Off Topic Politics Thread

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Just the Washington Post:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/interactive/2021/pandora-papers-offshore-finance/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2021/10/03/offshore-companies-trusts-pandora-papers/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/inve...99bfa2-12d3-11e6-81b4-581a5c4c42df_story.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2021/10/03/takeaways-pandora-papers/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2021/10/03/about-pandora-papers-investigation/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...336ef0-26c6-11ec-8739-5cb6aba30a30_story.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/interactive/2022/tax-havens-wyoming-pandora-papers/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2021/10/03/pandora-papers-investigation-reaction/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/10/04/pandora-papers-shows-us-rise-secretive-tax-haven/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/inve...467e9a-fd9f-11e5-886f-a037dba38301_story.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/life...305838-fc0c-11e5-886f-a037dba38301_story.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...88582e-fcf8-11e5-813a-90ab563f0dde_story.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/interactive/2022/tax-havens-wyoming-pandora-papers/

There's a whole lot more than that, it's just the first two pages of a Google search. And there are a lot of articles because WaPo is one of the news orgs that were actually sifting through the documents and releasing information to the public.
 
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Osvaldorama said:
For those saying I’m crazy for thinking that the media shapes narratives and what people should be outraged by…

The final batch of the Panama papers just dropped. Many rich and wealthy people caught in tax evasion and fraud.

Have you heard a peep about it anywhere?
Click to expand...

I mean there’s absolutely loads of reporting on the Panama/Pandora Papers, even in your favourite paper, the Washington Post.

Are you talking about the latest ‘drop’ three days ago? Just to get this straight, do you think that these owners get on the phone to the editors of the publications, who then get on the phone to the journalists and say “yeah, we’re not running anything about the Pandora Papers because Bob has asked us not to”.

Honestly, is that how you think a newsroom works?
 
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Archers Road said:
And the Tories are getting wiped out across London. Different story in the North and Midlands though. Strange times.
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Looks like a lot of areas are still mostly voting on Brexit lines.

That’s not to say Brexit is the main reason people are voting anymore but the way it redrew the political map is largely sticking.
 
PS - the reason you won’t see an awful lot regarding the ‘latest drop’, is actually far simpler and less nefarious

“President of Gabon uses offshore accounts in BVI to help with tax” isn’t a story. Nobody, other than the unfailingly paranoid, gives too many ****s.
 
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Osvaldorama said:
For those saying I’m crazy for thinking that the media shapes narratives and what people should be outraged by…

The final batch of the Panama papers just dropped. Many rich and wealthy people caught in tax evasion and fraud.

Have you heard a peep about it anywhere?
Click to expand...
Of course not ….. what about the Tory peer who’s place was raided by the Met over allegations of corruption in money paid for PPE? Nope - haven’t heard anything about that either :emoticon-0121-angry
 
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Shandy_top_89 said:
Looks like a lot of areas are still mostly voting on Brexit lines.

That’s not to say Brexit is the main reason people are voting anymore but the way it redrew the political map is largely sticking.
Click to expand...


Brexit is probably still a factor, along with resentment about these mythical Metropolitan Elites I keep hearing about. The Tories have tapped in to the small 'c' social conservatism of a lot of former Labour strongholds.
 
Le Tissier's Laces said:
Just to get this straight, do you think that these owners get on the phone to the editors of the publications, who then get on the phone to the journalists and say “yeah, we’re not running anything about the Pandora Papers because Bob has asked us not to”.

Honestly, is that how you think a newsroom works?
Click to expand...

To be honest I thought that is how some work. The ones owned by the big players may have a discussion in their newsroom to not run a story due to the owners?

Genuine question.
 
 
This highlights the need for a strategic alliance leading to PR. FPTP is responsible for the inept shambles that is the current incumbents.
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StJabbo1 said:
This highlights the need for a strategic alliance leading to PR. FPTP is responsible for the inept shambles that is the current incumbents.
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Click to expand...
Surely SNP will be big blockers to PR unless the offer is to give them an IndyRef2. Because they stand to lose massively from PR

No election under the current system is going to return a majority that would vote for PR even if by some miracle all of labour suddenly realised it was the only chance they have
 
Archers Road said:
Brexit is probably still a factor, along with resentment about these mythical Metropolitan Elites I keep hearing about. The Tories have tapped in to the small 'c' social conservatism of a lot of former Labour strongholds.
Click to expand...

