The defensive errors have to stop!

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1950, certainly the point i was making is regarding our appetite for the match. the players seemed to show too much respect to arsenal. yes they are a very good side but my word there are better teams to come! it was possible to get at them, as morison showed and what frustrated me more than anything and certainly more than the individual errors was our lack of bite. for me, we rolled over a bit too easily and thats not the norwich i've come to expect under lambert's guidance. as i mentioned earlier, its hardly the end of the world and in respect of errors, of course we will continue to make them. we can't sign top notch defenders and neither can the majority of teams in the top flight. what we have is some good defenders, some good players who all work hard for each other. you only have to watch all the other teams to see them continuing to make mistakes as well, but don't be fooled - this was not a vintage arsenal team. a good team yes, a great team, nowhere near.
 
I would agree with most of the criticisms of the way we played on Saturday. I think part of the problem is that the two wide midfielders don't support the full backs sufficiently. If you look at how man city played utd, then the two wingers were always supporting their full backs, I think we need to be a little bit more compact in that area. If we bought anyone in Janaury, I'd like it be another central midfielder in the mould of Johnson.
 
that was certainly the case on saturday longsight but that was because hoolahan was played out wide. pilkington is not that keen on tracking back either so that left us open on both flanks. normally its ok cos johnson slots in to help tierney and bennett is terrific at tracking back - i think naughton missed him. tierney has done well this season but walcott (although not my favourite player) gave him a pretty torrid time. its the first time though that tierney has really looked out of his depth but he won't have to face that kind of quality every week. with pilks and hoolahan not tracking back it meant that crofts had to drop in to fill the holes but he isn't superman! arsenal moved the ball quickly and precisely and it was too much for our midfield who didn't give our full backs enough cover.
 
that's a good shout about De Laet 1950 <ok> he was injured for the gooners game though.

i think most of the comments on here know the quality of the opposition, and we are not deluded, moreso analysing our game so that we don't make the same mistakes against the teams we do need to beat at home, the wigans, bolton, QPR etc, if we wish to stay up.
you're right it's difficult to pinpoint what we have done wrong against a team who are on form, and that we are still learning the ins and outs of the league.
don't forget Martin's mistake was quite basic, he brought the ball out of defence, then instead of getting rid or passing, lost the ball.
 
Arsenal are a top side with the entire squad packed with internationals, saying we paid them to much respect is laughable.....
We haven`t had a clean sheet since Pompy but we have managed to score in most of our games.... Getting the balance right is very hard..
 
Arsenal fan in peace.
I watched the game Sat and can tell you that you caused enough problems to survive in the Premier lge.
As everyone knows we had a shocking start and have gradually been showing some form and I felt our performance against you was possibly our best performance of the season, so you can count yourslef unlucky to have come up against us when you did, had you played us 2 months ago I'm sure the result would have been very different.

As for defensive mistakes I agree with comment #45, we have quality throughout and you are not going to go an entire 90 mins without feeling some pressure.
The biggest defensive error of course came from Mert and you capitalised, and given the times us, Chelsea and Man Utd have looked exposed this season you really shouldn't beat yourselves us because opposition are creating chances.

Good luck for the rest of the season, the league needs teams like Norwich
 
supernorwich23 said:
Arsenal are a top side with the entire squad packed with internationals, saying we paid them to much respect is laughable.....
We haven`t had a clean sheet since Pompy but we have managed to score in most of our games.... Getting the balance right is very hard..
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why is it laughable? thats exactly what happened. we backed off, backed off, backed off... if you give quality players time and space they WILL tear you to shreds. we should have been in their faces from the start, harrying them - but we just didn't - not at any stage during the 90 minutes.

too. much. respect.
 
Grizzly said:
Arsenal fan in peace.
I watched the game Sat and can tell you that you caused enough problems to survive in the Premier lge.
As everyone knows we had a shocking start and have gradually been showing some form and I felt our performance against you was possibly our best performance of the season, so you can count yourslef unlucky to have come up against us when you did, had you played us 2 months ago I'm sure the result would have been very different.

As for defensive mistakes I agree with comment #45, we have quality throughout and you are not going to go an entire 90 mins without feeling some pressure.
The biggest defensive error of course came from Mert and you capitalised, and given the times us, Chelsea and Man Utd have looked exposed this season you really shouldn't beat yourselves us because opposition are creating chances.

Good luck for the rest of the season, the league needs teams like Norwich
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its not really a case of being upset because we lost to arsenal, its a case of being disappointed that we never played anywhere near the standards we have set for ourselves in the past two seasons. as i've said, arsenal are a good side but that doesn't mean we can't compete for the ball. we made it too easy with our slack passing and backing off in midfield. i don't expect us to beat arsenal; i don't even expect a draw, but i do expect my team to get the basics right on the pitch and a number of our team fell short on saturday. the score line may have been close but the contest wasn't.
 
