Match Day Thread Spuds v LFC
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So my joke about them visiting Riyadh or Jeddah was’t far off geographically…
And before I retire to bed, just one last observation - anyone noticing the fact that since the return of Howard Webb to the PGMOL Liverpool have had four players sent off in seven games, and also the total debacle of the Diaz disallowed goal, should also really consider this fact: Howard Melton Webb became a serving officer of South Yorkshire Police not long after Hillsborough in 1989. If there's one thing I'd love FSG to do, even more than buying Mbappe, it is to use their money and access to the best international lawyers to find how deep the (masonic?) roots go on this one.
Goodnight.
Goodnight.
Gary Neville hits out at Liverpool over ‘dangerous’ statement on VAR mistake
Gary Neville hits out at Liverpool over 'dangerous' VAR statement | Football | Metro News
Gary Neville hits out at Liverpool over 'dangerous' VAR statement | Football | Metro News
a typical rat.
you will not his tune is rapidly changing as the rolexes roll in.
100% a red for Jones now according to him after all his live talk Saturday.
you can buy anyone in the prem.
Gary Neville can **** off with his criticism of Liverpool's statement.
We know that Saturday's result won't be changed. But the times where admissions of fault and match suspensions for the guilty officials were acceptable are long gone
While I personally will always stop short of accusations of corruption specifically against us (despite compelling evidence) or for certain clubs, there's enough evidence out there now to be sure that referees have an inherent agenda of valuing self preservation over doing what is right, and it's time for clubs to start calling out this behaviour for what it is.
There's no other walk of life where an institution that polices itself works in practice, and clearly PGMOL are no different.
We know that Saturday's result won't be changed. But the times where admissions of fault and match suspensions for the guilty officials were acceptable are long gone
While I personally will always stop short of accusations of corruption specifically against us (despite compelling evidence) or for certain clubs, there's enough evidence out there now to be sure that referees have an inherent agenda of valuing self preservation over doing what is right, and it's time for clubs to start calling out this behaviour for what it is.
There's no other walk of life where an institution that polices itself works in practice, and clearly PGMOL are no different.
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They've all had a literal seizure that LFC might "explore option" and insta turn for fear of what happens to the "show"
LFC might just be talking to other prem clubs to have a premier league ruling at the next meeting to force a change here.
theres lots of "options" to pursue.
BTW, same old rats protecting status quo.
LFC might just be talking to other prem clubs to have a premier league ruling at the next meeting to force a change here.
theres lots of "options" to pursue.
BTW, same old rats protecting status quo.
There was a massive debate on replaying that game and, if memory serves me right, it only got replayed because Arsenal agreed to it. Plus it was a one-off cup game where arsenal were massive favourites to win so would have been confident of winning the replay too.
As much as we don't like Spurs, is not their fault and it wouldn't be fair on them to repay it or remove points etc
Replay is not the answer, I think all the officials involved should be reprimanded and suspended indefinitely .Also, those officials that went to referee in Saudi Arabia must not referee in the premier league again.
There's not going to be a replay. There won't be any other sanctions other than the officials involved will miss some games.
The full review will find nothing, they already came to the conclusion of human error within minutes of the game ending. Its a farce, but nothing will change.
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Don’t like how this has all gone.
Look refs cock up. Anyone can do it. Did they do it on purpose? I’m not jumping on any conspiracy that there’s any kind of agenda against any particular clubs. Maybe there is maybe there isn’t. But all fans think **** decisions go against them and go for their rivals or the bigger clubs.
Is there a quality issue with the referees? Maybe. Do they make 100’s of decisions a game and the vast majority of them correct? Yes.
Do players ever make mistakes? Absolutely.
Does anyone ever make mistakes in their job? Absolutely.
Are the rules these days way too complicated? 100%
If you start sacking referees for making genuine mistakes then it’s a really slippery slope. Where do you get more from? Promote from efl? What if they make a mistake, you soon run out of referees.
Look refs cock up. Anyone can do it. Did they do it on purpose? I’m not jumping on any conspiracy that there’s any kind of agenda against any particular clubs. Maybe there is maybe there isn’t. But all fans think **** decisions go against them and go for their rivals or the bigger clubs.
Is there a quality issue with the referees? Maybe. Do they make 100’s of decisions a game and the vast majority of them correct? Yes.