Because “small c” social conservatism is a far far bigger thing in this country than most, especially Labour, seem to really appreciate

Anecdotally there are a lot of people who have been very left leaning economically for a long time who are far more socially conservative.

To varying degrees of course. But you don’t get people who switch from Labour to UKIP (a few years ago of course) for no reason. Or people who should be from working class US heartlands switching from Democrats to Donald Trump and the Republicans

And the narratives linked to the “culture wars” has only reinforced that for many. Many traditional labour voters will not march in lockstep behind some of their social policies. People can mock or deride the ideas of the “anti-woke” crowd. But that is a mistake. 2016 should tell people that.

A mistake seems to be made on the left in that you apparently have to embrace all aspects of the left

Tony Blair said something relatively recently about a Labour Party with no place for JK Rowling, Trevor Phillips and Sara Khan (I’m not sure who the latter is) is not one that will be electorally appealing. I find it hard to disagree with that statement. Whether or not you like what that statement actually means about the voters in this country is somewhat besides the point. There are some things where just shouting over people is not going to make any difference

I remember thinking ages ago about the cultural / social issues in the US. It might well have been as far back as the big wave against Obama. It seems a lot of it was based on this idea that the democrats and more left leaning people thought “this issue is settled. The culture war is over. We have won”. But that view was not shared by the republicans as we can see with the leaked abortion ruling 50 years after Roe vs Wade. Which was never codified into law apparently - although I will admit to not understanding what that means and what attempts there were (if any) to even try this.
 
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As to these local elections - there have been elections that have already baked in any “anti Tory settlement”

If you want media spin how about the idea that the media has been playing up the idea of real concerns for the Tory party so that they can crow triumphantly when they inevitably aren’t routed due to :

- anti-Tory sentiment already baked in
- not all areas having elections
- some naturally very safe areas where there could be big swings against them and they still win

I’m not sure the headlines where ever going to be what some anti-Tory people hoped. What the detail behind the numbers in the coming days says though might reveal more
 
Gregm1988 said:
Surely SNP will be big blockers to PR unless the offer is to give them an IndyRef2. Because they stand to lose massively from PR

No election under the current system is going to return a majority that would vote for PR even if by some miracle all of labour suddenly realised it was the only chance they have
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I wonder if that referendum will have been taken by the next election? It'll be fought tooth and nail. If Labour don't go for an alliance then I see them as perpetual losers, although agent Johnson appears to be doing his best to scupper the tories.
 
What these local elections are showing is that Labour have a hell of a lot of work to do if they are going to topple the Tories at the next general election. Outside of London, people are voting for the Lib Dems or Green ahead of Labour. Which plays right into Tory hands.
 
Gregm1988 said:
As to these local elections - there have been elections that have already baked in any “anti Tory settlement”

If you want media spin how about the idea that the media has been playing up the idea of real concerns for the Tory party so that they can crow triumphantly when they inevitably aren’t routed due to :

- anti-Tory sentiment already baked in
- not all areas having elections
- some naturally very safe areas where there could be big swings against them and they still win

I’m not sure the headlines where ever going to be what some anti-Tory people hoped. What the detail behind the numbers in the coming days says though might reveal more
Click to expand...
Lib Dems and Greens doing well to, too much big two talk.
 
thereisonlyoneno7 said:
To be honest I thought that is how some work. The ones owned by the big players may have a discussion in their newsroom to not run a story due to the owners?

Genuine question.
Click to expand...

Not really, and certainly not a story of any significance. Think about it - if there was a significant story about Murdoch, and The Times/The Sun suppressed it in terms of their reporting, then that’s manna from heaven for the other publications, and that suppression becomes an extra story in itself.
 
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tomw24 said:
What these local elections are showing is that Labour have a hell of a lot of work to do if they are going to topple the Tories at the next general election. Outside of London, people are voting for the Lib Dems or Green ahead of Labour. Which plays right into Tory hands.
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Ignoring the fact that in many, many seats where the Lib Dems were the best challenge to the Tories, Labour didn’t even stand. Mendip Hills, my ward, being an example of this.
 
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