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To be fair GH, the Pool game went away from them with the 2 SO's, I agree we were battering them from the start with 11, but would that have continued for 90mins? In all honesty I doubt it, Dalglish would have changed something. The Norwich game was one they were not at their best either, so we basically made the most of other teams problems. You have only been able to use these 2 games as your examples...because it hasn't really worked too well in others. Just my opinion. <ok>
 
notsosmartspur said:
To be fair GH, the Pool game went away from them with the 2 SO's, I agree we were battering them from the start with 11, but would that have continued for 90mins? In all honesty I doubt it, Dalglish would have changed something. The Norwich game was one they were not at their best either, so we basically made the most of other teams problems. You have only been able to use these 2 games as your examples...because it hasn't really worked too well in others. Just my opinion. <ok>
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Fair enough NSS - I haven't just been able to use these games, I can use others too. For example our last two games. I can also quote the game that turned our lge season around, the win at Wolves. Lennon didn't play in that one either.

I just chose our best away performance and best home performance (arguably) as classic examples of why we're better off without Lennon, and without two wingers.

I don't like two wingers, they're too high risk, but if we play them, fine, just hope it works.
 
The 4-4-1-1 with Lennon and Bale out wide is our best and most versatile formation.
Other systems may work well in some circumstances, but that one with our first XI seems to be our most deadly and difficult to deal with.

I'd like to see the stats for games that we've started with our best team.
I doubt we've lost many.

EDIT: The 5-0 against Newcastle was also a 4-4-2 without Lennon starting, Notso. It works against other sides playing 4-4-2.
 
PleaseNotPoll said:
The 4-4-1-1 with Lennon and Bale out wide is our best and most versatile formation.
Other systems may work well in some circumstances, but that one with our first XI seems to be our most deadly and difficult to deal with.

I'd like to see the stats for games that we've started with our best team.
I doubt we've lost many.

EDIT: The 5-0 against Newcastle was also a 4-4-2 without Lennon starting, Notso. It works against other sides playing 4-4-2.
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Well, as you know I disagree PNP, and I've given evidence to show this isn't the case. I look forward to evidence for the case.

I'm not sure what is our best and most versatile formation. I think it probably doesn't include Lennon, I'll need a lot of convincing to change my view, and I haven't see sufficient evidence yet.
 
When Lennon came into the side near the start of the season against Blackburn we went on a run of wins.
We beat them, QPR, Fulham, Villa, West Brom and Bolton on the trot, until he was injured in the dodgy loss at Stoke.
We then looked poor against Sunderland, disjointed against Chelsea, won well at Norwich, struggled out a draw in Swansea and nicked a win against West Brom.
Lennon returned for our comfortable win against Everton, which was followed up with the ****e game against Wolves and the dubious loss to City.
We've won well against Wigan and Newcastle since without him, but have struggled badly otherwise.

I'd say that we seem to win more games with him in the side than we don't, but we miss him really badly when other sides set up with 5 in the midfield and he doesn't start.
He seems to have missed virtually all of the big games this season though, for some reason.
It's hard to make an accurate comparison because of that.
The fact that Redknapp adopts an entirely different set-up when he's missing doesn't help, either.
Is it Lennon's absence or the change of system?
 
Being set out 4411 or 442, whatever, like I say it makes no difference really, because thats only for going forward. The criticism of those 2 formats are that we get over-ran in MF without the ball. That shouldn't be the case, because when VdV is used, he should drop into MF to make a 5, which is pretty much what you're saying...I think. :)
 
I think we have better League stats without Lennon starting than with him starting this season, but that's just a guess on my part.

Be interested if anyone wants to do the numbers.

For me anyway, Lennon's not part of our best XI and currently I prefer Livermore to him. 5 of the 'front 6' are shoo-ins for the biggest games, then it's between Livermore, Lennon, Saha, Defoe and Sandro for me for place 6.
 
load of cobblers on this thread,there is no set eleven.Harry chooses different line -up's depending on the opposition and the injury's from about 16 player's he "trusts"
 
In Lennon's 14 league games that he's started our record is 8/1/5, giving us 25 points from 42 or 1.79 per game. In the 16 we've had without him starting 8/6/2 notching up 30 points from 48 or 1.88 per game.

It is worth remembering that Lennon's stats include 4 games against the top two teams and Lennon's start against Sunderland is included as a win even though he only played 27 minutes. Overall it doesn't suggest much of a difference.


Edit: It is also worth remembering that I worked these out myself using OPTA stats on: http://www.whoscored.com/Players/5625/Fixtures/Aaron-Lennon so someone might want to double check my ability to count :D
 
Interesting figures YV, but as ever, Lennons absence of late has coincided with 'other factors', so are perhaps a little distorted in his favour.

The point is as PNP has mainly alluded to, his inclusion whether he plays well or not, makes the opposition play differently, he scares the living **** out of his opposite FB, who will play a far more reserved game in fear of getting caught out. His tracking back has vastly improved also.
 
Yid Vicious said:
In Lennon's 14 league games that he's started our record is 8/1/5, giving us 25 points from 42 or 1.79 per game. In the 16 we've had without him starting 8/6/2 notching up 30 points from 48 or 1.88 per game.

It is worth remembering that Lennon's stats include 4 games against the top two teams and Lennon's start against Sunderland is included as a win even though he only played 27 minutes. Overall it doesn't suggest much of a difference.


Edit: It is also worth remembering that I worked these out myself using OPTA stats on: http://www.whoscored.com/Players/5625/Fixtures/Aaron-Lennon so someone might want to double check my ability to count :D
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Thanks for that YV, so my guess is right. So much for Lennon being vital to us as some claim, he clearly isn't.

Lennon may make the oppo play differently, from these figures it makes them play better.

Give me Livermore over Lennon ATM, he doesn't frighten defences so much but he gives us more solidity.
 
you don't need to be so solid if the opposition full backs can't get forward because they s*** scared of our wingers Pace
 
totsfan said:
you don't need to be so solid if the opposition full backs can't get forward because they s*** scared of our wingers Pace
Click to expand...

You don't need to be so solid, but given we've been better this season without Lennon than Lennon, I prefer the solidity to the flakiness.
 
I don't think we can trust the stats regarding Lennon this season, as he has clearly been playing below his best. We've glimpses of his former devastating self, but that's it. I do hope that he isn't being rushed back, and that he can start stringing together some good match-time. Lennon at his best makes us almost unplayable, especially if Bale can keep playing like he did against Bolton.
 
Bale on the left and Lennon on the right is a simple mantra for sure. Is it the correct one, I don't think so.

Yes Lennon gives us more fire power, he also doesn't shore up the defence like Livermore, or have as much fire power as Defoe, for example.

Gonna be fascinating to see what Harry opts for on Sunday.
 
I thought we played well under the system again. You can't beat having Lennon back but it's a better plan b than Modric on the left and/or 442.
 
We lined up with more of a 4-3-3 against Swansea.
Parker, Modric and Sandro playing alongside each other and closing down anything through the middle was one of the main reasons that we won.
Redknapp definitely did his homework for this one.
 
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