Transfer Rumours transfer thread fact and fiction

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I'm still torn on this.

Yes there was calamity defending everywhere but it is impossible to ignore the extent to which this was down to our midfield never being able to control a game, and our attack posing zero threat which meant all but the weakest opposition were happy to push extra men forward and leave themselves exposed at the back.

On paper, our back 5 was the strongest area of our squad. I think this is more down to RDZ wanting to play with WBs that it is an indicment of the whole defence. I don't agree with Ally Gold on this, and judging by his frequently high post match marks for our midfield and attack (he awards a 6+ for anyone who runs around a lot) he doesn't agree with me either.

The midfield no doubt also needs improving but I think that back five of Vicario, Porro, Romero, VDV and Udogie wasn’t very good despite what a lot of Spurs fans said.

A full season under De Zerbi with proper coaching and they might have looked better but definitely right to be changing the defence and keeper situation.
 
The midfield no doubt also needs improving but I think that back five of Vicario, Porro, Romero, VDV and Udogie wasn’t very good despite what a lot of Spurs fans said.

A full season under De Zerbi with proper coaching and they might have looked better but definitely right to be changing the defence and keeper situation.

I agree, but the exact same argument can be made in the opposite direction to the one you made above in your earlier post. If signing new defenders proves that the current ones are rubbish, doesn't the fact that all of them are or have been strongly linked with the likes of City, Inter, Real and United prove that they're actually quite good?

So again I say: I think the problem is a holistic one. On paper that back 5 shouldn't have been anywhere near as awful as it has been. In fact there aren't many whole back lines in the PL I'd swap it for. Arsenal and City and that's it. The rest I'd cherry pick one or two players from, but the whole unit? Not a chance.

Our back line only starts to look bad once you move the paper up and see the bilge lining up in front of it.
 
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Ornstein says the van Hecke deal’s been agreed, £52m. Get on!

Second Vuskovic bid of £35m also rejected.

Vuskovic stays. This should be beyond question.

Even if he hates Spurs and is desperate to leave, we make an agreement to sell him next summer and send him out on loan for another year. His value will literally double by the end of the season.

Selling him now is just idiotic.
 
I agree, but the exact same argument can be made in the opposite direction to the one you made above in your earlier post. If signing new defenders proves that the current ones are rubbish, doesn't the fact that all of them are or have been strongly linked with the likes of City, Inter, Real and United prove that they're actually quite good?

So again I say: I think the problem is a holistic one. On paper that back 5 shouldn't have been anywhere near as awful as it has been. In fact there aren't many whole back lines in the PL I'd swap it for. Arsenal and City and that's it. The rest I'd cherry pick one or two players from, but the whole unit? Not a chance.

Our back line only starts to look bad once you move the paper up and see the bilge lining up in front of it.

Maybe so but Spurs signing 2 new CB and a LB shows where the club feels the weaknesses are.

For me a new GK has to be the next priority. Can’t be going into next season with Kinsky and Vicario.
 
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The midfield no doubt also needs improving but I think that back five of Vicario, Porro, Romero, VDV and Udogie wasn’t very good despite what a lot of Spurs fans said.

A full season under De Zerbi with proper coaching and they might have looked better but definitely right to be changing the defence and keeper situation.
The fault remains with our midfield's inability to either screen the back line or control the game, meaning our back line is doing far more work than they actually should

A large part of a manager's job is to reduce the amount of work their defence and keeper have to do per match to as short a time as possible, preferably ten minutes or less over the 90, so (to use our CBs as examples) Romero can make that one crunching tackle or Mickey Van close down an opponent he had no business closing the distance at most 3-4 times per game, and the rest of the time their job is to shepherd loose balls out of play or back into the keeper's waiting hands

Our issues for the past couple of seasons is our defence is having to play at least half an hour per 90 due to how easily and often our midfield is overrun or bypassed by opponents one way, or fails to relieve pressure due to being unable to string three passes together the other way, so instead of playing to their strengths the handful of times they are called upon instead their weaknesses get exposed due to having far less control of the match

For the obvious non-Spurs example, just look at John Terry under different managers: at club level he had Mourinho or Conte building a wall in midfield so he basically had to tackle maybe 2-3 times per match, probably less against teams their midfield sat on, but then when you stuck an England shirt on him his lack of pace and his shoddy passing regularly came a cropper
 
The fault remains with our midfield's inability to either screen the back line or control the game, meaning our back line is doing far more work than they actually should