Do players ever make mistakes? Absolutely.
Does anyone ever make mistakes in their job? Absolutely.
Are the rules these days way too complicated? 100%
If you start sacking referees for making genuine mistakes then it’s a really slippery slope. Where do you get more from? Promote from efl? What if they make a mistake, you soon run out of referees.
I'm not one for conspiracy theories, there would have to be solid evidence for me to entertain the idea - but we're all subject to personal prejudices and it's not beyond the bounds of possibility that biases come into play against certain clubs or individuals.
Klopp probably pisses off a lot of officials because he's constantly giving them earache - would this lead to them happily giving him one back? Maybe - you'd like to believe they're professional enough to be above that, but they're only human.
I must stress that I don't think that's what happened with the offside - I think that was rank incompetence - but neither do I think "Soz - we made a mistake" is good enough.
Officials not only have to be clean, they have to be seen to be clean - anything that allows even a whiff of the possibility of corruption is detrimental to the game and has to be cleared up.
There needs to be an independent review body constantly looking at the standard of refereeing because sitting in judgement on themselves isn't good enough, especially as they've made it clear that they will close ranks to protect each other rather than make the correct decision.
I think there's a strong element of that in Saturday's shambolic events.
Everyone involved in football should be working together to make the game the best it can be - ultimately they're all on the same side, this us v them attitude is destructive.
Klopp probably pisses off a lot of officials because he's constantly giving them earache - would this lead to them happily giving him one back? Maybe - you'd like to believe they're professional enough to be above that, but they're only human.
I must stress that I don't think that's what happened with the offside - I think that was rank incompetence - but neither do I think "Soz - we made a mistake" is good enough.
Officials not only have to be clean, they have to be seen to be clean - anything that allows even a whiff of the possibility of corruption is detrimental to the game and has to be cleared up.
There needs to be an independent review body constantly looking at the standard of refereeing because sitting in judgement on themselves isn't good enough, especially as they've made it clear that they will close ranks to protect each other rather than make the correct decision.
I think there's a strong element of that in Saturday's shambolic events.
Everyone involved in football should be working together to make the game the best it can be - ultimately they're all on the same side, this us v them attitude is destructive.
If this kind of error happened in a pharmaceutical company and lead to harm to a person they would have regulators all over them. There would be a hard deadline with actions and responsibility that would nee dot be completed.
The absolute bare minimum requirement is to update the procedures here for ALL checks with the referee required (like rugby) to clearly state the on field decision
I would expect the following:
1. If a ref "misses" an even then VAR MUST inform him via headset and ref must confirm he missed the event.
2. If the ref has decided it is not a foul, pen, whatever then they must at worst signal that an event took place and was reviewed for no action at the next break in play. This signal MUST be clear to all involved. the referee must state the onfield decision CLEARLY
3. If VAR felt it was a clear issue then they must ask him to stop the game. Just like a head injury.
4. The ref must, if missing an event, or asked to stop the game review said event on the screen. everyone should have access to listen to that discussion and review. the procedure should begin from the onfield decision as clearly communicated and weigh the evidence then make a clear decision.
5. in the case of offside a similar process must be engaged with where the referee must state the decision clearly as Goal award or goal disallowed and the review should take no more than 1 minute. any longer and it is too close to call. I don't believe in the lines and they have ruined any sort of objectivity here by fiddling between which shot they feel like taking to marry up with the shot of the ball being kicked. I am still in favour of a review system for managers to call these and keep var out of it. If a player really thinks he is on the review. if they know they are kind off off you can actually usually tell.
In short the time for hiding behind private mikes is over IMO. They have proven themselves in capable of having a clear process and are seeking to hide. If a ref can speak to a crowd in the women's world cup then every conversation can be heard like.
90% of football decisions are subjective. We need a clear process to deal with missed events, wrong decisions and determination of the balance of probabilities.
Is it a pen or not? thats subjective.
Knowing you ****ed it then doing nothing about it is not acceptable. thats a wilful and deliberate act that merits sanction and darren england should be sacked over it.
