.

As for the front 3, I can't see any Sunderland player replacing anyone there. Ba has 16 goals, Cisse has 7 in 7 and HBA has 3 goals and 5 apps in the past few months. It would be a toss up between HBA and Sessegnon, but I'd benefit from them both by putting Sessegnon just behind Ben Arfa, as Sessegnon seems better playing a little deeper than HBA.

The thing is, this XI might make it look like I think our team is far better than Sunderland's, but that's not how it works. For example, I might think Tiote is only 1% better than Cattermole, but due to that 1%, Tiote's name is in the XI, not Cattermole's.

So even though I've chose 8 of our players, I don't think Sunderland's XI is as far away from ours as it looks.

Chaps whilst you make some valid points however, nobody in their right mind would choose O'Shea at left back? Was this a typo lol????

Our teams at the moment are both excellent so I have no problems with anyones choice as it personal opinion and most fans would choose their own player as they've seen them play more. I admire some Newcastle players BUT I love Sunderland players because they play for Sunderland, visa versa I would expect from Newcastle fans. Perfect example maybe some Newcastle fans picking Tiote but for us Sunderland fans who saw Cattermole against Man City, one of the best performances seen.

The other thing I would say is that it's not always about the best players but how the players selected create balance and well a good team. Not picking on you Chaps but I think your first 11 as it were would be an underachieving team as it lacks balance. We all love eye catching players and often under estimate the hard grafting players. I would say both teams are equal as if you take both teams from the time O'Neill has taken charge must be pretty much point for point. Both teams have had shockers and both teams have performed to the sublime!

 

[concrete tony]

-------------Krul
Santon--Colo--O'Shea--Bardsley (or swap fullbacks)
-------Cabaye---Tiote
Ben Arfa---Sessengon--Ba
--------------Cisse

So hard to make some of those decisions. The likes of Mclean and Jonas are difficult to leave out. Like Chappaz says, there are some very competitive positions. I think our first XI is better at the moment, you're only a few quality players away from beating us.

Yes we were one player from beating you, had sess not been sent off we would have beaten you

 

[concrete tony]

Have some class man. It's 30 games into the season, and we're 11 points clear! You look like a tool when you play the "lucky" card at this stage of the season.

You have been LUCKY though! We had Agent BRUCE in charge for 11 games or so

 

[Commachio]

The OP is completely smitten by the mags...

his posts are about mags, and he even tries to have a user to disguise his love for them...

Sorry your not fooling anyone....

 

[James Bond]

Could you imagine a front 3 of Ben arfa sess and cisse/Ba?

 

[Travelsick07]

Truth. Sunderland way better. Nicer stadium too, nicer city as well. Prettier kits, I mean who doesn't love the red black and white combo? it doesn't resemble barf in the least. Oh yeah not to mention sunderland lasses...

Yet this kid gets like 20 replies.

 

[Chappaz]

Chaps whilst you make some valid points however, nobody in their right mind would choose O'Shea at left back? Was this a typo lol????

I honestly don't know enough about your team, and I just thought O'Shea was the same no matter where he was put in the defence.

If not, then I'd replace O'Shea with whoever's the best in your side at LB.

Our teams at the moment are both excellent so I have no problems with anyones choice as it personal opinion and most fans would choose their own player as they've seen them play more. I admire some Newcastle players BUT I love Sunderland players because they play for Sunderland, visa versa I would expect from Newcastle fans. Perfect example maybe some Newcastle fans picking Tiote but for us Sunderland fans who saw Cattermole against Man City, one of the best performances seen.

You are right, and that's why these XI comparisons will never be 100% fair, because people have inaccurate ideas about the oppositions players due to not watching them enough. Plus, there's obviously the bias involved which no one gets rid of entirely.

As long as no one takes them seriously though then it's just a bit of fun.

The other thing I would say is that it's not always about the best players but how the players selected create balance and well a good team. Not picking on you Chaps but I think your first 11 as it were would be an underachieving team as it lacks balance. We all love eye catching players and often under estimate the hard grafting players. I would say both teams are equal as if you take both teams from the time O'Neill has taken charge must be pretty much point for point. Both teams have had shockers and both teams have performed to the sublime

This is the current form guide:

http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/matchday/form-guide.html

Since MoN took over though, probably equal points yeah. Personally I'm waiting until next season to see how MoN does before I form a proper opinion, as I'm not sure if the managerial honeymoon period is over yet. When MoN started I think you were only second to Man City in-terms of form for a few months, then it's slid down slightly, so I'm waiting to see whether it evens out now and stabilises, or whether it's going to fluctuate anymore.

PS: I did not expect to see Bolton in 7th. Seems they've really been fighting for Muamba.

 

[marcusblackcat]

1). He has a name about Pardew
2). His first two threads ever on this forum are about Newcastle.

I sense a wum.

We argue quite often chappaz - but certainly not on this subject!!!

As for who's got the best strongest 11 - how can anyone on this board give an unbiassed objective opinion - they'll say theirs is better and we'll say ours is - I think their forward line is better than ours with Ba and Cisse but I think Sessegnon and Ben Arfa are the 2 best players in the sides and would have either or both at Sunderland - impossible argument as it's all about opinions

Edit - I have just read through the thread and seen that this seems to have been said but that's my 10 pence worth anyhow!!

 

[parkersafc]

Apart from the Bruce fiasco the difference this season has been Ba simple as that, I don't think there's much in it other than him. Then when it looked like it might be going pear shaped Cisse was brought in and he's kept things on track (6 in 6???)

Think the only area Newcastle are stronger is up top. No Sunderland fan being realistic wouldnt swap Ba and Cisse for any two of our strikers. (im not counting Sess as a striker btw)

 

[Chappaz]

Apart from the Bruce fiasco the difference this season has been Ba simple as that, I don't think there's much in it other than him. Then when it looked like it might be going pear shaped Cisse was brought in and he's kept things on track (6 in 6???)

We kept doing well right through the ACoN period without Ba, or Cisse, or Tiote, so that's that theory thrown out the window.

Of course he's important, as he's one of our best players, but everyone has that same situation. No team is utterly dependant.

Think the only area Newcastle are stronger is up top. No Sunderland fan being realistic wouldnt swap Ba and Cisse for any two of our strikers. (im not counting Sess as a striker btw)

HBA, Cisse and Ba is a far more potent strike force in my view.

Midfield, Cabaye, Tiote and Jonas? Players like Cattermole and Larsson are good but I'd have to choose our three. You may disagree here but there you go.

Defence, we had the best in the league with Saylor and Coloccini in the side, until Saylor got injured. Without him, we haven't been so solid at the back, so I think you guys have probably pipped us to the post defence-wise this season, although I'd take Krul over Mignolet.

PS: Just remember the playing styles of both sides. Mon's 'sit back then counter attack' style can often bypass the midfield, whereas we're now playing a 4-3-3 which makes heavy use of our midfield players. The only way to compare them would be to both play the same midfield style, and I honestly don't think your midfield would do as well as ours in a 4-3-3 formation, but that's just my personal opinion. No doubt you'll disagree.

 

[parkersafc]

So there wasn't a wobble when you didn't win for a few games? im saying if any one of our strikers had 16 goals and your top scorer only had 7 then I think we would be above you. Imo Sess is better hba. Going through the teams man for man there isn't much difference imo.

 

[Mr Wonderful]

Krul Simpson Colo Taylor Bardsley Tiote Sess Jonas Ben Arfa Ba Cisse.

Santon and Cabaye need a second season to show more in the league before giving them too much credit.