It`s like a boy racer in an old XR3i against a new Porshe, we don`t have the players who can catch Theo or Gervinho ..... Russ lost the ball in the centre circle and they countered us at pace ,then V Persie finishes sublimely......
They have better players, getting in their faces only gets you so far.....
 
How many teams play with two out-and-out strikers nowadays? Hardly any of them, certainly not the successful ones anyway. The days of the out-and-out striker are gone and the current tactical evolution has seen and influx of attacking midefielders - players like Silva, Mata, Van der Vaart, Nani, Kuyt, Bellamy, Modric, Gervinho, Walcott, Young, Kalou, Ben Arfa, Hoolahan,etc etc - who's job it is to support to forward player and drop back into midfield when the opposition has the ball.

I think this evolution over the past decade (probably since Mourinho's entrance on the Premiership scene) is the reason Michael Owen's career stalled as there no longer became room in the first XI for the luxury of a player who hangs around the six-yard box the whole game, and is the reason Simeon Jackson is finding it hard to break into our squad right now. Ten years ago he'd have been up front alongside Holt or Mozza in a bing man, little man combo, but nobody plays that formation any more, particularly since the holding defensive midfielder role became such a big part - again, thanks to Mr.Mourinho and the Makalele effect.

As 1950 states, if we lined up with 2 up top against the likes of Arsenal we'd get completely mullered andoverrun in midfield, like we did against Villa when we started with Bradley Johnson as our only what you'd call proper central midfielder.
 
supernorwich23 said:
It`s like a boy racer in an old XR3i against a new Porshe, we don`t have the players who can catch Theo or Gervinho ..... Russ lost the ball in the centre circle and they countered us at pace ,then V Persie finishes sublimely......
They have better players, getting in their faces only gets you so far.....
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yes but they only scored from that position because of an elementary mistake from our player when there was absolutely NO danger at all. shame for martin as he was by far our best player on the day. get in there faces when they have the ball, not when we have it!! <laugh>
 
Sid_Smooth_Munky_Canary said:
How many teams play with two out-and-out strikers nowadays? Hardly any of them, certainly not the successful ones anyway. The days of the out-and-out striker are gone and the current tactical evolution has seen and influx of attacking midefielders - players like Silva, Mata, Van der Vaart, Nani, Kuyt, Bellamy, Modric, Gervinho, Walcott, Young, Kalou, Ben Arfa, Hoolahan,etc etc - who's job it is to support to forward player and drop back into midfield when the opposition has the ball.

I think this evolution over the past decade (probably since Mourinho's entrance on the Premiership scene) is the reason Michael Owen's career stalled as there no longer became room in the first XI for the luxury of a player who hangs around the six-yard box the whole game, and is the reason Simeon Jackson is finding it hard to break into our squad right now. Ten years ago he'd have been up front alongside Holt or Mozza in a bing man, little man combo, but nobody plays that formation any more, particularly since the holding defensive midfielder role became such a big part - again, thanks to Mr.Mourinho and the Makalele effect.

As 1950 states, if we lined up with 2 up top against the likes of Arsenal we'd get completely mullered andoverrun in midfield, like we did against Villa when we started with Bradley Johnson as our only what you'd call proper central midfielder.
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munky, i agree but i'm not suggesting for one minute we should play two up front against the likes of arsenal. indeed, jackson has played in behind the striker before and that is where i'd play him in home games rather than hoolahan on current form - give him a try, we don't know if his pace will make a difference. whenever he comes on he looks sharp! we don't have to play exactly the same system for every game!! villa is a bad example though because holt and morison don't seem to work together, maybe a bit too similar. i like the way we set up away from home generally with the five man midfield which can quickly become three up front. its probably the best system we can play to utilise our best players but at home i don't believe we have found the best way to play yet so try something else.
 
Wasn't at the game, but from the commentary and MOTD it seemed to me that Tierney and Naughton weren't given much help by those in front of them. I don't think you can expect Tierney to play Walcott out of the game single-handedly, likewise Naughton faced by Gervinho AND Santos. I thought Bennett should have started, or been brought on much earlier. That would have stopped Santos marauding forward all the time, and in previous games he, Bennett, has tracked back well. Maybe in reality it wasn't like that, but that's certainly the impression I got. And who was supposed to help out poor Tierney?
 
robbieBB said:
Wasn't at the game, but from the commentary and MOTD it seemed to me that Tierney and Naughton weren't given much help by those in front of them. I don't think you can expect Tierney to play Walcott out of the game single-handedly, likewise Naughton faced by Gervinho AND Santos. I thought Bennett should have started, or been brought on much earlier. That would have stopped Santos marauding forward all the time, and in previous games he, Bennett, has tracked back well. Maybe in reality it wasn't like that, but that's certainly the impression I got. And who was supposed to help out poor Tierney?
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you've got it bang on mate <ok>

lambert doesn't make many mistakes, in fact, hardly any, but i think he got the starting line up wrong on saturday.
 
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