The absolute bare minimum requirement is to update the procedures here for ALL checks with the referee required (like rugby) to clearly state the on field decision
I would expect the following:
1. If a ref "misses" an even then VAR MUST inform him via headset and ref must confirm he missed the event.
2. If the ref has decided it is not a foul, pen, whatever then they must at worst signal that an event took place and was reviewed for no action at the next break in play. This signal MUST be clear to all involved. the referee must state the onfield decision CLEARLY
3. If VAR felt it was a clear issue then they must ask him to stop the game. Just like a head injury.
4. The ref must, if missing an event, or asked to stop the game review said event on the screen. everyone should have access to listen to that discussion and review. the procedure should begin from the onfield decision as clearly communicated and weigh the evidence then make a clear decision.
5. in the case of offside a similar process must be engaged with where the referee must state the decision clearly as Goal award or goal disallowed and the review should take no more than 1 minute. any longer and it is too close to call. I don't believe in the lines and they have ruined any sort of objectivity here by fiddling between which shot they feel like taking to marry up with the shot of the ball being kicked. I am still in favour of a review system for managers to call these and keep var out of it. If a player really thinks he is on the review. if they know they are kind off off you can actually usually tell.
In short the time for hiding behind private mikes is over IMO. They have proven themselves in capable of having a clear process and are seeking to hide. If a ref can speak to a crowd in the women's world cup then every conversation can be heard like.
90% of football decisions are subjective. We need a clear process to deal with missed events, wrong decisions and determination of the balance of probabilities.
Is it a pen or not? thats subjective.
Knowing you ****ed it then doing nothing about it is not acceptable. thats a wilful and deliberate act that merits sanction and darren england should be sacked over it.
Like in any workplace, mistakes happen, but the process used to resolving them can usually lead to contention if the resolution isn't satisfactory.
If you break down their explanation, you have the original mistake of not paying attention, compounded by a communication mistake, and rounded off by rules that are archaic for this type of situation. This all needs to be reviewed to avoid similar instances.
That is of course if you believe the explanation, but it doesnt add up as the last issue implies that VAR again aren't communicating or paying attention
If you break down their explanation, you have the original mistake of not paying attention, compounded by a communication mistake, and rounded off by rules that are archaic for this type of situation. This all needs to be reviewed to avoid similar instances.
That is of course if you believe the explanation, but it doesnt add up as the last issue implies that VAR again aren't communicating or paying attention
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We've had a 'genuine mistake' against us already this season in the MacAllister sending-off. We accepted it. I also accept that Wolves against us last season, and Jota kicking a Spurs player in the head and not getting sent off (and Kane not getting sent off for the Robbo assault) are 'mistakes' by VAR - criticisable, but mistakes. This is another dimension.
Not saying at all that we should replay the game, have points re-instated, or those straw man arguments the likes of Jonathon Liew and Chris Sutton are using their platforms to deflect for the PGMOL. But their excuses are falling to bits - something else than a mere cock-up went on, or they wouldn't be going to these palpably false extremes to cover-up their obvious lies. That's the conspiracy theory - why are they so obviously lying? And they are. The resolution is not just about England as an individual (though how people paid as much as brain surgeons can not know which way a decision they're reviewing went, and then be held accountable for that is ****ing bizarre), but about not accepting a fobbed -off, corporate 'apology'.
When Virgil was eviscerated by Pickford with no punishment it took three months (and no apology whatsoever) for Michael, Golden-Boy Oliver to slip out an half-arsed explanation in the S*n (that he knew most of would not read) about "Erm, yes, we, er, you know, got the procedure a bit mixed-up there. Silly us! Oh well, we're all human, and it was only the Scouse victims who complained, chortle, chortle". They can **** off if they think that will suffice this time. We want the tapes - and, certainly imo, the head of former SYP officer Howard Melton Webb's head on a ****ing stick.
that's not actually the case.
Yes its a mistake, on top of a now shown to be insufficient protocol but it is a then wilful decision having spotted the error to not fix it.
The fact that they knew they made the error and kept it to themselves while the game concluded (holland and england) means that they have brought the game and integrity into disrepute. It is in my view far more serious than a mouthy player or manager.
I don't know many that
a) want a game replayed
b) want some sort of redress in terms of points
c) a meaningless apology.
The only resolution for future is refs knows if they **** round and cheat (which is exactly what they did post mistake) then they get fired.
Is there a rule that states VAR cannot intervene after the game has restarted? If so, then that is something that an investigation and a review needs to change.
If not, then England's failure to speak up is incomprehensible.
If not, then England's failure to speak up is incomprehensible.