A large part of a manager's job is to reduce the amount of work their defence and keeper have to do per match to as short a time as possible, preferably ten minutes or less over the 90, so (to use our CBs as examples) Romero can make that one crunching tackle or Mickey Van close down an opponent he had no business closing the distance at most 3-4 times per game, and the rest of the time their job is to shepherd loose balls out of play or back into the keeper's waiting hands

Our issues for the past couple of seasons is our defence is having to play at least half an hour per 90 due to how easily and often our midfield is overrun or bypassed by opponents one way, or fails to relieve pressure due to being unable to string three passes together the other way, so instead of playing to their strengths the handful of times they are called upon instead their weaknesses get exposed due to having far less control of the match

For the obvious non-Spurs example, just look at John Terry under different managers: at club level he had Mourinho or Conte building a wall in midfield so he basically had to tackle maybe 2-3 times per match, probably less against teams their midfield sat on, but then when you stuck an England shirt on him his lack of pace and his shoddy passing regularly came a cropper

Don’t disagree with all of that but it’s clear De Zerbi fancies other than the ones he already had for their ball playing abilities.

I said a couple of times last season and the season before that that even prime maldini and Baresi would look exposed in Spurs team due to lack of control.
 
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Maybe so but Spurs signing 2 new CB and a LB shows where the club feels the weaknesses are.

For me a new GK has to be the next priority. Can’t be going into next season with Kinsky and Vicario.
Striker for me.

The defence has strengthened enough now to the point even Loris Karius wouldn’t look too shabby with the quality that’s been added in front of him. We were also generally looking stronger defensively both thanks to De Zerbi’s coaching and also the return of Bentancur looking like his old self.

However we still lacked that killer up top who can both finish half chances and fashion opportunities for himself and others. A top striker grabs us about 6-9 points on their own, an elite one like Kane grabbed us about 12-15, Richarlison and Solanke lose us about 6-9.
 
I'm still torn on this.

Yes there was calamity defending everywhere but it is impossible to ignore the extent to which this was down to our midfield never being able to control a game, and our attack posing zero threat which meant all but the weakest opposition were happy to push extra men forward and leave themselves exposed at the back.

The question is this :

If you put the prevailing Spurs MF in front of
the back five of any club C that finished
above Spurs, how many more goals do you
think C would have conceded over the season ??
 
Striker for me.

The defence has strengthened enough now to the point even Loris Karius wouldn’t look too shabby with the quality that’s been added in front of him. We were also generally looking stronger defensively both thanks to De Zerbi’s coaching and also the return of Bentancur looking like his old self.

However we still lacked that killer up top who can both finish half chances and fashion opportunities for himself and others. A top striker grabs us about 6-9 points on their own, an elite one like Kane grabbed us about 12-15, Richarlison and Solanke lose us about 6-9.

An elite striker also helps the defence by keeping opposition players pinned back.

If I'm an opposition CB lining up against Richarlison or Kolo Muani, I happily maraud 40 yards upfield to join attacks because I know even presented with a one on one, they'll hit the hot dog vendor.
 
I tell you what this a brilliant start by Spurs in the transfer window.
Robertson, Senesi and Van Hecke all done. 3 excellent signings with prem experience, ability on the ball and leadership qualities. ...

One good thing about early signings in numbers,
is that it gives squad members who may try and
hang on solely for the wages some serious food
for thought regarding their futures.
 
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Striker for me.

The defence has strengthened enough now to the point even Loris Karius wouldn’t look too shabby with the quality that’s been added in front of him. We were also generally looking stronger defensively both thanks to De Zerbi’s coaching and also the return of Bentancur looking like his old self.

However we still lacked that killer up top who can both finish half chances and fashion opportunities for himself and others. A top striker grabs us about 6-9 points on their own, an elite one like Kane grabbed us about 12-15, Richarlison and Solanke lose us about 6-9.

Striker definitely needed I agree. Solanke and Richie aren’t cutting it unless you want to be finishing 17th.
 
Don’t disagree with all of that but it’s clear De Zerbi fancies other than the ones he already had for their ball playing abilities.

I said a couple of times last season and the season before that that even prime maldini and Baresi would look exposed in Spurs team due to lack of control.
The primary issue with the last 2-3 seasons is we picked managers who seemed laser-focused on exposing our players' weaknesses: Ange was a terrible off the ball coach, while Frank was a terrible on the ball coach

The problem with both is they had our defensive line has been in the wrong place for yonks: under Ange it was far too high considering how easily our midfield could be bypassed so any ball over the top had Vicario fearing for his clean sheet bonus, under Frank it was too deep so completely nerfed the playmaking capabilities of Romero or Mickey Van and had the knock-on effect of our midfield having to drop deep to try and bridge the gap that we often saw Xavi play as a central midfielder
 
The question is this :

If you put the prevailing Spurs MF in front of
the back five of any club C that finished
above Spurs, how many more goals do you
think C would have conceded over the season ??

