I agree with you but some people think it’s a deliberate thing rather than mistakes by officials and I expect the moans about officials to be even louder next season.
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I agree with you but some people think it’s a deliberate thing rather than mistakes by officials and I expect the moans about officials to be even louder next season.
Lower leagues have rejected VAR for next season
We still won't win a penalty.
I don't think you can make such a categoric statement. No VAR could affect the psyche of the referee, changing the outcome of any particular decision. VAR is in effect decision by committee and that is usually a compromise. All of which does not necessarily lead to better or even more accurate decisions. What it does do is spoil the flow of the game and the excitement around a goal. Football is not a game of exactitudes like snooker, tennis or even cricket. It's a contact sport and when two people come together both desiring a different outcome there will never be a precise measure of a decision, it's always a best guess. Technology does not resolve it it just adds another layer to what is still a judgement.
Spot on.
And ambiguous laws are impossible to enforce consistently too.
Which is why it should be used for black and white decisions only like offside although I realise there is the odd exception when deciding if a player is interfering.
They made the use of the hand from a goal scorer a black and white decision as well which helps with VAR.
Problem is as you say, the majority of decisions require a judgement call so instead of just the one person making that judgement, you’ve got 2 or 3 who all back each other up which leads to the inconsistencies and downright baffling decisions.
Where human judgement is involved, it will never be perfect.
Some of the laws of football need to be looked at as they’re bizarre
VAR would be so much better if it had a “common sense/ benefit of the doubt” ruling applied to it.
Football is about goals, it’s the currency of the game, it’s what fans want to see. So when VAR is required in a decision and they can’t tell the result within ten seconds because there’s about a toe’s difference either way - award the goal. Don’t rob fans and neutrals of what they want to see.
Football is about goals, it’s the currency of the game, it’s what fans want to see. So when VAR is required in a decision and they can’t tell the result within ten seconds because there’s about a toe’s difference either way - award the goal. Don’t rob fans and neutrals of what they want to see.
The obvious use of VAR is if somebody goes flying in the penalty area to check whether a player was fouled or whether it was a dive, which given play usually stops is such a straightforward call to make
And yet, somehow, this is rarely the case
Then the Laws ought to be clear and enforced. Helping the ref by using technology isn't the thing doing harm.
I think the problem is the laws can never be clear for most decisions. You’d have to apply the goal scoring handball law for defensive situations which would be ridiculous and fouls are always going to be subjective and influenced by other factors such as if it’s Romero or van dijk committing the potential offence.
Is two hands on the back always a foul or is it only when spurs do it?
Where subjectivity and humans are involved, it can never really be black and white.
As someone who watches most their football in a VAR free environment, I would say that being able to celebrate a goal with just a cursory glance at the 'lino' is a plus, as is not having to hang around waiting for a third party to agree with the ref. However the overall quality of officiating gets worse the further down the pyramid you go and whilst its true that the standard in the prem is at a low point this is actually true across the leagues as far as I can see, but given the choice I would always choose to watch live football without VAR
A large part of the issue is PGMOL is they give the impression of looking for an excuse not to give a goal (unless our defender is being shoved by Hugo Ekitike or Raul Jimenez...), or to put it in a slightly more trite way their attitude is something like "Is there a reason to rule out this goal?" instead of "Is there any reason why this goal shouldn't stand?" which sounds like the same question, but the framing makes it remarkably different
Also reminds me of the BBFC under James Ferman and their attitude of "If in doubt, cut" which made it necessary to draw up a spreadsheet to see which edit of the average giallo slasher I was buying off eBay...
I sort of agree but the Laws could be much clearer. They could define a push or a pull more clearly. They could also define a foul tackle much better. On the last one they used to do that but they messed it up in trying to clear up what was a yellow or a red card.
I really don't get this argument. If the goal was fairly scored then your celebration stands. If it wasn't, then what you seem to be saying is that you prefer to be given an unfairly scored goal to avoid spoiling your fun by properly disallowing it.
It's exactly that attitude from the players that leads to all the simulation that really spoils the game.
If the Laws started by saying that winning unfairly was improper and no cheating will be tolerated and also banned appealing and making any sort of comment or gesture towards the officials then that would make their job easier and possibly negate the need for VAR. If instead harsh retrospective punishment for cheating was permitted that might be a better alternative.
So every goal that has ever been disallowed by VAR was the definitely the correct decision was it? I was at the THFC stadium when H's goal v Sporting in the champions league was disallowed after a ridiculously long delay and no one to this day is certain that the right decision was made.
90% of goals are scored fairly but with VAR every one is scrutinised so you can never celebrate with certainty in that immediate moment, in the EFL you can, very few football fans are that bothered if they get away with one occasionally, and whilst I agree that if the game had integrity and honesty it would be easier to referee, but to say that simulation and basic cheating by players is somehow the same as fans stating like I have that we are not bothered if occassionally we get the rub of the green with a decision is a bit of s stretch. it will be interesting see which side of the fence a cross section of fans on here comes down on.
Var decreases the amount of mistakes though.
That’s what @PowerSpurs is saying and it’s true when you look at the data.
It will never be perfect but it’s better than not having it. Just need the people running the technology to be better and the laws of the game to be clearer in some aspects
Fair enough - It doesn't improve the match day experience as far as I am concerned, fortunately it won't be coming to league 2 anytime soon.
That completely misses the point. We are talking about fouls, physical fouls, not offsides or goal line decisions they can be absolute. Fouls have to be observed by the ref and he has to decide who did what to who and the severity of it. Even try to decide things like intent. This will always be a judgement and we have relied on the good faith of referees to make these judgements just as well as they can.
The simplest of these fouls, in theory, is handball. We could simply have a rule that the ball must not touch your hand and arm, but of course if you did that players would simply try to kick the ball onto an opponents arm. Judgement must be used to try to make the game fair. You cannot film intent. VAR just slows that process. We have to do what we have always done, trust that the ref is honest and abide by his decision.
And all of this is because the media loves to create controversy, it makes good tv. Fans will always doubt the ref when a decision goes against their team. They should be reminded that the game is impossible without the referee and just accept his good faith. Of course there will have been corruption, I think it's fair to say that most of that comes from the players, so if we go down the road of mistrusting refs we will lose the game.
It is nothing to do with mistrusting refs. It's just helping them out. Think back to the Thierry Henry handball that stopped Ireland qualifying for the World Cup. Everyone watching on TV saw that handball but none of the officials could. How is it better to reward cheating rather than allow the Ref to see a replay?
It does for me. I am much happier knowing that any goal we score has been checked and is legitimate. Sure there will still be mistakes but that's life.