Loads.

People vastly underestimate how important midfield dominance is.

Look at how City collapse every time Rodri is injured. So many Liverpool fans criticised the determination to shoe-horn Wirtz into the team as it meant ceding control behind him. Chelsea's defence and GK are shockingly poor, but the presence of a Caicedo and Fernandez in midfield means they are still able to compete for Europe.
 
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Loads.

People vastly underestimate how important midfield dominance is.

Look at how City collapse every time Rodri is injured. So many Liverpool fans criticised the determination to shoe-horn Wirtz into the team as it meant ceding control behind him. Chelsea's defence and GK are shockingly poor, but the presence of a Caicedo and Fernandez in midfield means they are still able to compete for Europe.
We even saw it ourselves with Dembele and Wanyama/ Prime Dier.

Our defence and keeper were also superb but that midfield relieved about 40% of pressure on them every single game.
 
We even saw it ourselves with Dembele and Wanyama/ Prime Dier.

Our defence and keeper were also superb but that midfield relived about 40% of pressure on them every single game.

Yes and it allowed Rose and Walker to attack at will which also made us impossible to defend against because we always had a man over.

We could sign prime Buffon, Maldini, Beckenbauer, Moore and Cafu and we'd still struggle if what's in front of them is the quality of Gallagher, Sarr, Tel and Richarlison.
 
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We even saw it ourselves with Dembele and Wanyama/ Prime Dier.

Our defence and keeper were also superb but that midfield relieved about 40% of pressure on them every single game.
Ditto the Sandro/Dembele pivot in Villas-Boas' first season that allowed Bale to run amuck

Plonk that in front of our back four and Romero would be LARPing prime Modric
 
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We even saw it ourselves with Dembele and Wanyama/ Prime Dier.

Our defence and keeper were also superb but that midfield relieved about 40% of pressure on them every single game.

Though I cannot prove it, I do believe the
Dembele/Wanyama pairing was the sole
reason for the massive improvements in
the "season compass" GF/GA in 2016-17.
 
I've said this on our board, but getting Senesi, Roberton and van Hecke for a combined total of £52m is pretty good going. If you get Tonali on top of that (seems like it could realistically happen), then that is a bunch of very shrewd signings that should (in theory) have you competing for a European position.

Still think you need to improve your wingers and forwards (we also need to do the same), but considering the transfer window only officially opened on Monday, you must be pleased at how proactive you're being and the fact you're signing Premier League-proven talent.

Despite the back-to-back 17th placed finishes, I've said countless times that there's no way your squad is that bad. So with this in mind, the new signings, the manager and the fact you're playing one game a week, I see no reason why you can't aim for a top-7 spot.
 
I've said this on our board, but getting Senesi, Roberton and van Hecke for a combined total of £52m is pretty good going. If you get Tonali on top of that (seems like it could realistically happen), then that is a bunch of very shrewd signings that should (in theory) have you competing for a European position.

Still think you need to improve your wingers and forwards (we also need to do the same), but considering the transfer window only officially opened on Monday, you must be pleased at how proactive you're being and the fact you're signing Premier League-proven talent.

Despite the back-to-back 17th placed finishes, I've said countless times that there's no way your squad is that bad. So with this in mind, the new signings, the manager and the fact you're playing one game a week, I see no reason why you can't aim for a top-7 spot.
There’s a hell of a lot that still needs doing and whilst yes, I’m pleased per se at the way we’re now moving and very happy with the signings we’ve made so far, it’s more a case of “about ****ing time”. It shouldn’t have taken a horrendous January window and then survival on the final day of the season for this club to start acting its size/ flexing its muscle.
 
There’s a hell of a lot that still needs doing and whilst yes, I’m pleased per se at the way we’re now moving and very happy with the signings we’ve made so far, it’s more a case of “about ****ing time”. It shouldn’t have taken a horrendous January window and then survival on the final day of the season for this club to start acting its size/ flexing its muscle.
Yeah, I'm with you. Goes without saying how disgraceful your last two league campaigns in particular have been and it should never have taken you almost getting relegated for this proactiveness in the market to happen. But what's done is done now, you can only live in the present and so far, the early signs under this new regime are good.

Obviously, more is needed and you need players to gel, get used to the team, environment, what the manager is asking from them etc. But as a building block, it's pretty damn good going.
 
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